Leftists Don't Like Muslims Either

Tout te l'heure mon ami.

 

Wait, didn't a leftist president of the USA order the nuclear bombing of Japan which ended the largest war in human history?

I guess he must have been a secret Republican.

 

Now you get it , The Democrat Party was the Party of the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan then too...

 

In 2001 it passed both the house and Senate with overwhelming numbers:

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/patriotact20012006senatevote.shtml

...98 U.S. senators for voted in favor of the US Patriot Act of 2001 (Senator Landrieu (D-LA) did not vote) Senator Russ Feingold of Wisconsin was the only senator who voted against the Patriot Act on October 24, of 2001.

So that means it was 98 yea, 1 nay, 1 no vote.

Here are the house numbers for 2001:

Code:

	       Yeas	Nays	PRES	NV
Republican	211	3	 	5
Democratic	145	62	 	4
Independent      1	1	 	 
TOTALS      	357	66	 	9

As you can see, when it passed, the democrats most certainly endorsed it.

Wrong again.

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/patriotact20012006senatevote.shtml

...89 U.S. senators who voted in favor of the March 2, 2006 Patriot Act Reauthorizing Act (not including list)

These are the 10 US senators who voted against the Patriot Act Reauthorizing Act of March 2006. The senators in bold type voted in favor of the Patriot Act in 2001.

NAYs ---10
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Byrd (D-WV)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Murray (D-WA)
Wyden (D-OR)

Inouye (D-HI) did not vote on the 2006 Patriot Act Renewal

As you can see less, not more democrats voted against the Patriot Act in 2006. However the vast majority of the parties Senators still voted yes thus are still freedom hating (*)(*)(*)(*)s just like all the Republicans who voted yes.

Here's the house:

Code:

                Yeas	Nays	PRES	NV
Republican	214	13	 	3
Democratic	66	124	 	11
Independent	 	1	 	 
TOTALS      	280	138	 	14

I was wrong here as apparently they did at one point have less than a majority voting for the bill. It also disproves your assertion that more of them voted for it than against in 2006.

This you're dead on about and they went right back to supporting the act. Here's a list of 162 jack asses that voted to continue this un-American garbage bill:

http://thatsmycongress.com/index.ph...ted-for-patriot-act-extension-without-reform/

So again, bull(*)(*)(*)(*) like the PATRIOT act, it's bipartisan.

 

Let me ask you a question. Did any Democrats attempt to use the Patriot Act for political purposes during the last eleven years. Btw, watch your mouth.

 

Yup. Leftists like to deny their role in oppression. They are complete liars.

 

Another good thread, my friend. Exactly, there were a few that were outraged and said they would never support Obama again after Obama let warrantless intercept extension continue. Another one of his campaign promises that he broke.

Obviously, there is a majority that protest when it's convenient, their protests mean squat.

 

Lets see what misinformation we have this time!

No one can take Afghanistan. Occupying a country simply doesn't work. If people feel strongly enough about their national identity they will resist. Look at how many colonial powers there are today. The number of colonies that remain is way outnumbered by then number that have gained independence. England can't even control the island next to them. Hell Russia couldn't even take Afghanistan when they were still a super power. So really this proves nothing other than that going to Afghanistan and for some reason staying was a dumb idea.

Do they? I'm pretty sure fuel prices are determined by the cost of oil.

http://golongorshort.com/2012/03/13/daily-crude-oil-comment-13th-march-2012/



Now lets take a look at cost breakdown:

http://www.theatlantic.com/business...mines-the-price-of-gas-a-visual-guide/237968/


So we're looking at 12% of that being taxes and 68% being the price of crude, this being back in 2011. It's likely the price of crude is now a bigger portion. So really all the dems can do is lower the taxes, thus lowering government revenue, which in a time where we are not only in debt but also running a deficit, isn't such a great idea.

I'd say this is more bipartisan. Republicans love cutting money for schools for some reason. They also pass garbage like no child left behind which cuts school funding if they can't keep up on standardized tests (school is failing, make it worse! Great logic). Liberals on the other hand seem to love keeping teachers in inefficient bureaucracy in place and refuse systems that could work such as voucher systems which would allow for schools which do the best to get more students (who wants to intentionally send their kid to a (*)(*)(*)(*)ty school?) Parents regardless of political affiliation are the most detrimental to the school system however. If you want to know why kids can't be held back in school anymore look straight at the parents. No one wants to acknowledge that their kid is stupid or not trying.

Certainly true. Public pension plans cost us money.

I expect we'll see more too. The people of California have no idea of what money is.

Not sure what you're saying here.

Anyways a few hits so that's good! You really can't blame the left for everything though. Somethings they can't really help and others the right is just as guilty of. Some items though, it's totally on the left.

 

It's kinda funny how the war protesters disappeared overnight and no one on the left seems to care that Obama not only legitimized Guantanamo but as far as I know continues torture. Oh and he killed a US citizen. I get in arguments with my friends sister about this kind of stuff all the time. It actually pisses me off to see the left do nothing about it, but what do you expect, both sides are filled with hypocrites.

 

I'm sure they did. Also what am I watching my mouth about?

