1 year after the "Bailout"of Greece,capitialist Failure!

KK. BTW About Germany and France. I was proving the point that Germany and France are doing pretty well off considering they don't have a petroleum sector to be "highly dependent" on. So the "It's easy to be rich when you live near your own money printing press." doesn't really work for an argument when presented with other countries similar to Norway w\o being "richly endowed with natural resources" working completely fine.

Everything bolded. Which is more than half of your (*)(*)(*)(*)ing post.

 

Uhhh...yeah.

So what?

I know what I posted.

 

That's you (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)ing about how they have an "unfair advantage of oil and natural resources"

 

Yeah...and....

 

Read below quote.

You asked me to prove you wrong, so I did.

 

This is silly...okay...

and which facts 'as I see them' did you prove wrong and with what proof.

 

If i spent 5 mins copying from CIA it would just waste my time as you would dispute them. So I'll just give you the link so maybe your fat fingers might get a workout.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/gm.html
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/fr.html

Now do the comparison to the US.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html

 

I hate to have to correct you: Even though Germany has had quite a lot of Social Democratic Chancellors in the past, the current one is from the conservative CDU.
Not that that defies your point though. In comparison to American Republicans/Democrats Angie is just one step away from being Rosa Luxemburg. Same goes for Sarkozy.

 

What are you talking about?

I asked you to prove the facts that I posted were wrong.

And since they are from the CIA World Fact Book - what is the point of simply re-posting what I already posted?

 

You cant have capitalism with fiat currency. Econ 101

 

Who said all regulations are bad? The reality is that government policy is dominated by corporate interests. The influence wielded by big business is used to garner favorable legislation and regulations that encourage big government for the benefit of big business. For example, large producers are granted favorable tax status and/or are allowed to disregard certain environmental restrictions in order to access and exploit resources, effectively rendering small market competition unsustainable. At least in the case of the US, the government has ceased to be a democratic republic, effectively realizing a rule by corporate oligarchy. This is what I mean by "corporate socialism".

 

All said and done..who was in front predicting this stuff a year ago ?

BECK on FOX.

Fair n balanced..and in front .

Greece...Spain...Italy..

only Sheep follow a withering water path down to the crocodiles.
People with a brain can LOOK ahead and see ..

 

...

Spain, or Italy for that matter, is not in same severe trouble the USA is in. Not to mention neither of these European countries has "failed" so far -- not that they are going too either.

 

The "ruling" part doesn't matter. The country itself is Social Democratic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy
Social Democracy is more than just a party it's an actual ruling system which requires you to change things about some laws and government for it to change from Social Democratic.

Ahh yes the fiat currency.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_money Apparently. The Euro IS a fiat currency.

The funny thing is. Most of the corporate socialists under you definition are usually all Conservatives. So I now get what you mean by corporate socialism.

 

The idea that ideaologies are inherently liberal or conservative is a byproduct of the false choice Hegelian dialectic used to divide the people against their own interests and to get them to chose between one arm or the other of the two party corporate oligarchy.

We don't have a government diametrically opposed on liberal and conservative ideals. We have a governing apparatus controlled by supranational corporate interests which present the concept that the government is made up of opposing parties so that the people will not realize that their democracy is a ruse.

 

Your heading is false, this is not about "capitalist" failure but rather a Socialist failure much like the failures of Cuba, the former Soviet Union and China.

Why would anyone think Greece represented Capitalism?

So is your argument that if they had just kept printing money, taxing their businesses and citizens to death and spending money like there was no tomorrow propping up Union thugs and welfare programs things would be a lot better?

 

Greece's relative debt level is about the same as the USA

Ireland, Spain and Portugal are even worse

The USA under Bush and Obama decided to use socialistic Corporate welfare bailouts of their banking system. Obama even nationalised General Motors.

Sounds like basic socialist principles are being used to bail out an inneficient, corrupt and immoral capitalist system that has NEVER worked and will NEVER work.

Incidentally, it was the criminal Goldman Sachs that ruined Greece and dozens of other nations

 

I have to laugh at the age old claim that "Socialism works; just look at Finland, Norway and Sweden!"

