How are you handling the market crash?

Discussion in 'Finance' started by Oh Yeah, Mar 1, 2020.

  1. ToddWB

    ToddWB Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Very informative Pollycy, thank you.. from one boomer to another.
     
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  2. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Why do you INSIST upon IGNORING the 100 lb gorilla in the room, Cy?

    The Federal Reserve is NOT the cause of the current economic woes here in America.

    Neither was the ECB or socialism in the EU/

    There is an old maxim of follow the money and when you do that you see that the BULK of it is flowing UPWARDS into the OFFSHORE bank accounts of the Wall Street Casino Banksters.

    That wasn't happening until AFTER St Reagan and Newt Gingrich started DEREGULATING the financial CONTROLS on the Wall Street Casino.

    Once the UNLEASHED the raging beast of GREED that motivates the Wall Street Casino Banksters We the People never stood a chance.

    Our CURRENT fiscal woes are entirely because of the party that YOU supported and applauded and were only too happy to vote for each and every time, Cy.

    You are now in a position to STOP swallowing the rightwing DISINFORMATION and yet you continue to do so then regurgitate it here.

    For someone as smart as you are that seems inconsistent.

    Ask yourself what happened to the concept of having a CAREER with a single employer for your entire working life?

    Ask yourself what happened to pay raises and bonuses.

    Ask yourself why 66% of hardworking Americans can no longer AFFORD the American dream.

    Ask yourself why Millennials and GenZ are REJECTING everything YOU stood for when YOU were their age?

    And please do not respond with the discredited and debunked kneejerk rightwing PABLUM.

    Rather give each of those questions some serious thought and consideration and look at them in the light why YOUR life experience is so DIFFERENT to those of these next generations.
     
  3. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you about how government 'toadies' AND central banks coddle and protect stock market casinos above everything and everyone else... which is very evident throughout both Republican AND Democrat regimes -- especially since about the 'dot-com' blowup in 2000 -- then growing MUCH worse later.

    If nothing else, please understand that I don't have many 'sacred cows' left... all FOUR of our presidents in this 21st-century have all but completely SLAUGHTERED them -- one by one.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2021
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  4. Mircea

    Mircea Well-Known Member

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    You're absolutely right.

    Your federal government is the cause and as always, the Federal Reserve tries to fix the problems your stupid federal government creates.

    If your government did not deficit spend, then there were be no need whatsoever for the Federal Reserve to issue marketable treasury securities.

    The high price of housing, whether rents or mortgages, in the handful of 120,000+ housing markets in the US experiencing crippling housing costs is caused by the Departments of Housing & Urban Development and Transportation.

    Neither Department is constitutionally mandated, nor constitutionally justifiable, and thus completely unnecessary.

    You can get rid of the Departments of Agriculture, Education, Health & Human Services, Housing & Urban Development, Labor, and Transportation, and nothing bad would happen, but a helluva lot of good things would happen to a helluva lot of good people.

    Every State is more than capable of providing or performing whatever services those Departments do, and the States can do it better and less costly than the federal government could ever hope to do it.

    You all got it ass-backwards. Everyone should be paying 3% income tax to the federal government, and 10%-35% to their State governments.

    You need to reduce the federal government to its core duties: diplomacy, defense, coining money and financing/revenue management, managing the natural beauty of certain geographic locations, energy, and managing worker's compensation for certain federal employees, namely military members.

    The States can do everything else, and do it better and more cost-effectively.
     
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  5. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    It's funny to hear anyone suggest that the Federal Reserve tries to fix problems that the stupid government creates.

    Ever since Woodrow Wilson and his hyena-pack of liberal Democrats put this misbegotten, unconstitutional central bank into existence in 1913, it's been trying to 'fix' the economy here -- and yet, within twenty years of its creation, what did we get...? The worst economic dysfunction of all -- 'THE GREAT DEPRESSION'.

    It's just been one big joyride ever since -- with one boom and bust after another -- which is exactly the thing that this bastard bank monstrosity was supposed to prevent ever after... but it DIDN'T. And now we're stuck with the son-of-a-bitch, never to have a free-market economy again as this "Fed" central bank joins arms with its 'sister' central banks in other countries in "the West" to establish total control over them, too.

    Hint: two other major-league countries in the world aren't ruled over by their central banks -- Russia, and China. And you what? Their Debt-versus-GDP ratios are less (in Russia's case, FAR less) than HALF of what ours is -- 108%, and rising, every time some half-wit Democrat thinks up something else he wants to blow billions on... money that we DON'T HAVE.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2021
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  6. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    The FAILED doctrine of Libertarianism has NEVER worked in REALITY.

    FACTS matter!
     
  7. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    You are right in your criticism of the "Federal" system that has arisen in this country after Lincoln permanently crippled the 10th Amendment of the Constitution.

    The responsibilities and powers of each of the three branches of Federal government are enumerated in the Constitution, and everything (EVERYTHING) else is to be decided by the individual states and the people who are citizens within them.

