The Assault on Christianity deepens.

I am honestly at a loss.

I do not understand how legalizing medical marijuana equates to an "assault on Christianity".

Certainly weed has some properties that are helpful to folks who have a variety of illnesses. Chemo patients, MS sufferers, glaucoma sufferers all receive some sort of relief from it.

If the concern is form an intoxicant viewpoint, the bible is loaded with references about wine. One of the myths of the miracles of Jesus includes a story where he converted water into wine for his group. So what would be the difference between smoking weed and what Jesus did?

 

LOLLOL.. you are too rational by far.

 

some dangerous morals in that story awsome miracle booze is good even more so when you need more for a party but that being said when possible it make sense to put out good stuuf 1st then slip in the rest as every one gets more drunck

 

Shiva said,

Things are changing especially since this hate crimes law took effect. There is a war on Christianity and things are happening all over the country and world denying Christians free exercise. People just don't know its going on. Let me give you some examples. For you to say this is delusion is hiding your head in the sand….you don't get it and see it because you don't want too. I doubt anything I post will change your mind on this…but here goes.

First off the persecution of Christians worldwide is growing. According to Freedom House which tracks this around the world…in 1994 alone over 160,000 Christians were killed worldwide.
Michael Harmon, "Persecution of Christians Is Growing-in Sweden and Canada," Press Herald, 30 July 2004.


I could give examples from Canada, England and Sweden…but first I will give a few just in the United States alone.

Peterson v. Hewlett-Packard a Christian coworker exercised his right to free speech in response to a homosexual poster the com pay had placed near his cubicle. He posted Bible verses to express his beliefs on the matter. He was fired. The Ninth Circuit of Appeals wrote, "An employers need not accommodate an employees religious beliefs if doing so would result in discrimination against his co-workers or deprive them of contractual or other statutory rights." So here in this case homosexual agenda trumps an employees religious beliefs.

Enoch Lawrence….retired Air Force Officer…posted in his cubical….a sign that said, Jesus Spoken Here, several Bible verses and a bumper sticker that said, Marriage one man and one woman. The California Department of SS didn't like this they ripped them down. It went against the departments policy. "Each employee must exercise his or her own good judgement to avoid engaging in conduct that may be perceived by others as harassment and or unprofessional, inappropriate behavior." A pagan Pride Festival flyer was posted in the break room. But his pro-marriage bumper sticker, which reflected California and the United States…..was forbidden. Unbelievable.

Sandia National Labs of New Mexico gave a homosexual employee group special rights, but when a Christian group asked for them, guess what? DENIED. Homosexuals were allowed to hold events honoring their national coming out day. Christians were prohibited from bring in a speaker to discuss evolution and creation. Sandia also censored the Christians website by removing links to the Family Research Council and Exodus International. in the middle of Gay Pride Month…which was advertised in Sandias internal publications.

When a lesbian approached two Christian doctors in San Diego to be artificially inseminated, the doctors refused based on their faith. Well the girls were not tolerant of the doctors feelings and their religious convictions...so they sued. A California appeals court found that they were wrong to refuse. Jennifer Pizer the lesbians attorney said something to the order that...when a doctor is in her church, she can do religion but not in the medical office. So basically ya turn your faith on and off like a water faucet.

In California foster parents have to take a reeducation class to ensure that they embrace the homosexual agenda.

California public schools with a mandated pro-homosexual antidiscrimination policy sends objecting students to appropriate counseling without notifying parents.

Again in California you can be put out of business for firing a man in a dress. And oh be fined $150,000 to boot.

In Colorado a judge tells parents that they can not teach their daughter anything homophobic.

Did you know what pastors in Pennsylvania are buying liability insurance? To protect themselves from being prosecuted under the states new hate speech law. Sexual orientation was added to the law. That means if homosexuals are sitting in any church and the pastor reads or says anything negative about homosexual behavior they can say that...that is harassment by communication. The Bible then is basically hate speech and certain parts can’t be read.

Hate crimes laws invariably lead to fines and jail for those who violate them.

Christians are singled out. We are labeled and fined and silenced and humiliated....and bashed. So don’t tell me that we live in a totally free and civilized society. Free speech and the right to religious expression does not just exist in the home but should exist everywhere. And it slowly is going away. Obama just passed in secret a law that will prohibit peaceful demonstration and free speech. If the Secret Service says it is a dangerous zone...then it will be off limits to people who want to protest. This is a rape of the Constitution and our rights. Under the First Amendment any group has the right to express its views and try to persuade others of its stand on a moral issue.