But it doesn't work; companies like Volvo are a Socialist failure and a company that is now in desperate trouble and formerly owned by an American firm sustaining great losses and that is now basically Chinese owned. After this new firm loses a few billions they will be selling off this money losing enterprise for even less money; probably to the Swedish Government that will use revenues of its already over-taxed economy to prop it up for purely employment reasons.

Ford Motor Company decided to consider putting Volvo Cars on the market in December 2008, after suffering huge losses that year.[22] On October 28, 2009, Ford confirmed that, after considering several offers, the preferred buyer of Volvo Cars was Zhejiang Geely Holding Group, the parent of Chinese motor manufacturer Geely Automobile.[23][24] On December 23, 2009, Ford confirmed that all substantive commercial terms of the sale to Geely had been settled. A definitive agreement was signed on March 28, 2010 worth $1.8 billion. The European Commission and China's Ministry of Commerce approved the deal on July 6 and July 29, 2010, respectively. The deal closed on August 2, 2010 with Geely paying $1.3 billion cash and a $200 million note. Further payments are expected with a later price "true-up".[25][26] It is the largest overseas acquisition by a Chinese automaker.[27]

These socialist experiments only succeed and survive similar to Canada because they are nations comprising massive territory containing vast resources and tiny homogenous populations. It is an idiot’s argument to suggest that these are examples of successful Socialist largess or apply to smaller nations with large populations or nations like America.

 

They say that the first sign of recovery is when you can admit your problem; being uninformed and arrogant is more the term.

Non-Americans comment on American issues because American issues are more relevant and important than non-American issues.

The notion that they are more informed is laughably certifiable considering the mess they constantly get themselves into and the wars they always seem to start.

There is nothing more here than “because you say so.” If you were informed, which you so obviously are not, you would understand that the reason many Americans do not speak Eurodork is because they do not need. America is a HUGE land with many resources and for the most part, can survive just fine without Eurodorkism; the same cannot be said for Eurodorks. They have to deal and trade with other nations for resources they do not have in order to survive; when that doesn’t work well, they sometimes resort to massive war.

Senator Obama is an abject arrogant moron who is currently being biotch slapped by reality and about as dumb as the Eurodorks who presume to lecture the most prosperous and powerful nation on earth how to do their business when Eurodorkism has so many other issues to contend with.

 

I understand that these positions on what is Socialism derive from the decades of falsification and miseducation of millions by the Capitalist culture of the US .

get it right we Socialists are NOT for the "reform of Capitialism"we Socialists are for its complete OVERTHROW and establishment of DEMOCRATIC forms of Government!

Sorry to inform you but Greece since its formation as a NATIONAL CAPITIALIST State.[In its modern form established after WW2].

Is and has always been CAPITIALIST 100%,its that little thing called 'NATIONAL INTRESTS" profit motive and total economic intergration into world and European economy that tells the CAPITIALIST nature of Greece!

When exactly was the succesful Revolutionary otherthrow of the old state apparatus and the establishment of a Workers Government?

i must have been sleeping or something.

See what a Socialist Workers government does when it comes to power is immediately NATIONALISE THE BANKS.establish a monopoly on foriegn trade and suppreses ,yiolently if necessary the stinking corrupt greedy CAPITIALIST CLASS until it no longer exists!

This is always as Part of extenting the World Socialist Revolution!Globally.

Nations and Nationalism has no home within Socialism !

And then you had to mentionthat failing economy called China ,which BTW isn't Socialist nor has it ever been for a single nano second since its formation as a NATION.

Nations = Capitialism 110%.

FOOL!

 

The middle way is best. Hold people accountable for their abuses, but maintain a hybrid socialist/capitalist system.

Public amenities should be socialized while everything else should be privatized and open to a lot of competition.

 

So USA is a capitalist mess?

 

Pretty much...

 

Then perhaps both ideologies should stop throwing mud at each other and find out the better parts of these systems. Clearly hard socialism and hard capitalism are both non-workable solutions. Unless you are part of the top 1% of the West.

 

No argument here. Scandinavia seems to have the right blend.