    It was a brilliant idea -- the ultimate template for representative Democracy functioning in a healthy Republic -- but Lincoln saddled us with a virtually unlimited, tyrannical central government instead.

    Then, as I said yesterday, a giddy klatch of "Progressives" led by liberal Democrat, Woodrow Wilson, created an unconstitutional 'central bank' in 1913, and the rest is history -- featuring one war after another... along with one 'boom--bust' cycle after another....
     
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  8. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Too bad the FACTS do NOT support your extremist rightwing disinformation "sacred cow", Cy!

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-white-house/presidents/woodrow-wilson/

    https://history.stackexchange.com/questions/51687/was-woodrow-wilson-really-a-liberal

    FACTS matter, Cy!
     
  9. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    You're right, Te, facts do matter....

    And the unrelenting, indisputable fact about how the wholly-unconstitutional Federal Reserve central bank was spawned is simply that the Federal Reserve Act was passed by the 63rd United States Congress, and signed into law by President Woodrow Wilson on December 23, 1913. The law created the Federal Reserve System, the central banking system of the United States.

    Earlier in 1913, "Progressive" Democrats had greatly increased their majority in the House, and won control of the Senate, giving them full control of Congress for the first time since the 53rd Congress in 1893. With Woodrow Wilson being sworn in as President on March 4, 1913, this gave the Democrats an overall federal government trifecta - also for the first time since the 53rd Congress.

    Are we still in agreement?

    Next, since you brought it up, like most White Americans in 1913, Wilson was 'racist' by today's standards. Simply put, he, like Abraham Lincoln and others before him, thought that Negroes were of a slightly 'sub-human' caste, a 'missing-link' in the development of mankind, with limited intelligence... most often suitable for little besides menial labor in primitive, bestial situations. From the comfortable vantage point of 2021, it's easy to despise Wilson's opinions about race, but then you must also condemn the opinions of most other Americans of the time.... :juggle:

    What were some of Wilson's other endearing attributes...? He and his Democrat-dominated Congress burdened Americans with an Income Tax, in addition to an unconstitutional 'central bank'.

    Oh, and he cavalierly ignored frequent European warnings for non-warring countries' citizens to avoid the declared war zone that had been created in the Eastern Atlantic Ocean in 1914. Well, sure enough, the "Lusitania" -- A BRITISH SHIP carrying munitions, and passengers, between the U. S. and the UK -- was sunk by a German submarine. Because Americans were also on board the "Lusitania", Wilson used the event to get us into World War I -- an 'adventure' involving no vital American interest, but which cost a total of 116,708 deaths of U. S. Military personnel. But, I digress.... :police:

    Any objections...? I doubt it, Te. As I said before, you are one of the rare few among 'the opposing faction' that bothers to inform yourself of facts, and, you are not (NOT) stupid!

     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2021
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  10. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    You ALMOST got it right, Cy!

    The Federal Reserve Act is the LAW of the LAND ergo it is CONSTITUTIONAL!

    It was passed in order to REGULATE and STABILIZE interstate commerce which is one of the STIPULATED powers of Congress.

    Simply alleging that something is "unconstitutional" does not alter REALITY one iota.

    You need to be able to argue LEGAL FACTS to support your allegation because we agree, facts DO matter.

    WITHOUT the FRB your SS checks could be WORTHLESS because the banks where YOU live might choose NOT to honor checks issued out of state because cashing your check would mean paying you with money DEPOSITED by other people within the state.

    In essence you would be living on whatever savings you had managed to accumulate in your mattress.
     
  11. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    My description of the "Fed" as being unconstitutional is based in the fact that nowhere in the Constitution of the United States will you find one word about the authorization of a central bank which governs money supply and interest rates for the entire country, to say nothing of "buying bonds", etc.

    You are right... it was passed as law, as I already said several times, by a Congress and Executive Branch dominated by "Progressive" Democrats. But your extrapolation that somehow this makes it OK is, IMHO, far-fetched.

    Sidebar: In 1933, the German "Congress" passed an "Enabling Act" that gave the Chancellor (Adolf Hitler) extraordinary powers not found in the "Constitution" of Germany after the founding of the Weimar Republic: "The Enabling Act (German: Ermächtigungsgesetz) of 1933, officially titled Gesetz zur Behebung der Not von Volk und Reich ("Law to Remedy the Distress of People and Reich")".

    I suggest that it is, indeed, within the raw, brute-force POWER of any legislature to turn a democratic Republic into an autocratic monstrosity which is, nonetheless, "legitimate". And any "bank" that has the unlimited power to control everything of any real importance in the economy has a STRANGLEHOLD on that country!

    [​IMG]. "No, I didn't GRAB power... no, it was GIVEN to me by our Congress...." :twisted:
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2021
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  12. Mircea

    Mircea Well-Known Member

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    If Congress doesn't deficit spend, then there is no need to sell marketable treasury securities, and there wouldn't be marketable treasury securities to sell, since there wouldn't be a deficit.

    And the Federal Reserve does try to fix problems government creates.