 

Don't demean yourself.

This is where I get to school you because I know more than you do apparently. This portion of your post is totally false and is completely ignorant. Want to know why? You don't know history.

Afghans have been defeated and occupied many times. Have you ever heard of the Macedonian Alexander the Great? His forces conquered Afghanistan, occupied it, established the Bactrian Kingdom which lasted for centuries.

Afghanistan was once a Buddhist country until it was conquered and occupied by a mixed force of Arabs and Iranians. They converted the Afghans by force. The Afghans are still Muslim.

Have you ever heard of Hulagu il Khan the Mongol? He conquered Afghanistan and it became part of the Il Khanate. The Hasara people of Afghanistan are descended from the Mongols.

Have you ever heard of Timur the Lame, also known as Tamerlane? His forces conquered Afghanistan, and occupied it for decades.

Have you ever heard of Queen Victoria. Her British forces conquered Afghanistan, occupied it, and added it to the Raj in the Second Anglo-Afghan War in the 1870s.

The Soviets failed because Saudi Arabia and the US teamed up to finance and arm the Afghans. Stinger missiles made in America took away Soviet control of Afghan airspace.

America has been defeated because Chimp Bush took his eye off the ball, and Monkey King Obama escalated the war, adopted a foolish counterinsurgency policy, told the Taliban when American forces were going to leave, and failed to deprive the Afghan Taliban of their sanctuary in Pakistan.

You and the Monkey King have been completely defeated by a seventh century army of bearded fanatics.

This is your defeat and the defeat of the Monkey King. Own it. Embrace defeat. Learn it, live it, love it.

The blood of every American who died in Afghanistan since January 20, 2009 is on your hands and the hands of the Monkey King. Two thirds of the Americans who have died in Afghanistan succumbed after the Monkey King Obama took office.

I estimate another five hundred Americans will die in Afghanistan before you and the Monkey King are forced to surrender. You and the Monkey King could save their lives by bringing them home. Your support of the Monkey King ensures those Americans who have yet to die will die.

 

The price of crude oil is determined by supply and demand. Govt. policies affect supply and demand. Obama's policies have prevented supplies from increasing. He won't permit the Keystone Pipleline to bring Canadian oil to America. He won't permit drilling in ANWR. He won't permit drilling off the east and west coasts. He won't permit drilling on federal land. All increased production has come from private lands where he can't stop the drilling.

You and Monkey King Obama own the high price of crude oil. Embrace your defeat.

 

The left now faces a form of open civil war. The only thing that matters is that they fail.

 

Because are so immersed in the bipartisan crap that they won't do anything against their party.

In Spain we see something similar, the PSOE(supposed leftist party) made last year terrible reforms in labor, well now the PP(rightist party) has continued the work making it worse, well now we have all the PSOE fanboys protesting while when the PSOE did they were saying that it was necessary.

The same with Afghanistan... The PSOE send troops to Afghanistan but before they supported the demonstrations against the war in Iraq. Pure bipartisan hipocresy. I think that is the same in USA. BIpartidism is the worst.

 

There's nothing bipartisan about the leftist war in Afghanistan. They totally own the defeat. They totally own the deaths that have yet to come while they remain silent.

 

Is Afghanistan under any of those forces or is it its own thing?

I'm also not sure why you put the blood on my hand. I didn't vote for war. I didn't vote for Obama. I didn't serve in Afghanistan because I was sent to Korea then Iraq and never deployed to Afghanistan. None of what happens there is because of me.

Oh, and I fully support bringing the troops back. (*)(*)(*)(*) Afghanistan and (*)(*)(*)(*) you for saying I'm in support of killing our own men. Also, I do not support Obama, you're making that up in your own head. I've been very clear that I do not support either party. Simply because you have holes in your argument that I am pointing out does not mean I agree with your supposed opposition.

 

The pipeline is a way for Canada to bring oil to our shores for export, not to bring oil into our nation. They wanted to do this for no US gain which is why he opposed it.

I agree that we could start drilling here and I certainly don't oppose it. I'm opposed to fracking at the moment because circumstantial evidence shows that it cause earthquakes and pollutes water. If research is done and we find these things to be false, or if it is done away from populated areas I don't have an issue.

Again, and I'll be clear here: I DO NOT SUPPORT OBAMA. JUST BECAUSE I AM ARGUING AGAINST YOUR POINTS DOES NOT MEAN I'M FOR WHAT YOU'RE AGAINST. The problem is you don't have your facts straight and you're trying to portray the right as knights in shining armor when they're just as bad as the left.

 

That's exactly what is happening and it's sick. Most of these threads are that way. I'm sure you've seen the Republicans calling for universal (Federal) ID cards. Up until 2000 they were deathly opposed to such things, but now suddenly they're all for it. Partisanship is garbage and it's screwing up America, especially since both parties push the same general platform. Glad (and sad) to see it's happening elsewhere.

 

Yes.

I don't believe you. Where did you serve, when did you serve and which unit did you serve with?

Conservatives, including Libertarians, don't attack each other on PF. You are a leftist.

Please clean up your foul language and don't attack me personally.

