Russia Declares War on Ukraine<<MOD WARNING>>

Wait a minute... Righty have been posting all day that the reason russia attacked Ukraine was because they took Nato as a threat when that never was really in the cards, yet Trump sending Javellin missiles wasn't somehow threatening to the russians, and didn't provoke today war?!?... Heck, there's a point to be made that Trump may be the ultimate cause for this invasion then... Thanks righties!

 

This is right up there with their "Putin only attacked because Biden is weak . . . But also Biden should do nothing" excuses

 

Not sure that all Ukranians will fight their homes. Looks like they are running away from Ukraine to Poland according to Reuters:
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...sions-pets-ukrainians-flee-poland-2022-02-24/

 

I keep hearing that Americans don't want to be involved in another war. Well, I'd like to know what those Americans think will make a difference at this point. Short of NATO repelling Russia militarily, I don't see anything stopping Russia using their toys to blow up a lot of Ukrainian infrastructure and flood more troops into Ukraine.

It's very sad to see us back in 1939 with an isolationist United States that claims to uphold democratic values but doesn't want to make any sacrifices and won't take the action required to stop a fascist invasion of a democratic country.

 

Biden predicted a limited incursion. I do not recall any on the right denying that Russia would invade.

"

Yes, historically, mobilizations on borders often leads quickly to war.

“1914

June 28, 1914 - Archduke Franz Ferdinand, heir to the Austrian throne, and his wife, visit Sarajevo in Bosnia. A bomb is thrown at their auto but misses. Undaunted, they continue their visit only to be shot and killed a short time later by a lone assassin. Believing the assassin to be a Serbian nationalist, the Austrians target their anger toward Serbia.
July 23, 1914 - Austria-Hungary, with the backing of Germany, delivers an ultimatum to Serbia. The Serbs propose arbitration as a way to resolve dispute, but also begin mobilization of their troops.
July 25, 1914 - Austria-Hungary severs diplomatic ties with Serbia and begins to mobilize its troops.
July 26, 1914 - Britain attempts to organize a political conference among the major European powers to resolve the dispute between Austria-Hungary and Serbia. France and Italy agree to participate. Russia then agrees, but Germany refuses.
July 28, 1914 - The Austro-Hungarian Empire declares war on Serbia.
July 29, 1914 - Britain calls for international mediation to resolve the worsening crisis. Russia urges German restraint, but the Russians begin partial troop mobilization as a precaution. The Germans then warn Russia on its mobilization and begin to mobilize themselves.
July 30, 1914 - Austrian warships bombard Belgrade, capital of Serbia.
July 31, 1914 - Reacting to the Austrian attack on Serbia, Russia begins full mobilization of its troops. Germany demands that it stop.
August 1, 1914 - Germany declares war on Russia. France and Belgium begin full mobilization.
August 3, 1914 - Germany declares war on France, and invades neutral Belgium. Britain then sends an ultimatum, rejected by the Germans, to withdraw from Belgium.
August 4, 1914 - Great Britain declares war on Germany. The declaration is binding on all Dominions within the British Empire including Canada, Australia, New Zealand, India and South Africa.
August 4, 1914 - The United States declares its neutrality.
August 4-16, 1914 - The Siege of Liege occurs as Germans attack the Belgian fortress city but meet resistance from Belgian troops inside the Liege Forts. The twelve forts surrounding the city are then bombarded into submission by German and Austrian howitzers using high explosive shells. Remaining Belgian troops then retreat northward toward Antwerp as the German westward advance continues.
August 6, 1914 - The Austro-Hungarian Empire declares war on Russia."
THE HISTORY PLACE, World War I, 1914: War Erupts.
https://www.historyplace.com/worldhistory/firstworldwar/index-1914.html "

The question to answer now: When is a preemptive strike justified?

Given what has happened would Ukraine have been able to justify a preemptive strike against the Russian invasion force?

 

That limited incursion was in regard to the russian declaration of independance of the two region. It changed to a full blown invasion when troops were redeployed in Bellarus and Crimea.

 

I just heard there are at least 3,000 dead Russian troops in Kharkiv!
Good job Ukraine!

RUCK FUSSIA!

 

How many divisions do the Oligarchs command?

 

So, it would have been better if Trump has just sent "pillows and sheets"?

 

My point, as expressed in that post early on was that the massive mobilization on Ukraine's border was obviously preparation for the conquest of Ukraine.

Everyone, including Biden and the Ukrainian leaders who refused to see that were either ignoring history or ignorant of it.

 

Or they didn't want to cause pannick and hope that talking about it would prevent putin from acting...

 

1. Limit Russia's ability to do business in dollars, euros, pounds and yen to be part of the global economy.
2. Stop the ability to finance and grow the Russian military.
3. Impair their ability to compete in high-tech 21st century economy.
4. US sanctioned Russian banks that together hold around $1 trillion in assets.

He added, "we're also blocking four more major banks. That means every asset they have in America will be frozen."

 

I believe Putin is knowing what he's doing when he went to send Russia to invade Ukraine. Donald Trump praises Vladimir Putin for this and Trump is insane, Putin is not. Putin is a mean one and will do what he can to get what he wants. I would not be surprised if He gets Ukraine to merge with Russia and There may or will be other former Soviet nations to follow. Putin wants to bring back the Soviet Union (USSR). That may be an end to Democracy as we know it. It will be a dictatorship everywhere and no escape from it. We are dealing with a mean one that was once associated with the KGB at one time or another. What happens from here remains to be seen.

 

Putin would have had dissent if he didn't do something to protect the people in Donbass from genocide. Anyway Russia is well prepared for anything that can be thrown on them, but are we? Putin said Russia's retaliation will hurt, but not just on the EU, but on us as well.

 

Like I said...go all in!.....Nato waits?

 

Took its crew!!!

Jeez....I wouldn't be sympathetic at all!

 

Thank you, Baghdad Bob.

 

Ironic. You are cheerleading the aggressor in this case.

 

They are probably right. Biden sent troops to the NATO countries and threatened to bring Ukraine into NATO. IOW, saber rattling without a saber.

Biden has had years to give Ukraine a credible defensive capability. Instead Biden sends a few troops beyond the pale in a show of total ineffectual weakness.

Trump was the first President to do anything but participate in the disarming of Ukraine.

Stupid and weak is as Stupid and weak does.
1. Afghanistan
2. Ukraine
3. Taiwan?

 

It was time to panic. The only rational move Ukraine had left was a preemptive strike against the invasion force as it assembled. But then they may not have had the capability of doing anything at all.

 

YW....paid Potemkin agent.

 

They never threaten to bring Ukraine to Nato. They said it was the decision of Ukrainian to make if they wanted to join. It doesn't mean it would've been accepted.

Any considerable deployment of US troops in countries close to Russia would have been prematured and an incitement for Putin to act even faster. The goal was to not have a shooting war with russia.

1. Afghanistan: Trump removed the troops too fast.
2- Ukraine: No defense treaty and not member of Nato
3- Taiwan: A vague promise to help them keep their independance, but the mutual defense pact died in 1980. Each election bring unification with China closer and closer.

 

And you guys are cheering a country held in the grip of neo-Nazis and other assorted extremist trash.

 

It didn't have the strenght to do it. That's like asking Canada to preemtively attack the USA. Fastest way for an army to die.