Did the lockdowns work?

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by Greenleft, Dec 7, 2022.

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  1. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    No you have not. I am calling you out. Your data did not show what you claimed it does. Stop the false misrepresentations.

    Death rates caused by adverse reactions to the vaccine is the issue and you are falsely inferring the vaccines caused and therefore increased the death rates. That is the issue I challenged and you try deflect from because you can't provide data to show death rate as a result of the vaccine went off the cliff as you call it.

    As for Omicron the data does not show people who took the Omicron vaccine died because of the Omicron. It shows they died coincidentally, i.e., they would have died anyways from other illnesses.

    As more and more people have taken the vaccines, they will continue to die. You have no friggin clue what causes their deaths. You just assume if they have had a vaccine and they die, its the vaccine that did it.

    You want to continue with the bullshit? Provide morality rates attributed to adverse effects from the vaccine.

    For that matter can you even find data of someone who died because of Covid 19 at any time?

    You even know the difference between a cause of death from a vaccine, a Covid 19 virus strain, or a pre-existing or coincidental condition that would have killed the person whether they took the vaccine or not. Does your data show that. Of course it does not. You haven't a clue what you present.

    You have a preconceived belief, repeat it and throw out data that does not even support it and you have no clue how to engage quantitative analysis, extrapolation of patterns of increase or decrease in numbers and cause and effect let alone causal linkage.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  2. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    I would bet my mortgage that the cost of supplimenting hospitals and expanding triage and training would have come to far less then paying everyone to sit on their ass and get fat at home while destroying the economy since nobody is working.
     
  3. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    Anyone can look up actual mortality rates directly caused by Omicron or other virus strains but that is what you need to look for. Inferring it from other data won't do it.
     
  4. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Keeping hospitals open for normal operations as a concern is creeping up on us again. I think limiting large gatherings, masking, and closing bars, restaurants and schools are measures that make more sense than a lockdown.
    There's lots of evidence the vaccines go along way to keeping older people (over 50) out of the hospital and make getting long covid less likely. Before Omicron, the vaccines were helpful in preventing transmission. Now, the protection on transmission is very limited in both effectiveness and duration.
    An earlier variant.
    People are always fools for putting culture and religion over sensible measures like not infecting the rest of your family. Can't say about enforcing the lockdown.
    The lockdowns here reduced transmission, but evaluating their efficacy should include public acceptance of the possibility of other options.

    I've been spending time in British Columbia, Canada since the start of the covid pandemic and the government managed to keep the number of infections and death down without going to the extreme of lockdowns.
    Not from covid, at least not from the current variants.

    An effective respirator goes a long way to preventing you from getting covid, even in crowds.

    DB946C1F-9C20-47E2-81C0-387439DD3B84.jpeg 8438B6C8-D568-4BAF-853E-F51BA1203522.jpeg
    P100s

    I think the potential problem for healthy young people is long covid. Taking Paxlovid if you get covid my help on that score.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
    Death likes this.
  5. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    Again you engage in Trumpet farts. Back up just one thing you say. The whole point you missed is if people took the vaccine they would be less likely to need hospital care preventing those who otherwise needed that care. Then it prevented expanded expenses from the surge of people demanding hospital services.

    You are what is called an arm chair genius. You would bet? That is reference for talking out your ass. At the time the virus first broke out no one knew the extent of its severity or how fast it would spread or how many it could kill. People had to work using a worst case scenario. Then as more and more info came in and comes in we now know more things then we once did. Its hindsight for you to second guess.

    The asking people to stay at home until we knew more info did cause economic problems yes but it was done putting people's safety first and still is as the adverse effects are carefully monitored. We will now probably not go back to home quarantine know but at one point it was an only option presenting the most protection to the most people. That is the point.

    You are a Trumpet. You have no data-all you can offer is personal opinions that you know better. You do not and I do not. Excuse me I prefer to follow the data and journal reports of immunologists, virologists, internal medical specialists, pharmacologists, other medical specialists such as pathologists who ultimately we will rely on to find what causes the death.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  6. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    When we asked people to stay at home we already knew which group of people was most likely in danger. You know that right? At no time was I ever in danger from covid based on my health and age.

    I am under 60 and do not have any co morbids. So I shouldnt have been impacted at all. I shouldn't have been asked to stay home. I could be out and about working/spending...driving the economy. Getting the virus and getting over the virus.
     
  7. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    .All of the above was done and is continuing to be done.
     