    Sometimes it fails, like when the Federal Reserve caused the 1951-52 recession in the Eisencoward Administration.

    WW II rationing ended officially in October 1949. Now it's June 1950 and the Korean War.

    My grandmothers and great-grandmothers hated rationing. And like all the housewives, as soon as their husbands got home from work after hearing news of the war, they all jumped in their cars and headed to the grocery stores to start hoarding butter, flour, sugar, cooking oil, shortening and everything else they can get their hands on.

    Business and industry are hoarding everything, because they hate rationing, too.

    All Truwoman had to do is get on the radio (only a few people had TVs) and say hey, folks, we're not gonna ration. Or, we are going to ration, or we're just gonna ration a few thing to irritate the holy hell out of everyone.

    But, Truwoman didn't have the guts to do that, probably because he was too busy sitting in a corner playing with himself.

    So, inflation is 10+%, but it isn't Monetary Inflation, it's Demand-pull Inflation and the Federal Reserve was too stupid to understand that so they started jacking interest rates and shrinking the money supply.

    That put the brakes on everything and everybody got an 18 month recession for fun.
     
  13. Mircea

    Mircea Well-Known Member

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    Boom and Bust cycles are nothing new.

    The 1700s and 1800s are replete with panics, recessions and depressions.

    The difference between the 20th Century and the 19th Century is the 20th Century had fewer depressions.
     
  14. Zorro

    Zorro Well-Known Member

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    It's here!

    Stagflation rears its ugly head in US payroll data.
    29,000 Retail employment jobs GONE!
    ZERO additional leisure and hospitality employment jobs.

    Increased average wages strongly associated with reduced number of job growth.

    [​IMG]

    When employees become more expensive, you can afford fewer of them.

    Weird Whispering Biden claimed that by funding a strike against US employers that he would increase wages, but, when employers can't find employees, or they are too expensive, they make different choices.

    So, you get higher costs and fewer goods and services, or Stagflation.

    "Rents are up 12% year-on-year."
    "Homes up 20%"
    "Used Cars up 25%, new up 10%"
    "Major auto companies announced production shutdowns to the global chip shortage."

    Biden just lurches from one FU to the next.

    As for a Market "Crash", over the last year the S&P is up 30%, but, I think folks are trading the Fed, not the market.

    [​IMG]
     
  15. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Then I recommend that you cease and desist from ADVOCATING for FAILED Libertarian policies such as these;

    Sad when YOUR own words DEBUNK your own allegations.

    :roflol:
     
  16. Tejas

    Tejas Banned

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    Federal Reserve rats jumping ship ??

    Is this really about "ethics"... or do they KNOW something ?!



    Federal Reserve regional presidents Robert Kaplan and Eric Rosengren said Thursday they will sell individual stock holdings amid ethics concerns regarding trading in 2020.

    The Fed officials will sell all their stocks by Sept. 30 and put the proceeds in passive investments, they said in statements released Thursday.

    “While my personal saving and investment transactions have complied with the Federal Reserve’s ethics rules, I have decided to address even the appearance of any conflict of interest by taking the following steps,” Rosengren, president of the Boston Fed, said.


    https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/09/fed...ock-portfolio-to-address-ethics-concerns.html

    ?
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2021
  17. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well we have had three rough weeks. Inflation is raising its ugly head which makes cash , trash. Been slowly repositioning into financials, materials, tech and autos.
     
  18. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It isn't about ethics.
     
  19. 19Crib

    19Crib Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    When you don’t know what to do, go into short term bond funds.
    There is also a way to buy gold bullion without taking possession. See Kitco. (Canadian).
     
  20. ToddWB

    ToddWB Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have alot people showing an interest in real estate now, much more that in the last 30 years (length of my experience) nobody wants to have cash
     
  21. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    From what I have read and heard, personal savings are way up. I think it may be people holding cash until the other shoe drops so to speak this winter with inflation.
     
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  22. tharock220

    tharock220 Well-Known Member

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    So did you stay with cash until the Dow hit 8000. What were your investments when it got that low?
     
  23. tharock220

    tharock220 Well-Known Member

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    I'm really glad I didn't buy back in until the Dow hit 8000. Tell me again about your investment skills.
     
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  24. ToddWB

    ToddWB Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am spending mine as fast as I can (not hard , considering I'm adding to my house) before it loses all value. I like something of value that is concrete.
     
  25. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    If it is your forever home, it really doesn't matter about the value. However, I think when the bottom falls out of real estate, it is going to be just as ugly as the great recession as far as house values/foreclosures etc. A lot of people could very well be way underwater again on their recent purchases. Great time to sell though. Just a horrible time to buy unless you intend it to be your forever home and never need to refinance. A local credit union is doing 30 year fixed mortgages at less than 2%. That is insane especially considering inflation. With that low rate, you can afford to buy a lot more at the same payment than at 4.5% but banks are going to be losing value the entire time they hold that mortgage. I think they will assume most of these people will have to refinance at some point.
     
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