Is this statement true, false or racist?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Steve N, Mar 22, 2023.

  1. Steve N

    Steve N Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I saw this story and thought it would be a good debate topic on this board. A college professor made the below comment and it led to his firing although he got his job back.

    First of all, I don’t think systemic racism against blacks exists, but that’s just me. If blacks started achieving the same successes as Asians, would the claims of systemic racism fade into the sunset?

     
  2. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Systemic racism isn’t about racism. It’s about correcting policies that impact black people more than white people.

    https://www.mayoclinic.org/medical-...ove-access-for-black-individuals/mac-20540334

    access to the kidney transplant list is harder for black people due do outdated notions about a black person’s physiology.

    There are likely policies like this everywhere. We just need to identify and if. Them.
     
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  3. Steve N

    Steve N Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That story doesn't indicate any policy that intentionally impacts anyone.
     
  4. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Than you didn't read it.
     
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  5. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Speaking the truth can sometimes make you a very unpopular person.
     
  6. MelshieMaze

    MelshieMaze Well-Known Member

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    Man, there's a ridiculously large number of African-American related threads being made on this forum, larger than I've ever seen anywhere else.

    Anyway, if it's systemic racism we're talking about then it wouldn't matter if you perform better than anyone because in reality there's people who won't look your way or hire you just because, they don't need or want a reason.
     
  7. Overitall

    Overitall Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I did. And while I'm just a layperson in medicine it seems to me that the eGFR test isn't used to intentionally discriminate against blacks. The test measures "kidneys' capability to remove creatinine and thus kidney function, and it has been used to determine waitlist status." This test can also disadvantage white kidney patients. If certain blacks have met the criteria under the eGFR test how is it exclusively meant to discriminate against blacks?
     
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  8. Steve N

    Steve N Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not the entire thing but enough to see where it was going.
     
  9. Sirius Black

    Sirius Black Well-Known Member

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    I believe that sistemic racism is anything that treats an entire race as if all members have the same value/trait.
     
  10. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The calculation was different for black versus white. It made assumptions that muscle mass and other factors were different for black and white people. This caused their numbers to be higher, so if a white and black person with the exact same criteria to get on the list; only the white person would get on, because the calculations were different.

    This isn't racist; it's based on very old and very faulty assumptions about black people. This is one example. There are likely policies like this all over the place, based on very old thinking.

    https://www.kidney.org/atoz/content/race-and-egfr-what-controversy

    Race was originally included in eGFR calculations because clinical trials demonstrated that people who self-identify as Black/African American can have, on average, higher levels of creatinine in their blood. It was thought the reason why was due to differences in muscle mass, diet, and the way the kidneys eliminate creatinine. Since a patient’s race is not always used when laboratory tests are ordered, laboratories used different eGFR calculations for African American and non-African American and included both numbers in their lab results.

    The use of race in calculating eGFR has been a subject of debate. Race is not a biological concept, but a social construct. Using race as a factor for calculating eGFR does not account for the diversity within communities of color. Also, people who self-identify as multiracial might not want to be put in a single racial bucket.
     
  11. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    The statement you are referencing is overtly general to both African Americans and Asians as a whole. These are two groups of people with two vastly different cultures from various nations, and whose experiences in America are also vastly different as well. That being said, he basically said that African Americans are not academic successes. Dr. Ben Carson is not an outlier or an exception, it is just the most well-known. And I can see why he was fired in the first place, but unions, you know, those organizations that RW political posters don't want around, got his job back.

    I think he should have worded it better for the point he was making. Not sure what it was or the context in which he made the statement, but it should have been better communicated.
     
  12. Overitall

    Overitall Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    But, aren't there physiological differences between blacks and whites? For instance, it's a fact that they are more susceptible to certain diseases. Shouldn't that be factored into determining how to measure their eligibility for treatment? I'm not sure about the accuracy of the eGFR tests, but I did note that there are debate about it within the medical community.

    I may be missing the point here, but it seemed that you were making a case that systemic racism is reflected in the way blacks are put on kidney transplant lists. Either it's racism or it's not. If it's not, then I'm not getting the point.
     
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  13. Curious Always

    Curious Always Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't think it's racist. It's like anything. We currently are still calculating the poverty rate built in the 1960s.

    My point is not "racism everywhere." My point is that once we set these types of things in motion, we fail to go back and revisit to see if they still make sense. Don't you think we should do that?
     
  14. Overitall

    Overitall Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Absolutely! Change is life. But we need to think carefully about whether the change makes our life better.
     
  15. Steve N

    Steve N Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  16. Sirius Black

    Sirius Black Well-Known Member

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    So you are saying kidny transplant dicisions should not be fair and impartial?
     

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