Practical firearms discussion

Since there is no section for the discussion of firearms outside of matters of politics, it is necessary to improvise on such.

Based on all available research, one of the most popular firearms for concealed carry is the Glock 26 subcompact pistol, regarded as the so-called "gold standard" by some due to its reliability, accuracy, and the fact that it can accept the same double stack magazines utilized by the larger models if such is desired.

What are some subcompact handguns that are regarded as viable alternatives to the Glock 26, based on not only caliber, but capacity, magazine options, and overall size and weight parameters being taken into consideration?

 

While high capacity is a plus, most defensive situations will be resolved in one or a few shots. Note Zimmerman’s defense against Martin.

Police need to engage bad guys, but a defender only needs to protect themselves. As such, a defensive weapon should be based on individual needs. A Glock 26 with 10+1 is larger than a Glock 43 6+1 but the Glock 43 is more concealable. Additionally, most women I know prefer a revolver. Therefore a 5 or 6-shot revolver shooting 38 plus Ps might be preferable to them.

Examples of concealed carry revolvers:
https://gundigest.com/handguns/concealed-carry/5-standout-concealed-carry-revolvers-carry

Factor in the difference between a carry sidearm and a “car gun” which allows a full size 9mm or .45

 

The most popular non-Glock I know for CCW is the S&W Shield in 9mm, 40 S&W and. 45 ACP, especially in Gen 2.

 

A G 26 is part of my concealed carry stable. There's a lot to be said about it. The female officers of the Scotland Yard protective detail that protects the Royals use the G26. With the 4th generation on, it will fit most male and female hands. It's accurate enough and totally reliable. The trigger is good but not excellent and you can buy just about any accessory you want. The bad is that it's really wide for excellent concealment. For me, I absolutely have to use the extended 12 rounds mags to get a secure grip.
That brings up the numerous single stack 9's. I'm still using my old S&W 3913 in that capacity. I tried the G 43, but it was just too small and factory mags are just too low capacity. I'm still looking for the ideal replacement.

 

Interestingly, one of my favorite all-around deep concealed carry pistols is the old S&W 469 and its stainless steel brother, the 669. They're a little slimmer than the G26, and you can find Marlin Camp 9 mags that fit flush with the bottom of the frame. They're only slightly taller and longer than the G26 but hold 12+1 rounds. Their ergonomics work extremely well for me, and they have the shortest trigger reset of any semi-auto pistol I've ever run; even shorter than some 1911's.

They do have a mag disconnect, which is a strike against them IMHO, but not enough of one for me to worry very much about it.

 

The 6900 series of pistols were a big improvement over the 2nd gens and the DAO's while rare were among the best. I'm amazed that S&W didn't recognize the push to DAO operation. it's unfortunate that Smith decided to discontinue their excellent 3rd gen pistols.

 

The question when it comes to carry is an individual thing.

It depends on how you carry, what you wear, body size/shape, etc.

I prefer the S&W Shield over the Glock. I don't like the added bulk of a double stack mag, and it's only 2 rounds less capacity.

The P365 is a new gun you might want to take a look at.

https://www.sigsauer.com/products/firearms/pistols/p365/

 

I do have a 6906 that's been tuned as a carry gun (my wife stole that one from me), but the ergonomics of the 2nd Gen 469 actually work better in my hand than the 3rd gen does in some models. It's a matter of feel more than anything else; they just point better for me.

That said, I do agree with you that it is unfortunate S&W didn't stick with them. I still want to get my hands on a good example of the 3913; I just saw one on Gunbroker that was tuned by Wayne Novak, and it kills me I can't afford it at this moment.

 

About a year ago, Buds had a number of them used in very good condition that were PD backups. They were gone in about a week. While a bit heavy, with the DA/SA operation you can pocket carry them. You don't want to do that with a Glock.
You do know that our liberal "friend" responding to the tactical thread is full of shizer and can't describe the standard trigger system on a 229. He's not even a good poseur.

 

Why are you making things up? You never asked me what the trigger system is. You asked...and I quote...
‘BTW how was that Sig trigger for target shooting?’

If you wanted to know the trigger action then why didn’t you ask that directly? Oh I know...because you want to play games.
Trigger action is DA/SA, also has a de-cocker and no safety. Any other questions ask me directly instead of being vague.

 

A G26 is among my CC battery, carried depending on my attire. So many after market options you can set one up for most any preference. 10+1 for better concealment, but you can also G17 or G19 spare mags easily. I use a Technaclip which makes mine even more concealable... not much different than a single stack with and IWB in width. I also have a G19 but strangely I am more accurate with my 26...both with factory barrels. When holster carrying, I often use a G17 mag with the Xgrip spacer...very comfortable to shoot. While I train frequently with failure drills, mine has never failed to feed or eject no matter it’s meal. I did have a problem at one point with it doing doubles and triples, some, but not me, might consider a plus, I traced the problem to a defective trigger bar, replaced it and never had another issue. Works for me, but I have a couple other CC options that work for me too.
BTW, I don’t recommend the Technaclip for most because it should be paired with something that prevents accidetal discharges from a snagged trigger, a couple options are Triggerblok or a Siderlock among a couple others, but if used, their must be incorporated in any training regimen.

 

I like the Ruger SP101 .357 mag. It is small and light enough to carry concealed, yet heavy enough to make the recoil of the .357 manageable, I did not say pleasant as this is a snappy little revolver.

