Hot Take: Nazis were not evil for their time.

Discussion in 'History & Past Politicians' started by Aquarius, Feb 10, 2022.

  1. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    Going back to the OP, it makes sense if you limit the statement to the situation 100 years ago.
    America had Jim Crow and the KKK.
    Russia had its pogroms/
    Turkey was fresh from the Armenian genocide.
    Britain prided itself in how it was nurturing the inferior peoples of the world.
    So the NAZI Germans, living in a place where Jews and other nationalities had the same privileges as Germans, became jealous.
     
  2. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    Jump ahead to 90 years ago.
    Now the NAZIs could march the streets, beat up Jews at will with no fear of the government and feel good again.
     
  3. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    Jump to 85 years ago.
    Now you could kill a Jew and get away with it, and if a Jew committed a crime there was no need to wait for a lynch mob. The Police Chief could strangle him to death in his cell.
     
  4. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    Jump to 80 years ago. There are no Jews in sight. Life would be great for Germans if they weren't fighting a war on every possible front. Worse yet, they just found out FDR will accept nothing but unconditional surrender.
    You can't win the war. Hitler and friends will be executed for war crimes. Is there anything you'd like to do before you die, Mr. Hitler?
    KILL ALL THE JEWS.
     
  5. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    So a memo goes out to all the camps. Eliminate 200 guests per week. They did.
    I suspect there were only a few experimental gas chambers in use before the end of the war and easy to liquidate. You don't get nicer chopping heads off than shooting people.
     
  6. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    “It’s too bad that stupidity isn’t painful.”
     
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  7. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is absolutely no genuine evidence that Hitler ever intended to kill all of Europe's Jews.

    Of the "tons of documents" so often referred to as "evidence", not one single document confirms this Allied propaganda myth further promulgated by the corrupt Holocaust Industry(1).

    Even the politically neutral Red Cross which was refused access to the Soviet gulags and Eisenhower's real death camps confirms that there was absolutely no genocidal German agenda or homicidal gas chambers (2).

    They like the the fake human skin lampshades, fake human fat soap, shrunken heads and other deliberate frauds were invented by Holocaust Industry myth makers, Allied propagandists & Hollywood to dupe & deceive the gullible

    If there were a genuine genocidal German agenda against the Jews, Jews would not have been allowed to hold high ranking positions in Germany's National Socialist Party or to rise to the highest ranks in Germany's WW 2 military with the full knowledge and approval of Hitler and the German High Command?

    Since in every war, the victors write the history, most all you've been fed is residual Allied propaganda exaggerated even further by the corrupt and insatiable Holocaust Industry & its complicit Hollywood myth makers.




    (1) “To the present day a written order by Hitler regarding the destruction of the European Jewish community has not been found, and, in all probability, this order was never given.”

    - Walter Laqueur, Was niemand wissen wollte: Die Unterdruckung der Nachrichten uber Hitlers Endlösung (What Nobody Wanted to Know: The Suppression of News About Hitler’s “Final Solution”), (Berlin-Vienna, 1981), p.190


    (2) Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its activities during the second world war (September 1, 1939 - June 30, 1947), Volumes 1 - 3 (complete)

    https://archive.org/details/ReportO...SecondWorldWarseptember11939-June301947Vol.2/
    EXCERPT
    "No Evidence Of Genocide"
    "... it is important to stress that the delegates of the International Red Cross found no evidence whatever at the camps in Axis occupied Europe of a deliberate policy to exterminate the Jews. In all its 1,600 pages the Report does not even mention such a thing as a gas chamber." CONTINUED
     
  8. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that there is no valid nominee to replace them for worst people in history.
     
  9. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's just because your only apparent source of information is MSM's TV and Hollywood fiction.
     
  10. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    When you release a bag of cats at a mouse farm, you don't need to tell them what to do.
     
