If you tax the rich, they won't leave!

A study of the rich over 12 years shows they move less than the middle class does!

So why do politicians say the rich will leave if we tax them? Ok. OK. the right says it too.

https://www.theguardian.com/inequal...eave-us-data-contradicts-millionaires-threats

 

Go have a little chat with your socialist friends in France about this, I'm sure they'd be more than happy to educate you.

 

Wow. A whole 12 years?

 

That was a very convincing article.

 

Clearly that line is largely political spin. That said, it’s not entirely irrelevant. I don’t think the very rich actually emigrating is the issue but how they manage their money. We know there is already a massive amount of effort put in to minimise tax by the very wealthy (legally and not) and significant increases in taxation could make it more worthwhile for them to put even more effort (and take even greater risks on the illegal side and grey areas) to avoid it, potentially leading to an overall reduction in overall tax paid.

I don’t think any of this is a valid reason not to change tax laws but it is something that needs to be (and can be) considered and addressed. Like so many things though, personal interest and partisan politics gest in the way of legitimate policy decisions.

 

But the question is do they move out of the country more than the middle class does? The middle class moves more because of jobs but if rich people still move a lot to avoid taxes its still an issue we need to deal with. Also, in the US taxes are lower than in Europe and the rich thrive so even if you are right its no surprise they don't move a lot, but what happens if we massively hike them? Your study doesn't address that.

 

It fails to address the actual issue. It isn't rich people moving out of the country. It corporate offices moving out of the country. While income tax rates are lower here than much of Europe, many countries over there are much more friendly toward the businesses themselves. So main corporate offices are moved while they leave just enough here in the US for their domestic operations and funnel the profits from overseas operations through the corporate offices in those countries with lower taxes on the businesses themselves.

 

France recently tried to heavily tax the wealthy and they fled en masse. France backed down when they saw revenues drop like a rock.

 

The meme that the rich all flee the country because of taxes in a bunch of BS. Anyone who says this doesn't really understand how the rich operate:

If you are really rich, the focus is not on making more money, but rather on wealth preservation. Now, tell me about a country other than the US with lower taxes, but at the same time safer protection of property? Sure, you can set up your bank account in Ireland. What gives you the guarantee that the Irish won't seize bank accounts in bad times, especially those of non-citizens?

At the end your investments in the US are backed by the full strength of the dollar, which is backed by the by far largest military in the world. No other country can provide the same protection of assets. That's why the wealthy won't leave. They rather use their wealth to lobby congress to lower their taxes.

 

The Rich owns our Congress............which does their bidding !

Surprising it seems Republicans will roll over more than the Dems...................

 

See my other post in this thread about this.

 

So you're unable to discuss it? No knowledge of it? Do you even know the realities of socialism and France? Do you even know that no nation has ever established a truly socialist economy?

 

I don't think there is any evidence that higher taxes on the rich will result in a reduction of tax revenue. I'd have to search the subject. Do you have anything?

 

Well, according to what you just said here the rich are taxed much more in Europe, and that means Europe still has rich folks. They aren't flocking here to avoid taxes.

 

Can you provide a link?

 

No, I was just applying common sense in principle. I don't think you can assess "higher taxes on the rich" though, the specifics of actual tax rates, the wider system and enforcement structures, availability of legal loopholes and the like are all going to be relevant.

 

Google "France taxes wealthy" and many articles will come up.

 

Well France with its sky-high taxes on the rich is losing about 10,000 millionaires per year to other countries.

 

We should tax you more for suggesting others should pay higher rates than you

 

That seems to be a response to our high business taxes and we should just lower our business taxes and raise our income taxes to compensate. We also need to fix our high cost of healthcare as that burden gets placed on US businesses.

 

Yeah I heard this before. Look at my city. It’s bs. You need to make the country friendly for business. What’s a tax cut for me in the lower middle class if I don’t have a job. http://fox59.com/2017/11/07/carrier...l-january-reduces-number-of-workers-affected/

 

Great. I don't see any evidence that rich folks "fled en mass". I see threats and gripes. You said "flee". But I only see two right wing blogs claiming there was any "fleeing".

 

Its werid how people think otbers can hold them up at gun point and think they woild go back for more ..

 

Is CNN a right wing blog?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...1/news/millionaires-fleeing-france/index.html

10,000 millionaires left France last year
By Ivana Kottasova
Updated 12:07 PM EDT, Fri April 01, 2016




CNNMoney)Millionaires are fleeing France.

Around 10,000 millionaires left the country in 2015, according to a report by New World Wealth, which provides analysis on the global wealth sector.

Paris saw the biggest exodus of high net worth individuals, with 7,000 millionaires leaving the city last year. That's roughly 6% of Paris' millionaires, a population of 126,000, according to the new report.

 

I just looked for evidence of that and came up empty-handed. The Telegraph said Sotheby's Realty said its French offices sold more than 100 properties worth over 1.7 million euros between April and June of 2012. More recently, I find a claim that many people of different income groups are leaving France to find a better economic environment. http://www.expatforum.com/france/wealthy-french-fleeing-the-country-new-data-suggests.html

Edit 48 minutes later:
Elsewhere I see a mention of this exodus totaling 6% of the population. And I see that due to poor economic conditions and the ease of moving between European countries now, emigration in search of work is significantly increased anyway and that the emigration and immigration of the wealthy fluctuate. So it's looking like the "outrage" of the wealthy leaving is exaggerated and reports are selective in what is claimed. That would suggest it is the right wing trying to generate opposition to taxes on the wealthy more than anything.

But I have a question. Seriously, why is the emigration of the wealthy so terrible? Their continuing accumulation of wealth is a net drain on any country. And let's not get into "jobs, jobs, jobs" when we see the ease with which jobs are sent overseas in search of very low wages anyway. And shrinkage of tax revenue? Taxes fluctuate anyway and emigration of workers seeking jobs has it own effect.