Another way to look at minimum wage

This is his reply after I finally got him to answer the question of "Did you ever live under Communism yourself, or is this just theory for you?"

 

This is true to a degree.

Yes, they do. These predatory flirtations do not evolve without the qualms of the lonely or wandering eye.

Then you clearly don't believe in a democracy, only the hyper faux charade that fills your veins with that lubricant known as excitement. It starts with one person at a time, and being a flirty little wh0re isn't necessary unless you suffer from severe body-dysmorphia—in which case it ought to be an open door to gaining self-esteem & social insight into breaking out of the system of vanity, rather than a crutch or excuse. It is in my deep insight as a priest & counselor, as well as high-end marketing, that those who are promiscuous only pretend to be the victims of broken relationships for the added attention & drama. It is predation; the few people who actually are victims, within the "capitalist democracy" known as America tend to circumstantially & with a double-standard be referred to as a sl*ts, liars, victimizers, and pathetic weaklings in need of some confidence because they're "disgusting"; meanwhile, histrionic shadows who flirt & use people win the sob stories & sympathy that is rightfully owed to the people you would normally deem "disgusting", when in fact they should be the ones persecuted for using acting, flirtation, & flattery to bend the truth into their benefit.

It's a double standard. The true sl*ts who victimize get the pity & sympathy because people worship the prostitutes of theater, and glorify the predators off screen as well who pretend to be the "lonely poor victims" when they're actually the sociopaths. The truly abused get self-help books kicked in their face because they radiate an inner need.

America doesn't want to help the needy; they want to play dress-up with actors & predators in double-standards, & victimize the needy. This system is extremely broken, and you are entirely WRONG in your thinking that it doesn't start one courageous person & chastiser at a time to set things right.

In other words, the internal ecstasy individuals share together is something petty and to be experienced as common as having a coffee—but God forbid you word it this way … No, it take away from the shadowy game you like to play where you pretend that skinning people alive for the exploitation of pleasure or resources is also somehow "romance" or "love", both which you have no clue what they are.

I'm going to confront you and expose you for your fraud: You have no clue what romance & love actually is, and far less the importance these forces play. Instead you'd rather coerce the sheep into damaging the definitions for personal amusements & "liberal freedoms". You're a sham.

 

And if I do, what will the person who now gets paid for doing that for me do for a job?

Raise the minimum wage and he will soon find out.

 

Actually, no one has ever lived under a strict communist system. All of the attempts have failed.

Communism's defenders always tell us the failures are the result of unscrupulous individuals who decided to benefit themselves instead of properly managing the system. "Mistakes were made". Somehow corruption managed to abrogate the wonderful goals. If only the right, dedicated, selfless people were running the system paradise on earth would be available for all to see.

Oddly those people just never can seem to be be found. But, there is nothing wrong with the system. Nothing at all. People will love it once we find just the right people to put it in place as it is envisioned and then find people who won't act in their own best interest to corrupt it and then find people who won't "make mistakes" like murdering resisters who won't comply like Mao in the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution in which murderers carrying the "little red book" ravaged the countryside eliminating those who had not fully adopted Mao's definition of communism. Oh, and before that Mao had initiated the Great Leap Forward

It just seems that the great paradise of Communism just can't seem to be implemented without murder of millions of people. But, boy, when its put in place it will be GREAT!!!! If there are any left alive.

 

I also own a business so let me tell YOU...

I wouldn't think of paying my people less than $15/ hr because I understand that a good work force makes ME money.

I have zero turnover and near zero absenteeism.

My people feel invested in the business.

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I DO own a business genius.

I make a great product and a good living. I don't expect to get rich off my employees labor

 

When I go fishing I want to catch either a lot of fish or a trophy. But there's no guarantee in spite of a lifetime of experience. Same for hunting. I want my veggie garden to produce huge amounts of bug/disease free vegetables. Again, no guarantees. But never in my life have I taken a job requiring zero experience, and expected to settle down, marry, buy a home and raise a family on that salary. Only in some virtual reality fantasy would such a thing be possible, like flying the Wright Brothers first plane to the moon, while eating baloney sandwiches.

 

If it's in your self interest to follow $15/hr wage, then why would the government need to legislate higher wages? This was also Rockefeller's approach, it's worth noting.

Just out of curiosity, what type of business do you run?

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't know if Joe Burger Flipper should get 15$ per hour. But I have to say that military also gets free healthcare for life, and for their family. That is a massive amount of money. And free college if they choose.

 

A lot of people seem to believe that these fast food jobs are available for anyone with a few free hours to work. The reality of fast food and retail 'casual' employment these days does not allow for that. These workers are expected to work whatever hours they are given regardless of their own schedules. Through this practice employers monopolize their employees time and the only people who can actually work in these so-called casual part time jobs need to be available to work at any time. They are expected to work split shifts and be on call to come in whenever they are wanted for a shift as short as 1 hour. This new on demand employment scheme precludes part time workers the ability to have more than one job or to go to school because if they refuse to come in they are not called in again.