  11. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's funny, my elderly Siamese wouldn't think of putting a mouse in his mouth.
    He also likes to birdwatch with me and wouldn't think of hurting one of those either.
    That's just the way he is.

    I was hoping for a substantive response to my last Post #257 in which I said and supported: "There is absolutely no genuine evidence that Hitler ever intended to kill all of Europe's Jews."

    Hitler had a significant number of Jewish friends, trusted associates and even young Jewish "pen pal"(*)

    He feared and disliked Communist / Bolshevik Jews after seeing what they had done in formerly Christian Russia and resented the 1933 Jewish declaration of war on Germany but appeared to be fond of many Jews on an individual basis (1) and wrote favorably of them in his book "Mein Kampf":

    EXCERPT "In the Jew I still saw only a man who was of a different religion, and therefore, on grounds of human tolerance, I was against the idea that he should be attacked because he had a different faith. And so I considered that the tone adopted by the anti-Semitic Press in Vienna was unworthy of the cultural traditions of a great people."CONTINUED(2)

    I don't know what you are attempting to communicate with: "... a bag of cats at a mouse farm" but I'm sure that when you look beyond residual Allied propaganda and the profit driven Holocaust Industry's narrative, you'll see that Hitler's true sentiments toward the Jews is far more complex than you've been led to believe.

    Thanks,


    (*). "Remarkable tale of Hitler's young Jewish friend"
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46192941



    (1) "5 Jews Hitler Actually Liked"
    https://historyofyesterday.com/5-jews-hitler-actually-liked-c702217e1aa5


    EXCERPT "Surprisingly, during this time in his life, Hitler also had extremely good relationships with Jewish people. At his house in Vienna, almost all of his friends were Jewish, with Josef Neumann being the closest.

    And when Hitler took over Germany, he spared some of his old Jewish friends, kept some in his party, and even formed new friendships."CONTINUED


    (2) "Mein Kampf"
    http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks02/0200601.txt
     
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  12. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    It could be that all evidence was destroyed because he knew they were going to lose the war and he would be put on trial for war crimes.
    There have been times I personally was denied my constitutional rights. The evidence was destroyed.
     
  13. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    The problem with PF is that people post while in a state of rage and don't even notice when one of the other posters is sympathetic to their point.
     
  14. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    Let's consider one aspect of the holocaust, the one they convicted Herman Goering for: torturing concentration camp inmates in experimental ways.
    From a distance that looks like a horrible abuse designed only to give the abusers some fun.
    From a proper distance though it clearly has a military objective.
    You see there are limits to the enhanced interrogation techniques you are allowed to use against prisoners of war. While some obviously die under the techniques you can not have the death of a POW as the aim of the interrogation.
    The only way to know for sure how much you can torture a man without killing him is to torture a lot of people and carefully note the difference between those who die and those who do not. A POW is a soldier. Unless he's badly wounded he should be healthier than the poorly fed inmates at the concentration camp.
    So you can do to him whatever you did to the weakest survivors from the camps and it qualifies as enhanced interrogation techniques, not torture.
    After the war you publish the results of the research study in all the medical journals and the Hague Tribunal publishes it, saving the lives of thousands of POWS in all future wars, making the world a better place.
     
  15. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    As to Hollywood, I would love to e3ngage in movie reviews.
    The one I saw last year is most interesting.
    It was a 1934 German version of Quo Vadis.
    It ended with the Christians being fed to the lions.
    Obviously they were preparing the public to cheer for the upcoming purge.
     
  16. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I certainly apologize if you have interpreted my previous Posts as having been written in a "... state of rage" because that's the last emotion I have felt in responding to your comments.

    I fully believe that mature adults can disagree on even volatile topics while doing so with civility and respect.

    If you agree that the Germans have been the victims of what is perhaps the most egregious propaganda, slander and extortion campaign in modern history, please feel free to express your sentiments.