U.S News and World Report columnist John Leo said, “Savage mockery of Christianity is now a conventional part of the public gay culture.”

In Madison Wisconsin 400 hundred homosexual activists stormed the Trinity Evangelical Fellowship Church, where Scott Lively was speaking. While they shouted obscenities and slogans inside the church for nearly an hour, some of the protestors urinated and defecated on the floor. Hundreds of others banged on the outer walls and windows with rocks and trash-can lids shouting, Crush the Christians and bring back the lions.”

http://vallee7.wordpress.com/category/homosexual-rights/

They are literally today going into churches and making demands that not only Christians tolerate them but accept their lifestyle as normal and equal to theirs.

 

Shiva said,

It does not matter why....they have a right to believe and speak about it without being arrested or silenced.

We were founded by Christians and the Constitution does not forbid free exercise of Christianity. I just posted this in another thread...going to repost here.


The fact is and history shows that protestant Christianity has been our established religion in almost every sense of the word. It supplied our country with its system of values. I suggested you….read our charters, state constitutions, read what presidents and governors…said and did….it echoes that for four centuries we were very much Christian in content. Today those ideals clash with todays secular multiculturistic, society. Moral relativism has taken over…even though the majority claim to be Christian. They don't however live the Christian worldview like in generations past.

Its one thing to claim like you do that we were nothing Christian…that there was no evidence of our Christian roots…and another when you try to rewrite and revise history of past. Our past shows that the majority of Americans shared a common religion and ethic system….and the documents written starting even back as far as the Mayflower Compact or Winthrops sermon on the Arabella…show exactly the truth of what we once were.

There is and never was separation of church and state...not in the Constitution or any other legal document on record. Why would the public schools have its students recite the Lords Prayer….why would they teach the things they did for generations if what you said was true? Heck Noah Webster even stated that education without the bible is useless. So the Bible was included in the curriculum in the schools at that time. Have you ever looked one of the Primers they used back then? Religious themes throughout the book…the Lords Prayer, Apostles Creed, the Ten Commandments, the Westminster Assembly Shorter Catechism. And get this…to learn the alphabet they incorporated biblical principles with each letter. It taught the kids about Christianity while learning the alphabet.

You can’t rewrite history it is what it is.

You are showing YOUR LACK OF TOLERANCE FOR THOSE WHO DO BELIEVE IN GOD. You think us weak, ignorant....we need crutches....I have heard all your bashing remarks as to why we believe. The ones who scream the loudest are the most intolerant. And for your information....most people in the United States CLAIM to be Christian...that is a fact. So for you to say this...shows your desperation and hatred towards those you despise. Christianity has afforded the freedoms we have in the United States. No where on earth has been more peaceful and tolerant of peoples differences.

No its the other way around. Pagans and moral relativists are waging the war. They are like vampires who see light....they plot and they manipulate and they will do anything it takes to bring anyone with a God belief down. America was founded by Christians. The Constitution protected free exercise of religion not the protection from religion. You will not find one document that says anything different. Our schools were Christian...and the kids recited the Lords Prayer...the Apostles Creed and more. In fact in most states you had to be a Christian to hold office. If Jefferson believed that there was this separation...HE CERTAINLY VIOLATED IT AS HIS ACTIONS WERE CHRISTIAN EVEN WHILE HE WAS PRESIDENT.

 

BEcause of hate crimes laws…there will be a gag rule placed on churches.


"Hate Crime laws are just the beginning. Once those are passed either federally or in all 50 states, begin campaign to eliminate homophobia entirely."

"Like "Don't Ask, Don't Tell," thoughts or words equal conduct. Homophobic inclinations alone, even without any actions, should be criminal and punishable to the full extent of the law."

"Penetrate the sperm banks to perpetuate the gene. Although the nature vs. nurture debate rages on, ensure that as many vials of semen contain gay genes."

"If you are HIV positive, engage in unprotected sex with pedophile priests and pastors. We have enough recruits from Christian schools and the military without us having to house perverts cloaked in religion. There's the Catholic Church for that."