  8. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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  9. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Omicron is a milder variant.
    Most of us were never going to be "saved" from anything--death from covid, death from other issues left untreated, etc.

    Omicron has made the disease more manageable.
    You seem more interested in defending your favorite pols than in looking at covid realistically.

    We could have avoided a lot of the problem if we had focused on protecting the people who were more likely to burden the healthcare system. No one in this country did an effective job of that.
     
  10. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    When people were asked to stay at home the full extent and nature of the virus was not known. Of course it could not have been known. Even now its still not fully known. Can you go find out why instead of assuming. Virus profiles aren't instantly known in their early stages and can take years to accurately develop.
     
  11. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Not nearly enough was done to protect more vulnerable people, either in educating them on risk or is helping them mitigate it.
     
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  12. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    You shouldn't have what? There are no absolutes when predicting how a virus may impact on you or anyone else ever.
     
  13. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    You engage in classic negative criticism with no examples. Its intellectually lazy to point out something was wrong without specifics.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  14. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    1-Your comment about who would be "saved" is baseless and so without a basis is meaningless.
    2-Omicron is a virus strain. It was the health management protocol implemented by the same people you claim did nothing that made it more manageable. You and Tough ignore that it is the health management protocol for containing those viruses you 2 disagree with as well as the vaccines that managed them not the virus itself. You two live in a magic world where a virus magically manages itself and none of us need do anything.
    3-You keep referring to what could have been done. State politicians, local politicians, federal politicians all can easily be second guessed in hindsight. Trump is and was the issue. He lied about the virus and encouraged others to cover it up and lie about it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  15. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    I'm glad you agree!

    Omicron becoming the dominant variant which was less severe more transmissible is exactly what allowed us to get over covid.

    Virus did what virus do.

    Lol
     
  16. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    He lied about Covid 19 repeatedly. He is morally responsible for people who died as a result of his lies not just leftists who died.
     
  17. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    Oh look who is now touting the virtues of socialist commie medicare in Canada. What a joke. You are completely against our medicare in Canada. As for your sweeping accusation of some kind of conspirationak fraud to get money putting Covid 19 death on death certificates, its again something you spew out with no basis.
     
  18. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    I'm a conservative who thinks our health care is corrupt. They donate lots to the Clinton foundation so let's pretend it's not a left right issue, k?
     
  19. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    I respectfully disagree with Langley only on one thing. I think ion hindsight we will continue to find and have found many mistakes in how we have managed Covid 19. I totally agree with Langley on that but some of that is hindsight and medical management had to make up its protocol as the virus spread. So it was not perfect and still isn't,

    This is why yes we can now second guess as to what we should have done in hindsight. Where I find it not fair is when we criticize doctors, health care professionals who bust their butt doing all the things Langley suggested should have been done or can be done. They are doing exactly what he thinks should be done with due respect.

    If I blame anyone its politicians of any ideology and specifically Trump for lying about Covid 19 for political reasons. Their lies killed people and they killed more likely Republicans or right wingers who believed in them than so called leftists who knew Trump was a phacking liar.

    That is all I meant to Langley. Its a minor disagreement as to who we focus the criticism on. Yes I defend the nurses, doctors, social workers, senior care workers, paramedics, other first responders, who all did what Langley said in spite of Trump. That is what I meant.
     
  20. Death

    Death Well-Known Member

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    Di
    Covid 19 and all viruses and illnesses impact on all humans regardless of their ideology-you want to turn it into a platform to bash Democrats and defend Trump not I. I am Canadian. Americans and Canadians did the exact same things to control and manage the virus. There was no ideological disagreement as to what to do. The only people who lied about Covid 19 were Trump and his pathetic rump of cult followers. No you can't take an injection of bleach and make that go away.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  21. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Actually it sort of is. It's a large public teaching hospital. Lots of beds and doctors.
     
  22. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Tell me where they're handing out "masks" like these...

    1447B20E-618A-44C6-9C36-3ED1EF3BBA4E.jpeg
    3M 6503QL P100 respirator
     
  23. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    There's no guarantee we won't have a really nasty variant. For now, we have Omicron.

    So far, so good.
     
  24. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

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    Puh leeze.

    If you want to stay in panic mode, be more concerned with bacteria infections becoming immune to penecillin. Otherwise, unless another ****ing gain of function leak happens nature will keep omicron as it is now. It's how it naturally wants to be. Non fatal and easily transmissable.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022
  25. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    What an absurd characterization.
    Penicillin can't kill every bacterial infection.
    You should stop peddling nonsense.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2022

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