    Thanks,
     
  17. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If Germany's National Socialist government had really had a genocidal agenda against Europe's Jews, it would have been impossible for the Germans hide or destroy all of the written and radio evidence that the former Allies currently control completely.
    While various forgeries and altered photos are as plentiful as fraudulent eyewitness accounts(*), only those in control of the photos and documents have the ability to alter them.

    There are many ways in which the evidence of a genocidal agenda cannot be erased / destroyed especially when your adversary has it recorded.

    For example, I'm sure that you know that the British cracked Germany's "Enigma" code which made them able to listen to all secret German communications, however of all the information that was communicated there was absolutely nothing to indicate that a mass murder was either planned or occurring(1).
    That is a significant yet frequently ignored piece of evidence.

    Additionally, the Red Cross which was denied access to Communist gulags and Eisenhower's real death camps was allowed access to the German work camps reported conclusively that there was absolutely no evidence of "genocide".

    This is important in that the International Red Cross was, at the time, an impartial source.

    Political pressures from the Nuremberg "Trials", the victorious Allies and the Holocaust Industry compelled them to harden some rhetoric in reference to Germany's work camps but the charge of "genocide" remains absent.

    I've already shown that an order from Hitler for the destruction of Europe's Jews has never been found while written orders from Stalin, Eisenhower and Churchill for the mass murder of millions are plentiful yet to call someone a "Hitler" or "Nazi" is the ultimate insult.

    Finally, because I abhor all forms of totalitarianism, I am especially appreciative of our constitutional rights.
    Please feel free to expand more thoroughly on the temporary loss of your own after addressing the topic at hand.

    Thanks,






    (*) "Could there be anything more twisted than these Holocaust fantasists? How more and more people are making up memoirs about witnessing Nazi crimes"

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...le-making-memoirs-witnessing-Nazi-crimes.html

    EXCERPT "Unfortunately, despite all these examples, publishers are still wilfully selling suspect memoirs based on the Holocaust and the war.

    No doubt there will be more books of this type. With publishers fighting it out to sell the latest tale of World War II derring-do, or Holocaust misery, it seems unlikely this is a genre that will die out.

    Anybody reading these books should stop and ask themselves whether what they hold in their hands is, in fact, true." CONTINUED


    (1) “THE HOLOCAUST NARRATIVE”
    https://archive.org/stream/BreakingTheSpell_48/BreakingTheSpell-Kollerstrom_djvu.txt

    EXCERPT “In 1941, British Intelligence analysts cracked the German “Enigma” code. This undermined the German war effort—but also threw new light on day-by-day events in the Nazi concentration camp system. Between January 1942 and January 1943, encrypted radio communications between those camps and the Berlin headquarters were intercepted and decrypted.

    Oddly enough, historians have largely ignored the information furnished in these intercepts relating to “arrivals,” “departures,” recorded deaths and other events at these camps.The only reasonable explanation is that the intercepted data contra-dicts, even refutes, the orthodox “Holocaust” narrative.

    The information does not expose a program of mass murder and racial genocide. Quite the opposite: it reveals that the Germans were determined, desperate even, to reduce the death rate in their work camps, which was caused by catastrophic typhus epidemics.”CONTINUED


    (2) “Report of the International Committee of the Red Cross on its activities during the second world war (September 1, 1939 - June 30, 1947), Volumes 1 - 3 (complete)”

    https://archive.org/details/ReportOfTheInternationalCommitteeOfTheRedCrossOnItsActivitiesDuring

    EXCERPT

    “No Evidence Of Genocide

    One of the most important aspects of the Red Cross Report is that it clarifies the true cause of those deaths that undoubtedly occurred in the camps toward the end of the war. Says the Report: "In the chaotic condition of Germany after the invasion during the final months of the war, the camps received no food supplies at all and starvation claimed an increasing number of victims.” CONTINUED
     