Sneak gay subtext into every book, movie, video game, TV show or other media that you have access to. Nothing like subliminal messaging to equate queerness with Godliness. (Don't forget, they catch the obvious ones like Spongebob and Tinky Winky, but they'll miss Bart or Freddie from Grand Theft Auto because they're too well hidden. Don't worry, their badly parented, unsupervised kids will know it when they see it)."


"Ensconce yourself in virulently homophobic organizations like the Boy Scouts and Southern Baptists or Concerned Women for America. The more indispensable homos they have in their fold, the more hypocritical their ultimate exposure. And any bad behavior can simply be blamed on their organizations."


"Bombard the Federal Communications Commission any time anything remotely offensive to gay people appears on the airwaves. Homophobia is indecent, and our children must be sheltered from it. They want to regulate decency. Let's keep them really, really busy."

http://annoy.com/features/doc.html?DocumentID=100722

Gays attacking churches in Michigan…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzFyPnvz-iI


http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1108/Gays_vs_Mormons_in_California.html

Gays vandalize church…..

http://www.wnd.com/2011/10/356361/

School kids walk out….


Laws are being made that will force the church to either cave in as some have done already or stand on the Word and face prosecution.


http://forums.hannity.com/showthrea...ivist-Attacks-Christians-Cusses-At-Schoolkids

 

Let me clarify that I am not a fan of "hate crime" laws but do believe that the motivation for a crime should be a consideration when a person is convicted of a crime against another person. From a political standpoint I believe the "hate crime" laws originated when the legistature began to intervene in the roles and responsibilities of the Court in mandating sentencing guidelines.

If we have a problem with "hate crime" laws, which also applied to crimes against religious groups, then that is a separate issue. We also can't address crimes based upon religion in other parts of the world except by advocating Freedom Of Religion as well as Freedom From Religion. Many Christians do have a problem with this though because they support Israel which is a religious and ethnic aparthied nation. Any nation founded upon "religion" is the enemy of a free people that support Freedom of Religion. Those that support Religous Freedom cannot support Israel.

That said we could agree that the problem is worldwide religious intolerance that is inherent in religion but not inherent in those that are not religious. The athiest and the agnostic really doesn't care what someone's religious beliefs are so long as those holding religious beliefs don't attempt to impose those beliefs on others.

An employee of a company does not have unrestricted freedom of speech or expression at their place of employment. There is no violation of anyone's Rights in the above examples.

This doesn't present the whole story obviously but once again this is a private enterprise and the management of that enterprise can establish it's own rules related to the use of it's facilities. Normally a company of this size has a published company policy that all employees must abide by. We would have to know the exact company policy before even beginning to address this issue. It doesn't appear on the surface that anyone's Rigths were violated because, as noted, the employees do not have a Right to use the company facilities at all. It is a granted privilege on a case-by-case basis.

Once again most of the facts are missing but I do know of a couple of similiar situations which might address what was behind this decision of the court.

There was a pharmacist here in the State of Washington that had religious beliefs that opposed Plan B drugs. He didn't want to carry them BUT he was giving out prescriptions to Medicare/Medicaid patients and Medicaid covered the Plan B prescriptions. The ruling of the court was that if he accepted Medicaid payments then he had to provide all of the prescription drug benefits that Medicaid covered. He didn't have to supply Plan B drugs but if he didn't then Medicaid would not honor any bills submitted to them by the pharmacist. Basically, if the pharmacist wanted the Medicaid business then he had to abide by the Medicaid rules.

So, in the case presented was there a contractual requirement to provide the artificial insemination either being imposed by the government or by a private insurer? If that was the case then the doctors are obligated to provide the service and the court would find on behalf of the plaintiff. In any case no one's Rights were violated and the decision of the Court related to the Business and not the personal religious beliefs of the individuals involved. Just because someone is religious doesn't mean they can ignore contractual obligations.

Please document this. There actually isn't a "homosexual agenda" so this seems extremely far-fetched.

Anti-discrimination is the issue of the California public schools and certainly discrimination against homosexuals can be both severe and even deadly in schools. The problem isn't with the homosexuals but instead with those that discriminate against them. Do I really need to post examples of gay and lesbian students that are discriminated against because of their sexual orientation?

Who here supports discrimination and violance is the question that really must be asked.

This has nothing to do with Religious Freedom.

Once again, please provide an example. This sounds like one of those far-fetched BS examples where there might be a rare situation (e.g. a trans-sexual) that a law is applicable.

