Voting Age Should Be 25

Oh, I agree. The Republicans should do better with spending. But Biden is breaking the bank, compared to both Trump and Obama. As for the increase in spending, well, that has to do with inflation. The more money you spend that you don't have, the less worthy the money is, which reduces purchasing power, which leads to higher spending. It's a snowball effect, and the numbers, more or less, from 2015 to 2019 show that--442 to 585 to 665 to 779 to 984. This is another reason why the voting age should be 25, because you have to understand basic economics.

 

I would increase it to the following for the deal:

1. Marriage of consent is now 21
2. Obtaining a driver's license is now 21
3. Obtaining emancipation from parents is now 21
4. Parents are now responsible for their children until the age 21. Failure to do so will be endangerment of a child
5. Minimum age to begin working is now 21.
6. And no personhood under the age of 21, aka abortion conception argument here.

Somehow, the "conservatives" may want it both ways.

 

It is the thrid conservative year, technically.

However, deficits should not be a concern if or when the econony is mixed or is in stress. It is a concern if the economy is good or in total positive range and expanding. Remember, with both the Bush and Obma presidencies, they had high deficits in the beginning of their terms but those deficits dropped in subsequent years.

the other argument is that broad-based tax cuts tend to reduce revenues in the long run. Cutting discretionary spending is not the answer given the amount of responsibility the federal government has. The government does not work its customer service by email or live chat, but by phone or in person, for obvious security reasons, PII security reasons. And that means long wait times no matter what you do. Cutting those programs will just make the wait times longer and the government service even less efficient, and that is not a good combo to have either. So, raising effective tax rates may need to be applied, at the right time of course.

 

Third consecutive year, outside of 2020, which was an anomaly in which the global economy essentially shutdown, which is not par for the course. To intermix the deficit from 2020 into Trump's four years or Biden's 2 is twisting the numbers to fit a narrative, which falls in line of this truism: "There are lies, damned lies, and statistics." We are getting into the complex here, and I don't see the average 18-year-old modularizing these numbers and understanding their synthesis to make a truly informed decision as compared to their ability to do so at 25.

What are you talking about? From 2015 to 2017, the deficit went from $442 billion to $585 billion to $665 billion. That's not a deficit drop.

 

That depends on the person. Some people make better decisions at 18 than others manage at 40.

I think 18 is an appropriate age limit for most things. Do you think we need a 25 year age limit on buying guns? All guns, or only the rapid fire/large magazine type?

Please calm down. No need to attack like that. I don't disagree with neuroscience.

However, I disagree with your generalized assessment of people under the age of 25. If you apply that equally, then we should have a 25 year age limit not just for voting, but also for:

- Driving a car
- Buying a house
- Getting married
- Joining the military
- Buying alcohol or cannabis
- Owning a gun ...

... and so forth and so on. I'm satisfied with most current age limits.

The right seems to have convinced many that raising the voting age would be a good thing. They don't like it when young people vote ... that's not one of their best demographics.

 

The age of adulthood should be consistent if that is the discussion but I fear this is merely the usual Republican repress the vote effort that follows each cycle. Youth turned out, how do we repress that? Age requirement, get rid of on-campus voting locations and same day registration, et al.

A little introspection would go a long way for the Republican Party. Here’s a novel concept! How about doing the work to build a platform voters might actually support.

 

not so fast. Let's look at inflation per year.



If we average the numbers from 2009 to 2017 when the budget was under Obama, we get 1.64% annual inflation. if we average Trump's first 3 years and disregard pandemic spending, we get 1.8%. Interesting considering some news outlets said Obama was the most reckless spender of any president.

I think instead of age being a requirement, voters should be quizzed on actual facts instead of talking points. During Obama's term, all I heard was he was breaking the bank. Then Trump normalized it and GOP looked the other way.

 

2020 was an extraordinary situation. A worldwide pandemic with no medical protocols to treat the diseases despite all the conspiracy theories out there. Thus, the world economy shut down in order to save lives and not have the healthcare system overwhelmed. From that point to even FY 2022, we are still dealing with the after-effects and are just now getting into a more of a norlmalcy because medical protocols are pretty solid with a relatively new disease. Thus, it is the third year of huge deficits.

It was the general regression I was speaking of from a deficit of over $1 trillion in FY 2009 to a deficit of $665 billion. I look at regression over a time period for each administration. But we have a revenue problem, and that is more of an issue than a spending problem.

