Sensible Austrailian Gun Laws

Discussion in 'Gun Control' started by Small Town Guy, Jul 2, 2017.

  1. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    What rational basis do you have for this statement?
     
  2. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    This is an issue where rhetorical excess does seem to be more the rule than the exception; but to be perfectly honest I agree with the general sentiment expressed by the good doctor, at least insofar as the philosophy of self-protection versus other philosophies.

    I have been involved with studying the realities of crime and violence most of my adult life. I have been involved in seminars on the subject involving law enforcement from all over the world. In the end, it is easy to get into hyperbole and discussions about one's virtue or size of one's "equipment"; but in reality the fact is that no matter how well trained a person is in martial arts they are not as effective unarmed as they are armed. Bad things happen to good people no matter where you are in the world, and in my opinion it makes more sense for good people to be equipped - and ARMED - to face criminal violence. If more people chose to do that, the less crime we'd have in the long run.

    Yes, I know that the next statement is the one about: "If that were true the United States would be the safest nation on Earth", but there's one big problem with that. Too few Americans choose to take responsibility for their own security and do what is necessary. Too many abdicate their responsibilities to other parties (police, security, etc.) and too many that do choose to be armed do not pursue that decision to its proper and responsible extent.

    I acknowledge that a free society is at greater risk than an authoritarian one. In a nation where the people are free, that means there are more opportunities for the amoral predators to cause harm. When the people don't accept the responsibilities inherent to living in a free society, the amoral run riot. It is up to us, as citizens, to stand up to the societal predators and interdict them. It is sad that so few people realize that.
     
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  3. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    While I can't speak
    I was given my first pocket knife at 3. Since, I have never been without one. A pocket knife is probably the tool I have found most useful throughout my life. I consider myself an expert with a blade in a self defense scenario, having learned from expert knife fighters with actual experience... and have taught using knives for SD as well as teaching LE in both the awareness of danger of knives and defense against them for years, and have demonstrated to those that have martial arts expert abilities how difficult it is to defend from an attack from a real expert. All the Hollywood depictions, most You Tube experts, etc. show unrealistic and bunk from those that haven't been in a knife fight; I have and have the remanent scars of nearly 200 stitches, some self administered, to show for it. That all said, I have never carried a knife primarily for self defense, but as a tool. Banning them, in my opinion is not unlike banning any tool, hammers, screw drivers, wrenches, etc.
    I could easily fill an entire thread on the topic of knives, from selection, design, to SD. I usually carry two to three on me daily, each suited for a different range of tasks, but my most useful is an Hanwei Citizen three position knife, a design copied from Ray Appleton, with a 1.25" blade that is probably not only the most useful, but which I can use to effectively defend myself if needed.
    I equate knives with the emergence of humans where blades and hammer stones, being the earliest tools in the palentological record as far back as 2-3million years, that helped began our path in the evolutionary emergence of our kind. In hunting for signs of human early occupation, the presence of knives and evidence of their production is often used to focus searches for remains. Knives and their use predate all law and are in separable from what it means to be human...banning them should never be allowed.
    BTW, I almost always carry one or more tactical pens. With minimal training they can be used for very effective SD even in most instances where a knife might be used and can be taken in nearly every place, and every country where guns and knives might not be allowed. All mine also double as a writing instrument...Lol.
     
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  4. Dispondent

    Dispondent Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Since it bugs the heck out of me when foreigners interfere with American gun rights, I defer this to the people of Australia. They will get whatever they deserve...
     
  5. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    I am not sure the knives law are as heavily enforced.

    I.e. everyone would have one going fishing.

    But in general knives are common/necessary in and around the house.

    Eitherway, it is what it is, I live here and I don't have any complaints about it. Trust me I will let you know of the laws of the land I disagree with - see fireworks comment.
     
  6. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    I think I have expressed the why very clearly throughout the rest of the thread.
     
  7. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    Bolded is exactly the issue being talked about here.