Some advantages: 1) I can practice with .38 special which is cheaper and less recoil. 2) If in a confrontation, the person knows for certain the firearm is loaded, you can see the bullet. 3) Reliability and ease of use. I can throw a revolver in my safe, a year later pull it out and it will shoot. A semi-auto requires frequent maintenance and cleaning. If you take a Glock and throw it in your safe after a trip to the range, without cleaning, a year later, I wouldn't trust that firearm to function properly.

 

I had the S&W 686 and shot .38 for same reason...much cheaper. That gun would not be a good option for someone who wanted to carry given its size and weight. But it was fun to shoot.

 

Plainly put, your record of posts is less than friendly, I have a long history of firearms training, mostly law enforcement, Miltary, etc....
...You seem to know everything, so I will not trouble you.

 

Takes two to tango

 

Uh yeah, hence why N.Y.P.D. would never approve such things, too much potential user error.

In that case a revolver is not too bad.

 

Some people become complacent with pistols. I used to periodically shake my head at people shooting themselves or another climbing over fences with loaded guns, or lowering a loaded rifle from a tree with a rope.
The Glock trigger is great for getting into action, but I can’t count the times I have seen people oblivious to the possibility of a trigger snag, or those that handle one with their finger in trigger well.
The Trigger Block works well for Glocks (made by the same people selling the Technaclip), I used one for a while, but now prefer the Siderlock, but I also train with it. But, that’s me... I frequently carry a highly tuned compact 1911, but I train with it frequently and don’t recommend one for everyone, paricularly if they are not prone to frequent training or maintenance. I carry a PM9 when I am lightly clothed with a Technaclip and a triggerblok I made...works great, provides extra safety and functions instantly. It works for me.
I believe people should be aware of their guns pros and cons, go for as much consisency as possible, train as they would carry, and always have a frame of mind when handlingvtheir weapons as if the were handling poisonous snake... not with fear, but with expert, focused care.

 

Those devices will get a LEO killed by a criminal whose gun is a primitive already to go gun, a 1911 or even a Revolver.
Or even an 1873 Colt single action is preferable.

In the fraction of a second faddling with that crap.

No, care in holster choice, keep finger off trigger.

The Federal Bureau of Investigation, FLET, standard does not appove that stuff,
N.Y.P.D. does not.
Currently approved Glocks do not need such junk add ons.

Pardon me for saying so as I respect you very much.

Like the Browning High power, sucky magazine safety, sucky grinding trigger, give me a 1911 everytime.

Crisp glass like trigger, I have survived too many gun fights, simpler is much better.

Forget you have a doo dad fangled safety, and in the split second, to remember,
BANG !
you are dead.

And no, no gun is like a poisonous snake, it cannot bite on it's own.

Sorry, but that is pure hogwash.

My Law Enforcement training was too complete and my Civilian Instructorship was derived from that as far as technical shooting, legality differences in rules of engagement.

 

Man! That G26 is a hard act to follow. I've carried one for a long time now. For magazine capacity, size, and reliability, it is very hard to beat. Granted, they are not for everybody because some people are not comfortable with the width of the grip. So, generally, they opt for something that is about the same height and length, but with a thinner grip and lower magazine capacity. I am slender, and I generally wear 511 cargo pants. They are loose fitting on me (aka "baggy") and so the G26 carried in a DeSantis pocket holster doesn't "print" on me at all. I do own a G42, Glock's little .380, for when I'm wearing something more tight fitting like a pair of slacks. But 95% of the time I'm carrying that G26 in the pocket holster. Before I retired from full time law enforcement, I carried a G21 as my primary duty weapon on my right hip, with the G26 in my front left pocket. This gave me access to a firearm with either hand.

So, to answer your question, I really can't. IMHO, there really isn't a better small 9mm that carries 11 rounds than the G26.

Lately, I've been carrying mine with Glock's optional magazine extension which adds 2 more rounds of magazine capacity. Carried with this magazine, it is 12 + 1. It is the one in the gun in the picture. The other two are the standard 10 round magazines, one with a finger extension, and one without.

Seth

 

The Glock 19 is only slightly bigger.
And since I wear regular street clothes, I fail to see why shorts make any difference in concealed carry over long pants ?

 

I agree. With a Glock, one must train to keep the trigger finger out of the trigger guard no matter what you're doing - drawing, holstering, moving, loading, unloading - unless you have made a conscious decision to fire the gun. But as long as you do that, and use a holster, the gun is perfectly safe.

 

Old time Police Officers sometimes negligently fired with a S&W revolver 6 lb trigger !
By keeping a finger on the trigger ala one bullet Barney Fife.

 

My priority is reliability. I figure, most likely, one shot will due. So I go with revolver for carry. .357 mag for versatility, FMJ if bear is a possibility, HP the rest of the time.

For bear, I'd still like to get my hands on those solid copper police slugs that (winchester?) put out breifly some decadea ago for shooting through engine blocks in car chases as they're legal from the factory, but they're real pricey being so rare.

 

Uh, you can crack a water jacket with 9mm, and if you pierce a radiator, that will suffice too.
Tires destroyed from spike barriers, unless the car has solid tires.

And solid copper bullets for Law Enforcement ?

I am unaware of it, my FLET re-training made no mention of it aside from standard Federal hp ammo, 9mm 124 grain +P out of a Glock 17 or 19 etc......

 

Winchester (or sometimes 'Western') Super X Metal Piercing .357 Mag

its a pretty hot collector ammo from the 70s