Now let's turn to the holes you aver are in my contentions. Go through these holes on an item by item basis please.

 

Oil is fungible on a globalized basis. An increase in supply impacts price everywhere.

 

What nation controls Afghanistan? What the US right? Who before we invaded?

Well since I told you to (*)(*)(*)(*) off, which I sincererly mean because you said that I support the killing of US troops, I did this for you.



My class A uniform isn't in good form (it has some wrinkles) otherwise it would be there too.

Here's my history:

B co. 2/58 - Basic, Ft. Benning

United Nations Command Security Battalion - Joint Security Area (UNCSB-JSA, or JSA for short), Korea. Right uniform (bottom because it's sideways and I don't know how to change that in Image Shack)

1/12 Infantry, then 3rd Brigade 4ID (where I was sent when I hit Iraq), then C co 1/8 Inf Ft Carson. Middle uniform

Finally C co 1/16 Infantry in Ft Riley. Left uniform (top because it's sideways)

BTW check out the Image Shack member ID. If the piece of paper with your forum handle, the name of the forum (Political Forum) and the date doesn't convince you then this should.

Feel free to bring up this link next time one of you decides I'm not a veteran.

I am not a leftist. Libertarians do attack those on the right (pay attention to the forum and Libertarians in general, try looking at http://www.cato.org/). Again, why should I not attack people who are actively trying to destroy the nation? Why would I support people who are as bad as those they claim to oppose? I have no idea why you believe this.

As for my language you (*)(*)(*)(*)ing deserve it. Do not say that I am for killing American service members again.

 

Right, and drilling here makes that price go down globally, and will cut prices here being that import would be cheaper.

 

I apologize to you. I was wrong to insult you and to doubt your service.

Despite your service you do not know history. You shouldn't make assertions about Afghan history if you aren't knowledgeable.

I understand now why you are upset. It's difficult to accept the fact that what you have loved and fought for is dying. There are stages of grief. I've been through them. The first stage is denial. The last stage is acceptance.

For most of my life I was an ardent American patriot. I was raised by the people who fought WWII, and imbibed their loyalty to America.

Over many decades I have studied history. There is an ebb and flow in the affairs of men and nations. America is no exception to this hard rule of history.

Over the course of the last decade it became apparent to me that the forces and processes that had aligned to provide American hegemony in the post-WWII era had come unaligned, and that the character of the American people had changed from the characteristics I saw when I was growing up.

It also became clear to me that neither left nor right could work with the other because their objectives are mutually exclusive. There is no longer any shared ground between the two ideological camps. It also became clear that neither the left nor right could defeat the other.

Over the course of the decades attempts at compromise were made, but the left always negotiated in bad faith, pocketed the conservative compromises, and ignored their own promises in subsequent Congresses. Under such circumstances good faith compromise is impossible.

The pulbic school system can't be saved. It's best to avoid it if you want to avoid gambling with your child's education.

The American economy was once ruthlessly efficient. But the economy has been subjected to a frighteningly complex burden of regulation that has taken much of the steam out of the country.

Between Bush and Obama an empire has been thrown away. And the country itself has been overwhelmed with illegal immigrants who have brought many things with them including violence, ignorance and poverty.

After WWII America became a consumer society, but in the last decade we have borrowed ten trillion dollars for wars and living high on the hog. The Fat Years are over, and most americans will find their children having a lower standard of living than they have had.

All of these problems could have been dealt with by compromise in good faith, with unity and solidarity. It's way too late for that to happen now. The die is cast.

No polity in history has survived a protracted period of financial instablity. The result is always the same. Financial collapse. It happenend to Bourbon Dynasty France in 1789, Qing Dynasty China in 1911, and the Soviet Union in 1991. The same thing is going to happen to America.

I have cried my tears, and now accept the final stage of grief. I am now animated by two objectives, to wit: seeing the ideal of individual liberty saved, and preventing further imposition of the leftist agenda on an unwilling people.

To prevent such imposition it is necessary to keep the political system frozen to ensure that the system's internal inconsistencies rip the country apart.

I know that this language hurts you, but the ideal of individual liberty cannot survive in this new Amerika.

Based on my study of history and human nature I have a pretty good idea of what is going to happen over the next twenty years. That knowledge is so heartrendingly sad that I have had to detach myself emotionally to it and move on.

In a sense I am the last of the Mohicans who knows that we approach a much more dangerous world and poorer prospects as a people.

The study of history allows one to walk in the past and present at the same time. An understanding of human nature allow one to see patterns of behavior in the past to given circumstances, and to relate those patterns to the future.

What I can tell you in sadness is that this the third great iteration of the American Republic will soon end because of its internal inconsistencies. Compromises would have already been made if compromise had been possible.

The country you loved is coming to an end. This is hard to take, but has been faced by soldiers many times over the course of history. The polity won't survive, but the ideal of individual liberty will survive...but it will do so in some unknown successor state.

 

Wait. We're called moral relativists when we acknowledge our role in oppression. Anti-American, that term gets used a lot, too. When we acknowledge our role in oppression, you guys get all flustered and accuse us of hating America.

Don't you?

 

Keep your mouths shut and conservatives will tell you when an apology is over.