This has absolutely nothing to do with Religious Freedom

If the parents are teaching "hatred" is that supported by Christians? Do Christians support hatred? And this, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with religion.

I've overrun the character limitation so I had to delete some of my responses but let me close with a summary:

There are several things addressed here but I will summarize. The problem originates with Christian discrimination against homosexuals under the law. Prohibitions against same-gender marriage violate the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment and this has been the decision of the Courts in numerous cases. If there is a "gay agenda" then it is to obtain equal protection under the law as established by the 14th Amendment. They also seek protection from hate-mongers, often based upon "Christian" religious beliefs, that viciously attack and murder them.

The arguments by many Christians are virtually identical to the arguments by racists in America. They create the problem and then complian when anyone objects to the invidious hatred they propagate that discriminates against others in America. The attacks originate with the Christians and they need to realize that but they don't.

It's fine if a Christian doesn't believe in homosexuality. No one is asking them to be a homosexual nor does anyone want to deny them any Rights because they are not a homosexual. So why do Christians seek to deny homosexuals equality under the laws of the United States?

 

BS - prove this claim. Link us to the actual law and let's see what it states.

 

Wine is for everyone to enjoy, pot is just for teenagers and old dirty hippies.

Hopefully that answers your question.

 

lol

Do you have more to offer than a silly conspiracy theory invoking the use of subliminal messaging? lol

 

JohnTheRepublican,

Are Muslims being oppressed because Sharia law hasn't been legalized and Allah isn't also on the currency? Are Muslims being oppressed because alcohol is used around them or people are buying meat which isn't halal?

Of course not, they have learned to accept and tolerate other cultures and ideas about the world.

So stop complaining unless you want fundamentalist Muslims, also, to have their laws and ideas instituted in the government for their "right to live in a moral Muslim country".

 

Flags ~ Southerners threw down our flag and waived the treasonous Dixie rag - in fact, they still do

Pledge of Allegiance ~ created by a SOCIALIST

Ten Commandments ~ used to ''justify'' slavery, extermination of Indians, and foreign wars

pot smoking ~ the Bible teaches to use herbs of the field - cannabis was most widely used medicine in those days

 

A religious government is fun as long as it is your religion.

 

greatamerican said,

This is not a nation that was founded on Islam. It was founded on Christian principles. Its laws and customs reflected that in every way Christ was front and center.
If the majority of this country were Muslims…the laws would start reflecting that…because there in the ME there is no separation and other religions for the most part are not tolerated. The Muslims who live in the United States have to tolerate our laws but that does not mean they would not follow the Koran to the letter if America became Islamic. Right now they are taking over Europe. Worldwide domination….the goal.

Or setting us up for the takeover who knows. As I said happening in England right now.

If they want to live in an Islamic state then they should move back to the Middle East. And unless we wake up and smell the roses we will become a Muslims state…and then Sharia law…..will be the norm.

 

What laws were based on the Bible?

 

These are all cases…that you can google. There is no conspiracy theory….I posted facts for those who want to know and read the truth. But if its to hard for you to investigate…and do the work…then so be it….stay in the dark.

 

Churchmouse,

Yes, our country was founded on how Christ acted, I think I missed the bit about Jesus allowing slavery like the constitution did and fighting a bloody war for independence. Jesus also must have been a well-known advocate for political freedom and low taxation, oh wait, he said to obey the authorities by declaring to "give caesar's what is caesar's". Jesus himself told his disciples to pay the taxes and not to protest them according to the gospels!

Oh right, and the Christian nation? I believe the treaty of tripoli outlines this quite well. It is signed by John Adams and states very clearly that the US is "in no way a Christian nation". Oh, and there is that whole thing about congress not making laws respecting the establishment of religion. Whoops.

 

Google what? Subliminal messaging?

Do you know why they are referred to as conspiracy theories and not fact?

 

Well if you look at our laws in place they reflect the morals in the bible. Marriage one man and one woman. Had we been secular…why wouldn't gay marriage always have existed. Sodomy was illegal…..it is sin in the Bible. If you look at what the Founders said and did….it reflected Christian values.

You want more examples…..yea ok.

You say we were not Christian.