This has become common practice in the fast food and retail space and is a big reason why the demand for higher pay by these workers has risen. A few states have moved to outlaw or regulate the on demand labour practice by retail and fast food establishments after determining it an egregious violation of the employer employee relationship.

If you go into any fast food establishment in an urban area these days there are no teenagers or students behind the counter, they are mostly new immigrants or minorities trying to support families.

Your meme is in need of a reality check.

 

Because far too many people think like you

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Not true. They don't get free med for life unless they retire from the military (does Tricare cover everything?) and they certainly don't get free college

 

Liberals kind of founded the country. I'm sorry people still have some knee-jerk biases in the direction of freedom.

Again, what sort of business do you run? And if the best way to go is to give workers more so that you don't have to deal with a bunch of turnover, this gives you a competitive edge against other businesses doesn't it?

 

Correct. All of the world's socialist states never withered away into stateless communism because they had yet to resolve the contradictions necessary for that event.

Actually, they failed due to systematic flaws. A proto-capitalist class formed and instituted revisionism. All Marxist theorists today disagree on how exactly to solve this problem.

I believe that democracy and socialism can only be maintained through constant scrutiny of elected officials and transparency in the government. A central government must exist for economic planning purposes, but it must keep no secrets and must be directly accountable to the people. My thought is based on both Foucault's work on power and on the maoist theorists of the 90s.

i'm really bored of addressing the same arguments over and over again

i'd really appreciate it if liberals came up with new things to say

i could explain why i think you're wrong, but i'll just have to do it again for the next person who thinks they're original, so why bother?

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oh boy i've never heard this before

also, how does this follow from "I've never lived in a socialist state, but support one because all of the reading I've done has shown it to be superior to capitalism"?

It seems like you really just want to jerk yourself off over how much better you are than everyone else rather than putting in a good faith effort at a conversation.

Yes, you are indeed masturbating over how righteous you are and how everyone else is wretched and evil and isn't just a normal human being with a different perspective.

Get over yourself.

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The term 'means of production' refers to the technology used to produce at large scales.

 

It's a micro brewery. And I'm not necessarily looking to gain a competitive advantage on anyone. I'm tryin to produce the best product possible. I guess THAT is where I gain that advantage although that's not the actual aim. The product is.

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Thank you. That was my point

 

And yet that technology doesn't drop from the sky on the backs of unicorns. That technology must be produced somehow. As we were discussing, technology is produced by individuals who labor with their bodies. You said individuals should be free to trade the products of that labor. Are you now recanting this claim? "People are free to use their bodies as they like."

I think you must, because you also said:

This does not jive with your first claim that people are free to use their bodies as they like. If they produce something with those bodies you're going to take it from them. Moreover, you claim ownership of the means they used to produce that thing (their bodies).

 

You have just described the true essence of the Communist system. You, your body and mind belong to the state. The state will determine your destiny.

CB says transparency in government will lead to the utopia of command socialism. He has admitted that there have been intrinsic flaws in the past attempts to create the system of perfect communism, mostly inserted because of human frailties. I maintain that the perfect, selfless human being does not exist and for communist systems to remain a paradise without degenerating into autocratic systems that murder and enslave to maintain control of other humans who would demand personal autonomy to define their own lives many of those perfect, selfless humans would have to emerge and be in charge of the system. Further, many many MORE selfless, perfect humans would have to continue to be born and rise to take charge for it to continue to exist.

Instead we haven't found those people. We have instead murderers like Mao, Stalin, Pol Pot and millions are dead, millions more forced into slavery to the state in the furtherance of a system that cannot exist.

 

And just like the attempts at "perfect communism" has resulted in Stalins etc...attempts at unfettered capitalism has brought about some real horrors as well.

O why are we focusing on those extremes when neither is the reality?

 

The means of production are collectively operated. Therefore they must be collectively owned. Ownership must be directly tied to usage. If you don't use it, it shouldn't be considered to belong to you.

Your entire argument is based upon playing word games and deliberately misunderstanding me.

I never claim that it's wrong to do trading that consists only of you using your bodies as you wish. I added that this becomes increasingly absurd as the contradictions that drive trading are resolved, but I never condemned it.

In addition: The means of production still does not refer to human bodies.

 

Unfettered capitalism horrors? I don't recall in history where capitalists imposed mass murder on citizens in the tens of millions trying to create a perfect world. History is replete with examples of communism using the force of armies to do that. Don't recall a steel baron having tens of thousands of troops and an entire country's government at his disposal to murder civilians

 

It's because of bad trade deals and excessive regulations.

 

Capitalism was pretty rampant (although as corrupt as it usually gets with no regulation) under the Hitler regime.

And then we had the period between the Civil War and WWII as another example of what unfettered capitalism gets ya

It was called the Gilded Age...although the only thing gilded was the wallpaper in the rich suckers houses.

 

You mean NATIONAL SOCIALISM? Those Nazis? Where the government controlled and dictated the means of production? Don't think its unfettered capitalism when the government can kill you if you don't produce what they want.

The era between the Civil War and WWII was the era in which the US went from a poor agrarian society to a modern industrial one. Don't think we want to go back to most folks being farmers. I take that back. There are some envirowackos who would love to see the US become a largely agrarian society again.