Want an Example of What Socialism Is Today?

You can't confiscate something from a mutual agreement (contract) to work for pay. The only way to confiscate is to use forced labor for free or in this case, confiscate property that is not yours.

 

huh? "from"? "from a mutual agreement"? I don't follow you.

huh? You're not being clear. Your government (police) often confiscate property by decree, with no forced labor involved.

...by law, .... capitalist law .... capitalist law that allows for private ownership and private profit appropriated from the value that workers' labor produces. So "not yours" by capitalist law in this case. But in terms of reality? Workers had an unrealized participation in the value and profit created. So is it justified? Not according to capitalist law. But objectively? The government must have seen the justice in the workers' actions as the government did not oppose them.

 

if you quote Hayek to me about history then you have lost any credibility you might have wished to gain by engaging me. Hayek in many ways was similar to Ayn Rand in that his total experience with "socialism" was framed by communism and/or Nazism. Both Stalin and Hitler were indeed totalitarian dictators. The socialism Hayek labeled was not remotely linked to the type of socialist capitalism any of us are encouraging or complimenting today. Hayek was a biased man, his entire world view was shaped by his circumstances. His opinions and books reflect his personal bias. There is really nothing more to say about the man.

 

ObamaCare.

 

And totalitarianism is required to enforce gov control. Gov control of business is the Road to Serfdom. And that's what we see in the EU.

Your characterization of Hayek is amusing. And I have no interest in engaging anyone who claims that "his total experience with "socialism" was framed by communism and/or Nazism." Your post illustrates the juvenile lazy thinking tactic of smearing someone and using that as justification for personally censoring his ideas. We see this in full blown action on college campuses today.

Why is it that the globally Hayek's economic principles are being implemented and gov command/control policies are being discarded ??

 

WIC.

Your turn. (I'm not sure what we're doing but you're next I think.)

 

Dodd Frank.

 

Trickle-down

 

Not when the money is pooled from a capitalist economic system. Those are simply social programs to promote the general welfare and common defense.

 

What does that have to do with the economy ?? You ran out already ??

 

And capitalism is the best way to generate tax revenues to pay for those social programs. The progressive liberals are so dense that they refuse to implement the very economic system that generates the most tax revenues for their gov command and control social programs. It's breathtakingly stupid.

 

Well, some of them are coming around. Advocating instead for taxing the hell out of capitalism and simply calling it socialism.

 

Hayek's economics were not founded upon data, like the other Austrians he created a conclusion and then made up a world view that supported that conclusion. Can you tell me why you claim that his life experiences prior to writing "The road to serfdom" in 1944 were not shaped by communism or by the rise of Nazism? There were no other forms of demand driven economies in the world at that time, none. His linkage of unions to the rise of fascism is preposterous, are you arguing that Hitler came to power because he was a union organizer? His entire book was an appeal to authority, his authority. He made claims that were not based upon research or empirical analysis, he relied upon his political views to shape the entire book. He is the darling of libertarians which tells me that he was both a dreamer and a naive man. Why you would be quoting this man whose entire worldview was shaped by events created by outlier regimes that have disappeared from the face of the earth is beyond me. Central planning as argued by Hayek occurred in Hitlers Germany in order to support a global war. Central planning by Stalin was about creating a new world order based upon communism, fear and war. Do you think anyone on the left today wants any of these foundations to drive our economy and social structures? Hayek believed that going one step towards "socialism" led inevitably to communism or fascism. Is Canada a fascist state? Is Sweden communist? Hell, is China communist? Sorry, Hayek was a joke.

 

That's not coming around. It's policy that reduces economic growth. Economic growth is the only way to generate increased tax revenues and jobs. The liberal progressives are so dense that they haven't figured out that the Laffer curve works both ways.

 

Demand driven economics doesn't exist. It is the production of wealth that ensures the maximum rate of increase in the standard of living which progressively benefits the low income quintiles. Keep government control out of the economy and the economy will grow at it's maximum rate.

Are you kidding me - " Central planning .... occurred in Hitlers Germany in order to support a global war" ?? That's absurd.

 

Supply side economics works. History clearly shows that. There is no such thing as trickle down economics.

 

I thought the right was all about empowering Blue Collar workers and getting them to save there jobs?

 

Since when do we promote lawlessness and anarchy, those are a lefty trait.

 

Coming around from advocating for ACTUAL socialism to advocating instead for taxing the hell out of capitalism and simply calling it socialism.

 

It's fundamentally the same thing. Using the tax code and federal regulations to control business is socialism.

 

I'll give you an example of Socialism today: the British National Health Service.

And before we get a shoal of criticism, I would point out that the life expectancy in the UK is 3 years longer than in the US.

 

The tax code which allows medical insurance deductions on corporate form 1120 for elite corporate interests which benefit wealthy suburbanites is corporate communism. Only a treasonous ant-American bolshevist applauds such elitism.

 

say again?

 

The history of employer supplied health insurance is rooted in wage policy of the second world war.

Your post is ill informed.

 

This reply tells me you know absolutely nothing about the subject matter at all and are likely some talk radio listener eating this crap up. The fact that you do not know that the main premise of his book was about demand driven economies is a huge tell, you really know nothing about Hayek or his political screed that libertarians want to sell as an economics treatise that is considered as nothing more than a political hack job by reputable historians and economists. If you think Hitler stopped reparations payments to France, Britain and the USA for any reason but to recapture his ability to control his economy and currency to build a state hell bent on war then you don't know anything about Germany circa 1933-1945. Dude, read a book and come back when you know something.