Anyone know Trump's stance on Ukraine?

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by wgabrie, Mar 12, 2023.

  1. 19Crib

    19Crib Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I know the first thing Trump will do will be to increase oil supplies to lower prices. That will hurt Russia's war fund immensely and may cause him to fall out of a window.
     
  2. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    The same Trump who previously negotiated higher oil prices, defended Russia's invasion of Ukraine, and said he'd be open to negotiating a victory for Russia in Ukraine? Lol, cute.
     
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  3. 19Crib

    19Crib Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I suspect Trump is afraid of WW3. But maybe he is just a wuss.
    They are betting Putin is a rational actor. China would love to see Russia and America go at it. Then they can take the Philippines while they are at it, and create a military presence in Europe.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2023
  4. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Show your source. I say Trump has boasted he’d broker an agreement, but any notion of it resulting in a Victory forRussia is nothing but your bias, shaping your projection of the outcome. Where is Mitchell (brokered the Northern Ireland 1995 peace agreementwhen no one thought it possible) when we need him? Could Trump get it doe? It’s possible. It won’t happen with this administration. And a similar situation with China is shaping up unabated.
     
  5. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    Trump's deal, IMO, would be to allow the Donbas to be Russian and for NATO not to expand into Ukraine and/or to reign in the reach of NATO.
     
  6. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    Trump. the libertarian (and not the authoritarian which many lie when they consider Trump authoritarian), acquiesced to the legislative call for more armaments for Ukraine.

    One thing Trump has over the Biden Administration, neocons, NATO and the EU, for examples, is the desire to find peace between Ukraine and Russia, er, Trump doesn't desire regime change in Russia, for one.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2023
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  7. Overitall

    Overitall Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'd be in favor of letting the people decide.
    https://jordanrussiacenter.org/news/do-people-in-donbas-want-to-be-liberated-by-russia/#.ZBWMby2B1hA
    Seems simple enough to just hold an election. Winner take all.
     
  8. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    I believe that Trump is questioning our long term commitment there.

    It's coming down to the arguments that some made against our involvement in Vietnam. The Chinese and the Russians got a huge bargain there. For a relatively modest investment, they planted the seeds for widespread desertion in the United States. In the long run, they planted to seeds to have the socialists and communists take over our universities and get a big foothold in the rest of our education system.

    Now we are spending money we don’t have and weapons that are reported to take a long time to replace. Biden has no central strategy except to throw money at the problem, sometimes in ways that seem to benefit the Russians.

    More people on the right are starting to question that. In the meantime, more than an few Europeans, who have a bigger stake in this than we do, don’t seem to be willing to put up the cash and support that is necessary.
     
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  9. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    Last edited: Mar 18, 2023
  10. 19Crib

    19Crib Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That ship has sailed. One of the world's largest grain exporters has now become land locked and will end up being a client state of Russia.
     
  11. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    That's is incorrect. 'Landlocked' means having no physical/geographical connection to the sea. Switzerland is landlocked. Ukraine isn't. One look at a map would tell you Ukraine has access to the sea via the city of Odessa and a couple of other smaller ports along it's southern coast. The fact the Russian navy could potentially threaten to blockade the Odessa doesn't change that.

    Even if the national borders of Ukraine and Russia were to shift to the current confrontation line as part of a peace deal that situation wouldn't change. Ukraine would still hold Odessa and the coastline around it. And if anything so far the momentum in the war has been going the other way i.e. with Ukraine recapturing far, far more territory from Russia than Russia has managed to take in return. So unless Russia manages to capture the rest of Ukraine's coastline including Odessa (which by all reports at the moment it has zero chance of doing) Ukraine will never be landlocked.
     
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  12. 19Crib

    19Crib Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    True, but their sea access is severely curtailed.
     
  13. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    For the moment yes, but that's only because of the war. Putin can't have his cake and eat it to. He can't have a peace deal and maintain a naval blockade of Ukrainian sea trade once he gets it! It's one or the other. And as I said before the only thing that would change that is Russia capturing the rest of the coastline - which isn't going to happen in any foreseeable future
     
  14. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    By 'people' do you mean all the US citizens who voted a government into office last election that is in favor of providing ongoing support for Ukraine? Because if so I'm not quite sure you got a handle on what the term 'democracy' actually means.

    Just to lay it out for you democracy does not mean that elections only ever result in governments that have policies you agree with. Perhaps you might wish that were the case but alas it's not so. :no: Why sometimes citizens have the audacity to elect governments that have policies you disagree with! :-o I know. Shocking isn't it!

    The thing is whether you like it or not there's still a sizable % of the American population that supports ongoing aid to Ukraine just as there is one that doesn't. Which view holds sway will be decided at the next election - democratically.
     
  15. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    I'm talking about the democracy which matters in the war in Ukraine. The people of Crimea, Donetsk and Lugansk wanting to be a part of Russia.:roll:
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2023
  16. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    OK, that's all right then. It's nice to know that the only 'democracy which matters' is a pro-Putin one! Albeit it's kind of telling that in your opinion Russia is a 'democracy'. I mean who knew?
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2023
  17. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    Isn't that the only democracy which matters in Ukraine? I mean, should we, for example, consult the 'democracy' of Trump haters in the dem party to determine if Trump is guilty of the NY state charges?:roll:
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2023
  18. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I would like to think that President Donald J. Trump would not consider my assessment of what the War in Ukraine may well lead to to perhaps NOT be the most astonishingly stupid analysis that he has read on this topic.


    Will the war in the Ukraine lead to the exposure of Hunter Biden and then....





    ?
    Will the war in the Ukraine lead to the fall of Hunter and then Joe Biden????

    1. No
      2 vote(s)
      40.0%

    2. Yes
      0 vote(s)
      0.0%
    3. *
      I do hope so....
      3 vote(s)
      60.0%

    4. I HOPE NOT!!!!!!
      0 vote(s)
      0.0%
    Change Your Vote

    The attempt to indict President Trump before this happens...... is logical!!!!!

    Sleepy Joe does have at least some people working for him who have a clue or two!!!!
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2023
  19. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    Funny how it is Russia who runs those "elections."
     
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  20. Monash

    Monash Well-Known Member

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    Err... tha'ts a matter for a judge and jury, not a vote. Unless of course you actually want the general public to start 'voting' on whether or not accused criminals are guilty?
     
  21. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    In the cases of Lugansk and Donetsk, there've been two passed referendums, one in 2012 and another in 2022, wishing for Lugansk and Donetsk to be a part of Russia.
     
  22. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    What I'm saying is a democracy in Lugansk, Donetsk and Crimea is more important than a democracy in the Biden Administration, the Ukrainian government, the EU and NATO.
     
  23. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    If you think that any 'democracy' in Lugansk, Donetsk and Crimea can be trusted at this point in the game, then you are gullible.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2023
  24. cabse5

    cabse5 Banned

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    If you trust a democracy in the Biden Administration, the EU, NATO and the Ukranian government, you're gullible.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2023
  25. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    Anyone who thinks that Russia's elections are more reliable than our own needs help.
     

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