The Supreme Court in 1892 declared…that America was a Christian nation from its earliest days and it is reflected in our customs and laws. Lets see…..the oath before testifying in court…concluding an appeal to the Almighty. Sessions of government opening with prayer…using God, amen….Government observation of the Sabbath, charitable organizations existing under Christian auspices….government commissioning Bibles, appointing Christian chaplains….and the list goes on and on.
AGain in 1931 Supreme Court Justice Sutherland again reviewed the 1892 court case and reaffirmed we are a Christian people. As late as 1952 Supreme Court Justice Douglas declared we are a religious people and our institutions presuppose a Supreme being. Wow……No separation there.

I just took the online Constitution class put on by Hillsdale College…its free take it you might learn something. David Brewer in addition to writing the opinion in that Holy Trinity case also wrote The United States: A Christian Nation, which was a series of lectures that were published in a book…while he was STILL ON THE BENCH.
He said that…."there is no charter or constitution that is either infidel, agnostic or anti-Christian that where ever there is a declaration in favor of any religion it is of the Christian."
He also said…."I could show how largely our laws and customs are based upon the laws of Moses and the teachings of Christ; how constantly the Bible is appealed to as the guide of life and the authority in questions of morals."

You know our nation did not just start in 1776….but way before some one hundred and fifty years earlier….the thirteen colonies….with their independent governments. Our Christian heritage started then. I would suggest reading the First Charter of Virginia. The Christian religion was the underlying basis of the Virginia Colony. AFter you read that read the Massachusetts and the Mayflower Compact. 'Having undertaken for the Glory of God and advancement of the Christian Faith….." The faith brought over with the earliest settlers was a faith rooted in Christ.
Christianity was present throughout all of the Colonial Constitutions. State Constitutions are a remarkable testament to the fact that Christianity played an important part in the formation of the Republic. The documents were explicitly Christian in design.
And our Constitution was drafted…IN THE YEAR OF OUR LORD." This wording took on a biblical meaning…no new age dating system and they did it on purpose. The Founders could have gone the French way and created a document based and worded on a new calendar….to separate themselves with Christianity but they did not do this.

The Declaration of Independence….."We are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable right……nothing secular about this is there? These rights come from….where? No creator, no rights. God is invoked here and is almost all our state constitutions. Our pledge of allegiance….says, "Under God…." public officials take an oath…"so help me God."…our national motto…..In God we Truth…..

You bring up the money…. It first appeared in 1864 and it was passed by formal Congressional approval. Why would this happen if we were not Christian? Where is the separation of church and state?

We were a Christian nation from the get go…..and our government buildings and monuments prove it as well.

The words In God we Trust….are inscribed in the House and Senate chambers.
On the walls of the Capitol dome…all ear the words…"The New Testament according to the Lord and SAvior Jesus Christ."
In the Rotunda of the Capitol is the future of Christ crucified.
The Baptism of Pocahontas hangs in the Capital.
The "Embarkation of the Pilgrims" shows Brewster holding a Bible opened to the New Testament of Jesus Christ. The words In God we Trust are on the sail of the ship. …..this hangs in the Capital Rotunda.
A picture of Moses hands in the House Chamber. Moses is surrounded by 22 other lawgivers.
The Liberty Bell has leviticus 25:10 displayed in a band around its top.
Washington Monument…."Praise be to God."….lining the stairwell are biblical verses….John 5:39, Proverbs 22:6
The Jefferson Memorial includes this quote from him. "God who gave us life have us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that his justice cannot sleep forever."

History is not on your side. Now today we no longer reflect this history….but to say that we never did…that we were always secular…is a crock of lies.

 

greatamerican said,

We were founded on those values….I am not saying that its people followed them to the letter because back then people don't and today they don't. Slavery was horrible and certainly not a biblical principle that Christ would condone. It is a dark blemish associated with Christianity. But to say that those people reflected Christ….they did not. The Constitution does not say anything about slavery…it talks about equality and God given rights. Yes we should pay taxes…and follow our laws…but never forget that Christ comes first…to stand on the Word before anything else. If the government said I had to kill someone or do something I find immoral that goes against the Word I would refuse. Christ wants people to follow and believe him because they love him not because they are forced. In America no one is forced to believe Christ….we have freedom to worship. But that is slowly being taken away and one day the Bible because of people obviously like you….will be considered hate speech. You want people like me silenced. That will never happen.

One example….now please comment on everything I have listed in my posts. I have more. So start on those and then when your done I have more.

 

George Washington
1st U.S. President

"While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian."
--The Writings of Washington, pp. 342-343.