    If all you were doing was something out of a safety precaution you wouldn't be walking around boasting about it like a ...... it would be like putting a seat belt on / putting gloves on and I am sure many use guns in such a fashion.

    However, I am sure you can see yourself that the discussion about the size of your equipment does less for your cause and in a country with a different philosophy towards that type of "equipment" then your own may be a whole lot less forgiving.

    TBH australians would probably laugh thinking you were making a joke we are not a harsh people. But we do not take kindly to dickheads, and this forum, the cool club does very little in censoring its favourite peoples behaviour when they walk down this path so long as they tow the line of guns are good... mmmmkay.
     
  8. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    So, you can't describe your rational basis. Thank you.
     
  9. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    That is not what I said, you trying to speak for me belittles you and shows you for the type of individual you are.

    Speak your mind by all means. But do not try and speak for me and to do so in such a rude fashion is quite frankly shameful. You should be ashamed of your behaviour. Would you discuss this issue with someone like this in real life?
     
  10. Turtledude

    Turtledude Well-Known Member Donor

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    pretty sad testament as to a nanny state
     
  11. papabear

    papabear Active Member

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    The price we pay to have less knives on the street.

    Is to hold less knives on our person as we go out of our home. But we pay it, and to be honest the only real outrage over nanny state in our state has been the restriction on alcohol and serving times in Kings Cross (the party district) laws pretty much shut this place down, I disagreed with it, so did a lot of people but it is done now and we will find out at the next election whether it was good for current govt in terms of retaining power.
     
  12. Rucker61

    Rucker61 Well-Known Member

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    How is the no knife law enforced?
     
  13. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Ok then -- please describe your rational basis for your statement; please don't be lazy and tell me to look it up.
    Thank you
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2017
  14. DoctorWho

    DoctorWho Well-Known Member

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    *************************

    Reading comprehension.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2017
  15. 6Gunner

    6Gunner Banned

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    Sorry, but that doesn't hold water with me. Anyone can put on a seat belt or put gloves on. Still helpful and functional actions, but nothing more. Sure, there are those to whom carrying a gun is a purely functional act they have no more interest in than I have in putting on a seat belt; sadly, too many police officers handle carrying a firearm in exactly the same way. Unfortunately, that makes them horribly ill-equipped to actually use that firearm well.

    To develop real skill in anything - music, art, sport - it takes dedication to develop it. That dedication springs from a passion for the subject being studied. I freely admit that owning and using firearms is not just a utilitarian act but also something I have a passion for. It is a passion instilled in me by my grandfather, a police officer who carried a firearm every day of his life in one form or other ever since the age of five. Firearms put food on the table and protected the home and created quality time with his father and grandfather. As a law-enforcement officer, his skill with firearms brought him advancement and respect from his peers, and saved his life more than once. His passion for the subject of firearms, from their history and their development to their application, led to his dedication to studying their use. He loved that I also was interested, and he encouraged that in me. Some of my most enjoyable, precious memories of my grandfather was time spent at his side learning about our mutual interests. When I followed him into the ranks of law-enforcement, the skill I developed under the mentorship of my grandfather not only brought me kudos from my peers but saved my own life more than once.

    Now, I don't expect everyone to be as deeply immersed in the subject as I am. But, I don't hesitate to share what I've learned and to offer up the benefits having even a basic yet functional level of skill can bring to one's life and personal security.

    Well, my own reference to "equipment" was meant to be a tongue-in-cheek attempt at humor furthering my point about the negative rhetoric... but since it's the gun control advocates who spend so much time accusing gun owners of "compensation" I think it remains a valid point. That particular line of hyperbole was initiated by the gun control side, but these days I'm often surprised at how reflexively defensive gun control advocates get when gun rights people respond in kind. You say you "don't take kindly to dickheads", but there are far more of such on your side of the divide than mine IMHO.
     
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  16. Small Town Guy

    Small Town Guy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2017/07/australian-gun-culture-safe-storage-and.html?m=1

    The aussies will wake one day and all this BS will go away, eh
     
  17. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    This requirement, if put in place here, would violate the Constitution.
     

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