Why don't atheists hate Santa Claus?

I know you're not stupid enough to think any adults actually believe in Santa so why are you posting such a blatant lie?

 

Who is forcing you to believe in anything?

And no, being an atheist means you do not believe in God. You believe in many things without proof. Like aliens? That the sun will rise tomorrow? That your friends actually care about you? That your money is actually worth something? That when you get on an airplane you will not fall from the sky because its been maintained properly? And many, many, many other things.

You have over stated yourself by a wide margin.

 

Because there are several of you coreligionists stating that they cannot disprove Santa.

Oddly, your contempt for them is entirely absent. Typical atheist double standards. So much for your poster name.

 

I think you misunderstood me again. I have to be really really careful to make myself clear to avoid this in future. My point was, that if an Atheist wishes to celebrate Christmas and give presents to their kids, it's not up to anybody else to judge them for it. It's not up to us Atheists to judge you for your practices. And this is what you've done in post #23 by saying:

Hence My defense of people who practice what they choose. And to give you a peace of mind: I don't believe in Aliens until I see them. And due to scientific evidence it's very likely that the sun will rise tomorrow... But I don't want to go into that.

 

All well and good, but when you pick and choose and expect tolerance, you don;t then get to turn around and attack religion ... while celebrating Christmas ... because that is harmless, but religion leads to theocracy and killing? And that is exactly what BTTR was claiming wasn't he?

 

I personally think religion actually leads to more violence and hate than if you have no religion, because humans use the contant of an old book to make others followers, who commit the most horrible acts imaginable. I'm not sure that the peace of mind religion creates for so many people justifies the killings, torture, rape, abuse, etc. done in it's name. The more fanatic someone is about their religion (doesn't really matter which one) the more dangerous they are. I personally tend to avoid these people, because they tend to be rather agressive very quickly if they find you disagree with them. Here I was actually expecting more of a dialog on the matter not an argument.

So I do think everybody should fall in the same category. No exceptions! One is state, which we all are a part of and one is church, which some are a part of. Churches should pay taxes just like any other institution and priests should get arrested if they molest children. I don't think that "faith" - no matter how deep - should excuse anybody for their actions. In todays society we do not allow molestation and therefore everyone of those people should be under arrest. So if you brake the law, I don't think you should be excluded from procession if you believe in god. And since law evolves with it's people, it's more likely that they are more up to date to the society's needs than the bible.

But to make myself clear: I'm not disrespectful to any religion no matter how strange some parts may seem to me. And I'm not forcing or trying to convince anybody to become an atheist, but this term is the closest to what we have to describe what my "relationship" with religion/god.

Back to topic: Yes atheists should dismiss the idea of Santa Clause and it's celebration, but like everybody else they are entitled to do whatever they think is right. If they choose to celebrate Santa Clause and call themselves atheists, so be it.


P.S.: I cannot comment on what BTTR claims. It's up to him to explain himself. I can only present my view on the matter...

 

That is funny because over the last century alone, atheism tied to political power has caused more death an destruction than say ... ALL the Crusades and Inquisitions combined. In fact, the deliberate removal of religion, and putting in place a revolutionary zeal erased standards of conduct and turned men in to literal instruments of death and destruction. I suggest you take a look at the barbarity of the Eastern Front in WWII, and understand that there are very good reasons why it was so much more barbaric then what was happening on the Western Front of North Africa.

What you write is an oft claimed bit of atheist propaganda, but a quick look at the historical record clearly shows it to false.

Which BTW - it exactly what BTTR claims as well. It seems your view, wrong and non-factual as it may be, is rather common in atheism? Now why is that?

Tell me how adhering to religion somehow magically makes you prone to violence? But, if you choose atheism, you are suddenly a pacifist who would never be violent? That seems a bit of leap from a belief that is simply the rejection of God doesn't it? And yet ... here you claim just that?