  18. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    I have suffered a lot for being a NAZI, even though I am not the least bit sympathetic to people who invade small neutral countries, take property from law abiding citizens and motivate the populace to hate and seek revenge for wrongs only imagined.
    When my oldest uncle learned I was studying Hitler he went into a rage and hasn't treated me the same since. That was about 1975.
    In 1991 at breaktime someone asked me how many children I wanted to have. The woman I wanted to marry was nearby, but too far away to hear. Always thoughtful I replied, "It depends on my wife's DNA." nice woman heard that and said I was sounding like the NAZIS.
    I don't know if she told the young lady but I ended up marrying someone worse and my only son would have surely been executed as useless.
    Apparently should have forced a sickly woman I adored to have 11 children at the risk of her life each time.
    In 2004 my wife decided it was time for me to become a writer. So she sent me to a set of meetings at the local library. Marcia Mathews, a self-important local with a book she wrote as part of a team and published for free years earlier, decided my works did not deserve to be read or heard. I sampled World War II the Musical. Song 2 is the Dancing NAZIs, song 3 Hitler explaining the reasoning for the Polish corridor, later we have Herman Goering singing Lightning War to the tune of Jingle Bells. By then she cut me from the meetings.
    Those aren't the civil rights violations.
     
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  19. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    here is no prize for being the second worst collection of people in history. Some of the NAZIs were smart. They knew who held the record. Maybe it was the ancient Assyrian empire.
    No one can renounce a man for sounding like an ancient Assyrian.
     
  20. unkotare

    unkotare Well-Known Member

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    The Nazis were evil for ANY time.
     
  21. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    When you say that you have suffered a lot for being a "NAZI", does that mean that you were a member of Hitler's National Socialist party during the WW 2 era?

    If so, I can imagine you have suffered significantly over the decades in addition to the narrow minded people you have had to deal with during your life.

    When I lived, studied and worked in what was then W. Germany, I came to know several German WW 2 Veterans some of whom were National Socialists. They also opposed invading small, neutral countries and racist sentiments.

    I hope that things go more smoothly for you in the future but so many people have been professionally brainwashed by Hollywood,MSM and the Holocaust Industry that you're still likely to run into the same sort of irrational hatred and ignorant rage.

    Good Luck.
     
  22. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    No, I am not a NAZI. I'm not a NAZI sympathizer. I'm a NAZI understander. If we all become NAZI understanders we can take steps to stop this menace from coming back at us.
     
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  23. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    In nice countries like the USA the NAZIs have become the lowest common denominator for evil. In my part of the country there are as many socialists as capitalists and a whole lot of Communists. You can't admit that you're a Republican in a mixed crowd. What can capitalists, Republicans, socialists and Communists all agree is bad: NAZIs.
     
  24. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    f you can't admit you're a Republican you certainly can't admit that you're a NAZI sympathizer. Since no one has admitted to being a NAZI sympathizer in my part of the country for decades and few have admitted recently that they are Republicans the Communists, socialists, liberals and people looking for an excuse to ruin a reputation or hit someone must look for little clues.
    If you say you wish there weren't so many sickly people around they call you a NAZI.
    If you say Jews are irritating they call you a NAZI.
    If you say one specific Jew is irritating they call you a NAZI.
    If you say the Treaty of Versailles stunk they call you a NAZI.
    If you say the Weimar Republic was pathetic they call you a NAZI.
    As you say, if you admit that the most common cause of death in the camps was illness, they call you a NAZI.
     
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  25. Phil

    Phil Well-Known Member

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    As to gradations of evil however you still lose. Think of the charter members of the NSDAP. Whatever they were the day before they became members they were not nice people.
    The reason Germany was in such misery is that the punishment inflicted upon them for losing World War I put the country into an economic mess the government couldn't solve and few people could solve their own problems.
    The reason they could justify the punishment was that they cheated in World War I.
    They invaded Belgium in violation of an international treaty. They used poison gas. They initiated a policy of unrestricted submarine warfare.
    So the Germans of 1914 to 1918 win the prize of worst collection of people currently active.
    When a bad person gets mad...
     

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