John Adams
2nd U.S. President and Signer of the Declaration of Independence

"Suppose a nation in some distant Region should take the Bible for their only law Book, and every member should regulate his conduct by the precepts there exhibited! Every member would be obliged in conscience, to temperance, frugality, and industry; to justice, kindness, and charity towards his fellow men; and to piety, love, and reverence toward Almighty God ... What a Eutopia, what a Paradise would this region be."
--Diary and Autobiography of John Adams, Vol. III, p. 9.

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity. I will avow that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God."
--Adams wrote this on June 28, 1813, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson.


"The second day of July, 1776, will be the most memorable epoch in the history of America. I am apt to believe that it will be celebrated by succeeding generations as the great anniversary Festival. It ought to be commemorated, as the Day of Deliverance, by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty. It ought to be solemnized with pomp and parade, with shows, games, sports, guns, bells, bonfires and illuminations, from one end of this continent to the other, from this time forward forever."
--Adams wrote this in a letter to his wife, Abigail, on July 3, 1776.

Thomas Jefferson
3rd U.S. President, Drafter and Signer of the Declaration of Independence

"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever; That a revolution of the wheel of fortune, a change of situation, is among possible events; that it may become probable by Supernatural influence! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in that event."
--Notes on the State of Virginia, Query XVIII, p. 237.

John Hancock
1st Signer of the Declaration of Independence

"Resistance to tyranny becomes the Christian and social duty of each individual. ... Continue steadfast and, with a proper sense of your dependence on God, nobly defend those rights which heaven gave, and no man ought to take from us."
--History of the United States of America, Vol. II, p. 229.



Benjamin Franklin
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Unites States Constitution

"Here is my Creed. I believe in one God, the Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His Providence. That He ought to be worshipped.

That the most acceptable service we render to him is in doing good to his other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental points in all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.

As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left them to us, is the best the world ever saw, or is likely to see;

But I apprehend it has received various corrupting changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity; though it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the truth with less trouble. I see no harm, however, in its being believed, if that belief has the good consequence, as probably it has, of making his doctrines more respected and more observed; especially as I do not perceive, that the Supreme takes it amiss, by distinguishing the unbelievers in his government of the world with any peculiar marks of his displeasure."
--Benjamin Franklin wrote this in a letter to Ezra Stiles, President of Yale University on March 9, 1790.

 

Samuel Adams
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Father of the American Revolution

"And as it is our duty to extend our wishes to the happiness of the great family of man, I conceive that we cannot better express ourselves than by humbly supplicating the Supreme Ruler of the world that the rod of tyrants may be broken to pieces, and the oppressed made free again; that wars may cease in all the earth, and that the confusions that are and have been among nations may be overruled by promoting and speedily bringing on that holy and happy period when the kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ may be everywhere established, and all people everywhere willingly bow to the sceptre of Him who is Prince of Peace."
--As Governor of Massachusetts, Proclamation of a Day of Fast, March 20, 1797.


James Madison
4th U.S. President

"Cursed be all that learning that is contrary to the cross of Christ."
--America's Providential History, p. 93.


James Monroe
5th U.S. President

"When we view the blessings with which our country has been favored, those which we now enjoy, and the means which we possess of handing them down unimpaired to our latest posterity, our attention is irresistibly drawn to the source from whence they flow. Let us then, unite in offering our most grateful acknowledgments for these blessings to the Divine Author of All Good."
--Monroe made this statement in his 2nd Annual Message to Congress, November 16, 1818.


John Quincy Adams
6th U.S. President

"The hope of a Christian is inseparable from his faith. Whoever believes in the divine inspiration of the Holy Scriptures must hope that the religion of Jesus shall prevail throughout the earth. Never since the foundation of the world have the prospects of mankind been more encouraging to that hope than they appear to be at the present time. And may the associated distribution of the Bible proceed and prosper till the Lord shall have made 'bare His holy arm in the eyes of all the nations, and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God' (Isaiah 52:10)."
--Life of John Quincy Adams, p. 248.