 

Atheists don't hate anyone, so why would someone be so foolish as to presume that they do? Atheists lack a belief in a god or gods. That's the only thing all Atheists have in common.

 

Sure it is ... and that is relevant as to why so many of you claim they hate religion because it is fake ... but are making excuses for Santa, or even having problems attempting to disprove Santa ... because clearly, when you don;t believe in God, common things that everyone else can disprove .. become magically difficult for atheists?

In short, you are looking to change the subject by typing in some random atheist propoganda, eh?

 

First off a person cannot hate something they do not believe in, jeeeez.
Secondly, those that believe in Santa Claus do not try and pass laws that force others to live by their beliefs.
So, we have here another thread fail by the Cricket.

 

More propaganda.

You hate God, blame him for everything from periods to ... theocracy. While claiming that you cannot hate anything you don;t believe in ... except ...

And of course, these antics are all about preventing theocracy ... which America has never been in danger of since its founding and is in no danger of now.

Atheists are quite silly.

 

Yeah, but don't you have a problem with parents teaching their children about Santa Claus - they're teaching children to have a role model in a big selfish greedy magic man who gives presents to "good boys and girls" while children in Africa starve

 

You just made a direct parallel between Santa and God. Santa acts in mysterious ways!

 

I hadn't realized Christians believe Santa is a real person. Was I wrong?

 

Well, its apparently atheists that are struggling with the ability to prove him false. Odd that you would not seem to notice that.

We just wonder why you think both God and Santa are fake, but can't seem to actually prove either one fake ... while railing against only God? What is this Santa that you cannot disprove show up and forces a Santocracy onto everyone? Send angry red nosed reindeer to maintain order and silence dissention? What then atheists?

 

You may have noticed that you're the one in this topic constantly on the attack. Why? Why is it a problem to you if others don't share your beliefs? And why is that an attack against your religion or your beliefs if someone doesn't share them? Your post lead me to believe that you think people here attack you for being Christian. This doesn't make sense. Atheist are not a club or group. They don't go around and try to convince you your beliefs are wrong and you have to replace them. Atheists usually just share one thing: The disbelief of a god. But that's about it. So there are as many versions of "atheism" as there are atheist people. Some may choose to disbelief in god, yet choose to practice parts of religion maybe even follow some it's teaching. Because it doesn't say in an book what atheist should limit themselves too. And others don't get to make that decision for us. Also you don't get to label us! It's unfair for Christians to label what other groups of people can do and what the can't do, just like we can't label or call you names simply because of your approach to religion.

And like I stated before, you're confirming my experiences: Religious people who do not understand something become agressive if they feel someone disagrees with them.

Why is it a problem if some people do not believe in God, and why is it a problem if some people don't believe in Santa Claus? Why aren't we free to do what we want without getting attacked and insulted?

 

Kiddo, how much time have you spend on this forum?

How many times have you been called a rapist? A slaver? An idiot? Had your beliefs called a dire threat to the US Constitution? How many times have you corrected egregious lies about your faith, only to be attacked and ridiculed? But you are victim?

Because I strongly reject atheism and what it has become? Because I see the propagandistic effects of deliberate miseducation in atheism? Tell me, why are you upset that say ... I challenged D's decision to simply claim that my faith was selfevidentally coercive? That makes you a victim when I stand up to an atheist who routinely banters that about, eh?

How about a poster telling us that religion is root of violence in the world? A poster who has made the same dim witted accusation dozens of times? Should I not correct that? Is it wrong to point out that by the standards, even YOU, judge by, your faith is equally is not more guilty? Nah, that is aggression and bigotry when done toward atheism? Not when done toward the religious though?

And then there is the constant drivel about hell. One atheist after another attacks us for believing in the concept, claiming we are hurting children with it? Only they leave off heaven, repentance, forgiveness, grace .... and the idea of consequences are avoided entirely. Its bad to co-opt kids with 'fake' things. But Santa is good? And when caught in the duplicity, its actually atheists who have been victimized by it?

