CDC Reveals Hospitals Counted Heart Attacks As COVID-19 Deaths

In most cases - yes, with fairly small timing variance.
For those with immunity problems - if WuFlu got them, next flu epidemic would get them as well.
For cancer patients - I suspect that WuFlu is listed because in most cancer cases when a patient dies they remain on the ventilator for some time for relatives to say final goodbye and to verify brain death. WuFlu could have prevented the last brain death stage because it would require much more effort to put a brain dead patient on a ventilator in some quarantined area of the hospital, so they just let them die and list them cause as WuFlu.
For the rest - who knows?

 

That does exist which is what gives rise to excess deaths. The CDC website also gives the cause of every death in the weekly figure whether it's from old age, motor accident etc

 

Again, the CDC theorizes - as it can only go by death certificates - that these are cases where someone was hospitalized with one of the above, contracted COVID-19 in hospital and died from Covid-19. Or maybe they already had it, got hurt and became severely symptomatic while in hospital.

And it's really not to hard to imagine some scenarios. For instance, an elderly person in a care home (Covid hotbed) who falls, or someone who falls because they can't breathe because they feel dizzy and out of breath because they have Covid-19...

 

That does not explain the over 200,000 excess deaths for this year

 

Of course.

 

No. Each death is listed once - as a Covid-19 death, and a Covid-19 death only.

It explains right above the table that there's an average of 2.6 conditions for each Covid-19 death. These conditions are not counted as deaths as well, under a different cause. They are counted as comorbidities in the full sense - conditions caused by Covid-19 and contributing to Covid-19 deaths. That's what the table is all about - comorbidities.

So, you have Covid-19 which causes PNEUMONIA which causes SEPSIS and you die.

You also have MORBID OBESITY, contributing to death.

PNEUMONIA, SEPSIS and MORBID OBESITY are all counted in the table - as comorbidities.

The death is recorded ONCE - as a death from Covid-19. And it's a "physical death". The information comes from the death certificate of a physical human being.

 

If they died because of cancer, then the cause of death would be cancer.

If it contributed to the death in some way, Covid-19 would be given as a "condition contributing to death", in Part II of the death certificate.

 

You don't understand.

There are fewer people being seen in hospitals for serious illnesses because of the Covid hysteria.

There are more deaths. They're just not because of Covid.

 

I wonder how many Walmart related fatalities there are.

 

From technical disclosures in the link I posted on page 5:

As I said - there won’t be a dip in heart attack counts because one death counts as many times as there are conditions.
To accurately analyze the impact of covid you need to find total number of actual deaths from past couple of years and compare them to current actual totals.

 

I've provided a link showing that number of deaths from heart disease (no Covid) this year is no different to previous years

 

That has been provided many times and gives rise to the excess death from all causes number which is greater than 200,000 up to date. How could you have missed it?

 

The footnote refers to the table. They are counted more than once in the table because the purpose of the table is to show the various conditions which caused or contributed to a Covid-19 death.

That's why the footnote says "To avoid counting the same death multiple times, the numbers for different conditions should not be summated."

The death itself is recorded once as a death from Covid-19, because that was the cause of death.

That's why we already have the "total number of actual deaths" - it's the total number of death certificates where Covid-19 is the cause of death.

 

That’s not what it looks like. CDC applies that note to total deaths from COVID.
I looked at some causes of death tables that list totals and the causes on that table don’t match total. The tables that I pulled go all the way back to 2019 and they don’t show a drop in deaths from heart attacks or cancer.
Where I’m getting with this:
Say in 2019 you had 20,000 deaths from heart attacks and in 2020 deaths from heart attacks is the same.
Of those 20,000 heart attacks in 2020, let’s say 5,000 had WuFlu.
If the WuFlu deaths are counted only once then the 5,000 deaths should not be a part of heart attacks count, and our heart attack total should be 15,000.