Let me elucidate you here as an example. If your monthly income is $5000 per annum, and your expenses currently are $6000 per annum, the average person would want to earn more money first before cutting expenses. But in that $6000 expenses per annum had the following: mortgage, $1500, food, $500, transportation, $600, credit card debt, $2500, clothes, $200, electricity/heat, $300, utilities, $200, personal expenses, $200, and other necessary expenses for house repairs, $300. You might cut some expenses but you will still be in deficit territory. YOu cannot cut mortgage or credit card payments becuase that is simply robbing peter to pay paul sort of a thing. And yet, the GOP's first option is tax cuts, aka cut revenue collection, and expect to reduce enough of the discretionary spending, some 38% of the total federal budget to match revenues. That is never a sound financial plan.

 

The only thing that stands out to me from the chart is how much inflation increased on Biden's watch.

 

As a side note, given that the mind/ brain is fully matured at 25, then it would be reasonable for the age at which a person can enter the senate be reduced from 30 to 25 also...

 

Nah, not all younglings are utter dolts.

They should have a critical thinking and knowledge test for voting but then Republicans would be in power forever.

If you can go to war at 18 you should be able to be president or do anything.

 

Except that is BS, your brain/mind is constantly developing.

 

Ok, same for military service. Deal?

 

Two issues with the image. One, it's not sourced. Two, let's say that those numbers are correct. Obama had 8 years, with annual inflation dramatically fluctuating; he had two years of deflation, which is not a hallmark of a good economy, and in 2011, inflation suddenly skyrockets to 3.2%. All in all, from 2009 to 2017, the economy was hitting peaks and valleys with no predictive pattern, which is not good for those wishing to invest. Additionally, you did not really explain how you abstracted pandemic spending in 2020 to come up with the number that you did, nor how you defined "pandemic spending."

Anyway, the point is this: there is a lot of nuance and complexity when it comes to the economy, and saying that 18-year-olds saw the high spending in the 4 years of Trump simple illustrates two-dimensional thinking, which is more common in 18-year-olds as compared to 25-year-olds, due to psychobiological realities, thus proven my point that the voting age should be raised to 25.

 

...or drive a vehicle...or work in a potentially dangerous job...or own a gun....or marry...or take care of a child - children raising children just CAN'T be a good idea. I mean, if people aren't mature enough to vote then how can the ymake the choice to join the military, get married, have a child or any of these potentially huge issues?

In fact, if young people are so incapable of making important choices maybe they should be relieved of the responsibility to work and supported by government until they are 25. That also removes the issue of 'no taxation without representation', which is apparently a foundational principle of the US, except when Republicans don't want people they disagree with actually voting.

 

I knew more about your country's issues at 19 than many who post on this forum today, and I'm not even American.

 

No. In the military they are taking orders from adults. In the metaphorical voting booth, they are alone with their decision. Therefore, given that their choice not only affects them but affects the rest of society, their prefrontal cortex should be fully developed and should also have real life experience. 18-year-olds are either living with their parents or just moving out of their parent's house, which is not a lot of experience from which to draw.

 

A 30-year-old has 5 more years of life experience than a 25-year-old. With age comes wisdom. Although I think there should be a cut-off point on how old you can be to be president, considering dementia, which we are currently dealing with in the White House.

 

OK, so what I love about this thread is that the OP is trying to pretend there is an actual argument here when we all know wha tthis is - Republicans know they can't consistently win over enough voters so they want to limit voting to those who agree with them. Failing that they want to rig elections via gerrymander so that even when they lose they win.

Different day, same pile of bull droppings.

 

No one is saying that 18-year-olds are not adults. They are adults, but their brains--specifically, their prefrontal cortex, which is fundamental to making decisions--is not fully online till 25. Why would you want people who are psychologically underdeveloped making decisions that doesn't just affect themselves, but affects society at large? Why are Democrats trying to lower the voting age to 16-year-olds, whose brains are even more so underdeveloped? Why do people whose brains are underdeveloped and less wise vote Democrat?

 

Anecdotal with no basis.

 

I do agree that those choices do require a mature level of thinking, and we can discuss that. But there is a glaring difference between voting and, say, getting married. Your choice to get married does not affect me as much as the choice you make of the person whom you wish to give power over my life. Voting affects society much more than whether someone decides to have a child or not. It's not even in the same ballpark. Since it is in a different category, we must treat it as so. Because of the unparalleled gravity of voting, we must make sure that the minimum age to vote should one in which the prefrontal cortex, which is fundamental to making decisions, is fully developed.

 

If you are old enough to go to war for your country or be forced by your country to act as an incubator to the state then you should be able to vote.

So 18 for males and 12 for females

Deal?

 

No.

In the military, young soldiers are taking orders from adults. In the metaphorical voting booth, they are alone with their decision. Therefore, given that their choice not only affects them but affects the rest of society, their prefrontal cortex should be fully developed and should also have real life experience. 18-year-olds are either living with their parents or just moving out of their parent's house, which is not a lot of experience from which to draw.

 

So you are ok that men be killed in war and young girls can be forced to birth children but they cannot vote because it impacts you?

How typically republican