Or perhaps you mean the atheists who pointed out the contradictions in the Bible, without being able to list any mine you, who clearly hadn't read the Bible? Much like D's repeatedly claims of mastery and assurance that Christianity is bunk? That requires tolerance and respect rather than dismissal does it?

Tell me, now that you know that I disagree emphatically with you faith choice, where is that tolerance you desire so much? Or are you not just resorting to aggression? Claiming that you have been wronged by having the above ideas dismissed?

Well, I am going to ask you the same question I ask every atheist: who taught you that stuff? And what gives them the right to maliciously spread deliberate misinformation and false claims about someone else's faith ... in a debate forum of places, and think that its just supposed to be tolerated and accepted?

I will say it again. Atheism is just another faith choice. It is no more wrong than any other faith, but, given that it cannot agree on anything beyond on sentence, it sure as hell isn't any more right. Its the later part of atheistic claims, and its need to derisively put down other faiths, that I reject utterly.

Now, just out of curiosity, what do you think of a man who blames a heavily secularized French Judical System on Muslims? But only when it fails?

Yep, I think that is a pretty damb dishonest thing to do, but one of the posters you defend, and atheist, did just that. Please tell me what I should respect in that behavior.

 

I am going to ask again since the question was too hard for you; do Christians believe that Santa is real? Are they making claims that he is real? Is there anyone here making the claim that Santa Claus is a real person?

If they are please show us so that we may ask that person for the evidence of Santa's existence.

 

a better question is why do Christians teach their children to believe in Santa? some might call that ironic...

.

 

Yes - I.

Read what I wrote here.

 

Yes - I.

What do you like to know about Santa?

http://youtu.be/X2wvjff15Ro

 

Considering the question was answered, why are you asking it again?

There are several atheists posters making the usual argument from absurdity. Feigning ignorance all around is not a very successful debate strategy.

Now, as you cannot seem to find any of the answers in this single thread, why are you claiming that I am the one struggling with this?

I am however curious as to what happens when evil Santa shows up and establishes his Santocracy? As we are all about avoiding questions and what not, I notice you failed entirely to answer that?

But no, Santa is not believed to be real, and its the Christians pointing out how logic can be used to prove that. Its atheists claiming repeatedly that you cannot ... nor any invisible thing. Which of course, Santa is not invisible ... I know silly.

But its atheism for you.

 

I am not asking if you believed he WAS a real person, I am asking if you believe he is a real living person now who rides a magic sleigh pulled by 8 magic reindeer and manages to deliver presents to children all over the world in one night.

Do you believe in THAT Santa? And are you making a claim that THAT Santa is in fact real person living at the North Pole today?

 

Standard atheist answer from this thread. YOU cannot disprove that so ... well, what is it you atheists think?

I disproved it, and several atheists disagreed. Now you are here asking the question like its obvious or something? In fact, I used the North Pole in my disproof of Santa. Odd.

Now, I am wondering where all those atheists are now that an atheist is sounding oddly a lot like me? But still pissed at me?

 

Because you did not answer it. Do you believe Santa is a real person and are you claiming he is a real living person who delivers toys in a single night on a magic sleigh with 8 magical reindeer?

Debating WHAT? Has anyone here actually made the claim yet that Santa is a real living person? I read through the entire thread and saw nobody make this claim. Only one person showed that historically Saint Nicholas was a real person who lived and died but nobody has claimed that there is a fat, jolly man who is called Santa and who is still alive, lives at the North Pole and delivers presents to all children in the world within one night of the year.

Because you failed to answer such a simple question and you are still failing to answer the question. Do you believe Santa is real or not?

So you believe Santa is a real person and is establishing his Santocracy upon us? I just need to clarify that you are making this claim and that you believe it is a fact first before we continue.

I am still lost here. When has anyone made the claim that the very alive and very magical version of Santa is in fact a real person? Please enlighten me.