Roger Sherman
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and United States Constitution

"I believe that there is one only living and true God, existing in three persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, the same in substance equal in power and glory. That the scriptures of the old and new testaments are a revelation from God, and a complete rule to direct us how we may glorify and enjoy him. That God has foreordained whatsoever comes to pass, so as thereby he is not the author or approver of sin. That he creates all things, and preserves and governs all creatures and all their actions, in a manner perfectly consistent with the freedom of will in moral agents, and the usefulness of means. That he made man at first perfectly holy, that the first man sinned, and as he was the public head of his posterity, they all became sinners in consequence of his first transgression, are wholly indisposed to that which is good and inclined to evil, and on account of sin are liable to all the miseries of this life, to death, and to the pains of hell forever.

I believe that God having elected some of mankind to eternal life, did send his own Son to become man, die in the room and stead of sinners and thus to lay a foundation for the offer of pardon and salvation to all mankind, so as all may be saved who are willing to accept the gospel offer: also by his special grace and spirit, to regenerate, sanctify and enable to persevere in holiness, all who shall be saved; and to procure in consequence of their repentance and faith in himself their justification by virtue of his atonement as the only meritorious cause.

I believe a visible church to be a congregation of those who make a credible profession of their faith in Christ, and obedience to him, joined by the bond of the covenant.

I believe that the souls of believers are at their death made perfectly holy, and immediately taken to glory: that at the end of this world there will be a resurrection of the dead, and a final judgement of all mankind, when the righteous shall be publicly acquitted by Christ the Judge and admitted to everlasting life and glory, and the wicked be sentenced to everlasting punishment."
--The Life of Roger Sherman, pp. 272-273.

Benjamin Rush
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Ratifier of the U.S. Constitution

"The gospel of Jesus Christ prescribes the wisest rules for just conduct in every situation of life. Happy they who are enabled to obey them in all situations!"
--The Autobiography of Benjamin Rush, pp. 165-166.


John Witherspoon
Signer of the Declaration of Independence, Clergyman and President of Princeton University

"While we give praise to God, the Supreme Disposer of all events, for His interposition on our behalf, let us guard against the dangerous error of trusting in, or boasting of, an arm of flesh ... If your cause is just, if your principles are pure, and if your conduct is prudent, you need not fear the multitude of opposing hosts.

What follows from this? That he is the best friend to American liberty, who is most sincere and active in promoting true and undefiled religion, and who sets himself with the greatest firmness to bear down profanity and immorality of every kind.

Whoever is an avowed enemy of God, I scruple not to call him an enemy of his country."
--Sermon at Princeton University, "The Dominion of Providence over the Passions of Men," May 17, 1776.



Alexander Hamilton
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Ratifier of the U.S. Constitution

"I have carefully examined the evidences of the Christian religion, and if I was sitting as a juror upon its authenticity I would unhesitatingly give my verdict in its favor. I can prove its truth as clearly as any proposition ever submitted to the mind of man."
--Famous American Statesmen, p. 126.

 

Patrick Henry
Ratifier of the U.S. Constitution

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here."
--The Trumpet Voice of Freedom: Patrick Henry of Virginia, p. iii.

John Jay
1st Chief Justice of the U.S. Supreme Court and President of the American Bible Society

"By conveying the Bible to people thus circumstanced, we certainly do them a most interesting kindness. We thereby enable them to learn that man was originally created and placed in a state of happiness, but, becoming disobedient, was subjected to the degradation and evils which he and his posterity have since experienced.

The Bible will also inform them that our gracious Creator has provided for us a Redeemer, in whom all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; that this Redeemer has made atonement "for the sins of the whole world," and thereby reconciling the Divine justice with the Divine mercy has opened a way for our redemption and salvation; and that these inestimable benefits are of the free gift and grace of God, not of our deserving, nor in our power to deserve."
--In God We Trust—The Religious Beliefs and Ideas of the American Founding Fathers, p. 379.

"In forming and settling my belief relative to the doctrines of Christianity, I adopted no articles from creeds but such only as, on careful examination, I found to be confirmed by the Bible."
--American Statesman Series, p. 360.

 

Churchmouse still cannot grasp that the 1st amendment precludes us from being a Christian nation, and her positions seem to be ignorant of the fact that a nation founded by people of a Christian persuasion does not a Christian nation make. Her position also places entirely too much weight on the religious beliefs of people alive 225 years ago. Many of these founders she claims where Christians were also slave owners, also a prevalent practice of the day(like Christianity was). Why does she not say we were founded as a pro-slavery nation because some of our founders were pro-slavery?

 

Cant ever address anything on the table…..LMAO

Where was the separation of state you pagans think was there?