The CDC counts deaths the following ways:
Death | WuFlu | Heart attack | Diabetes
1 | 1 | 0. | 1
1. | 1. | 1. | 0
1. | 1. | 1. | 0

The CDC would present these 3 deaths as follows: 3 WuFlu, 2 heart attack, 1 diabetes.

The heart attack numbers didn’t change much over year, but if one were to claim that it was WuFlu that lead to those deaths and comorbidity should not be counted, then you need to take death counts by causes from CDC and deduct WuFlu comorbidity numbers from those totals. Doing that would result in a major drop in cases from heart disease, cancers, and will even reveal that we had almost no flu fatalities.

 

Deaths from Covid that caused a heart attack are not included in heart attack figures because it was Covid that caused the heart attack. Hence from the data we can see that the number of fatal heart attacks this year is the same as last year and the years before. None of the reported death numbers from heart disease, cancer or flu were from people with Covid hence why we see no significant change in numbers compared to previous years.

As an example. If someone has cancer of the heart which led to a fatal heart attack. The cause of death would be registered as cancer of the heart and not added to the figure of deaths from heart attack. Only one registered death is added to the numbers

 

Having seen this locally in my area network health providers, I agree there is a financial incentive for hospitals to over count to cover the loss of elective procedures that stopped. Even now, counting the deaths as COVID continues to pay more in stipends. This is pretty clear. Wonder why the media aren't investigative reporting this.... Fear makes Joe an easier pill to vote for..

 

It costs a lot more to treat highly infectious patients on ventilators than any other patients. Just to turn over a Covid patient on a ventilator takes 9 members of staff.

 

The horror... And yet, you still aren't willing to admit that the payment coding is more beneficial if there is even a hint at covid inclusion. And more telling how many folks does it take to turn anyone on a ventilator? Same number. You really don't have a point.

 

Hospitals receive no money if there is just a "hint of covid". And it's not the "same number". The usual patient on a ventilator is not highly contagious

 

LOL.. so, it's your theory that hospitals would purposefully put more employees at risk, right? Laughable. And, yes. Hospitals do get paid more with associating coding. I understand you don't know this stuff and thought you could just wing it here... Negative, the pattern is full.....

 

9 members would be turning the patient regardless if that patient was diagnosed with pneumonia versus COVID. The only difference is the CPT code being used.

 

OK. Care to show your proof ?

 

Your fundamental error is that you are confusing causes of death with comorbidities (conditions arising from/contributing to a cause of death)

For example, five people might have heart pneumonia = 5 counts of pneumonia as a COMORBIDITY

However, pneumonia has various causes. As a result, there may be = 5 different CAUSES OF DEATH for the above.

There can only be one cause of death for each death. Therefore, each death will be counted once - and once only - in the one relevant cause of death category.

So, you need to be aware of what the data refers to - a cause of death, or a comorbidity.

This may help explain why your idea of how the CDC counts death is wrong.

This is what you posted:

The CDC counts deaths the following ways:
Death | WuFlu | Heart attack | Diabetes
1 | 1 | 0. | 1
1. | 1. | 1. | 0
1. | 1. | 1. | 0​

^ Here, you are mixing up cause of death and comorbidity ^

This is what it should look like (and how things are actually counted):

Cause of death count: Covid-19 = 3
Comorbidity count: heart attack = 2, diabetes = 1

These comorbidities are not counted anywhere as a cause of death because they were not a cause of death. They were comorbidities.

They may, however be included in other comorbidity data sets (e.g. heart attacks from all causes).

 

How do you know what the actual deaths are? Do you have a more credible source than the one I gave you?
"Updated May 14, 2020" = "ancient"?

THE NEW YORK TIMES, Where Have All the Heart Attacks Gone? By Harlan M. Krumholz, M.D.
Published April 6, 2020, Updated May 14, 2020.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/...itals-emergency-care-heart-attack-stroke.html

The cause of death data was clearly being fudged in May.
Do you have any evidence that the data is not still being fudged?

 

Depends if the cause of that pneumonia is contagious or not so your statement is incorrect. Perhaps you could post how much a hospital charges for a comatosed pneumonia patient on a ventilator?