Why nobody wants to join the Army this year

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by Nightmare515, Jul 13, 2022.

  1. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2018
    Messages:
    14,054
    Likes Received:
    10,741
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If he were lazy he wouldn't be running for president again and would instead be growing fat and old and relaxing somewhere hot.

    Lol.
     
  2. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    he played golf most of his presidency, laziest President ever

    growing fat and old, Trump is already fat and old
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2022
    JonK22 likes this.
  3. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2018
    Messages:
    14,054
    Likes Received:
    10,741
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Got lots done and was a more effective leader
     
  4. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    got hardly anything done, Trump was a failure of a President
     
    JonK22 likes this.
  5. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2018
    Messages:
    14,054
    Likes Received:
    10,741
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    He did just fine as a matter of fact. And was the correct choice in 2020.
     
    submarinepainter likes this.
  6. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Trump did not even get Mexico to pay for his wall or his healthcare bill, his two major promises...sad!

    Trump did not know the art of the deal
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2022
    JonK22 likes this.
  7. ToughTalk

    ToughTalk Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2018
    Messages:
    14,054
    Likes Received:
    10,741
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    You sure you want to talk about the southern border now?

    Lol.

    You kind of like bouncing from one Biden failure to another, don't ya?
     
  8. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    nice diversion... Trump failed
     
    JonK22 likes this.
  9. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113

    That might be true of society at large and of course for our policy makers, who so quickly tried to get us into war with Russia, forgetting that we just had our asses kicked, but it's not true of the military community.
     
  10. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    yeah, the Trump deal with the terrorists probably did not sit well with many that fought in Afghanistan
     
    JonK22 and Hey Now like this.
  11. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Ignorant comment, but I guess if you have a specialty, revel in it.
     
    vman12 likes this.
  12. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    thanks for warning us about your comment up front
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2022
    JonK22, Lil Mike and Hey Now like this.
  13. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113
    OK I had to give a "like" to that! Your "I know you are but what am I" PeeWee style of argumentation is somewhat endearing in it's simplicity.
     
    FreshAir and Hey Now like this.
  14. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,326
    Likes Received:
    5,197
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It actually wasn't mentioned very often at all. The surveys are multiple choice with the ability to add comments for further explanation. The multiple choices are vague so we primarily use the comments to gauge why folks are choosing to leave. The majority of the dissent came from more personal issues. For example the number one "choice" for why folks are choosing to ETS/Retire was "morale" with the explanations about why their morale was low due to the aforementioned reasons. The Afghanistan withdrawal wasn't really a concern mentioned by people it was primarily the shifting culture of the Army and the COVID protocols.
     
    Seth Bullock and Lil Mike like this.
  15. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,326
    Likes Received:
    5,197
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It's most certainly an issue. There are more overweight Soldiers walking around now than I have ever seen in my entire career. I have no idea the policies in place to deal with them anymore and I don't understand why they are still around. I don't think the height and weight standards are being enforced as strictly anymore. Granted I was never a fan of the Army's height and weight standards nor am I a fan of the way they calculate it. You can literally be morbidly obese and pass the tape test because they simply measure your waistline and neck and calculate for body fat percentage. If you are fat with a fat neck then you'll pass even if you are like 50 pounds over your allowable weight.

    To be honest I've always been more concerned with work ethic and competency over PT studs. Unless your MOS is one that requires a specific level of physical fitness then I couldn't really care less if you are overweight as long as you do your job well. But based on the amount of just flat out fat people in the service at the moment I have a feeling the Army just doesn't seem to care anymore. They used to force you on a diet and additional exercise program if you were fat but most of these folks I see are fat and have been fat for years with little to no improvement and they are still around so I don't know...
     
    Seth Bullock likes this.
  16. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    157,067
    Likes Received:
    67,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    its not just weight though, a high carb\low fat diet affects the mind and body via metabolic issues
     
  17. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Can confirm.

    Fewer military families recommend joining the service, survey finds

    A new survey released on Thursday showed fewer military families recommend joining the service, arguing pay and benefits are not enough to justify the difficulties that come with service.

    The 2021 Military Family Support Programming Survey conducted by the Military Family Advisory Network found just 62.9 percent of military and veteran families would recommend joining the military – a significant drop from 74.5 percent in 2019.

    My father served, my brother and I served, and my son served. We are one of those families that have made the military a "family business" since the end of the draft era. But I would be hard pressed to recommend the military today if I were asked by a younger relative, or any younger person. Maybe if there were some specific training involved, but in general, no. I can't get past how the Pentagon threw people into a meatgrinder for twenty years, lied about your real situation, then walked away like nothing happened.
     
    vman12 and Seth Bullock like this.
  18. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    20,754
    Likes Received:
    8,050
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I am sure those not joining the misery of being a dog face will not miss anything.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2022
  19. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It looks like a lot is being written about the current recruiting crisis, or maybe I'm just drawn to those articles.

    The Recruiting Crisis Has Arrived, Part One

    It’s been bad for a long time for the Army. The other services have done better, as they are more selective, have smaller annual cohorts, and generally have a number of things going for them that the Army does not have. The Army, on the other hand, along with the Marines, bore the largest burden of supplying trained and ready units for the Afghanistan, Horn of Africa, Iraq, and Syria campaigns. Oh, and the peacekeeping efforts in Sinai, Bosnia, Kosovo, the Haiti and Pakistan earthquake relief missions, and a slew of other smaller operational deployments like the Southwest Border mission which generally get little to no publicity. Because of those demands, and the expansion of the Army during the 2000s, followed by the drawdown of the Army after 2012, and a literal hogshead full of other factors, recruiting is now *really bad* after the COVID pandemic, the civil unrest associated with the George Floyd murder across the country, and the civil unrest in D.C. during the Presidential exchange of power in January of 2020.



    A lot of good points in this one...

    No one wants to join the military anymore

    The Army, for instance, has met only 40 percent of its enlisted recruitment target for the fiscal year, which for the military services ends on September 30. Those in the Pentagon tasked with attracting candidates have listed reasons they are struggling to meet their mission: lack of eligibility, Covid restrictions putting a damper on outreach, competition from a robust civilian employment market, and a lack of a desire to serve.

    ...an internal Defense Department survey obtained by NBC showed that of those eligible, only 9 percent had an interest in serving. In the same survey, half of respondents thought they would suffer physical problems if they joined, and 57 percent thought they would suffer emotional or psychological problems. It’s almost like the last twenty years of failed wars and thousands of wounded warriors has made potential recruits reconsider their life choices.

    As detailed in Samuel Huntington’s Who Are We?, in 1991, when asked “How proud are you to be an American?” 96 percent said “very proud” or “quite proud.” Recently, Gallup released their similar annual poll, and found that 65 percent were “extremely proud” or “very proud.” Unsurprisingly, national pride was markedly higher among self-identified Republicans, men, those over fifty-five years of age, and those without a college degree. It doesn’t take a genius to understand that the youth won’t sacrifice for something they don’t feel connected to. But if the groups highest in patriotic sentiment aren’t interested in serving in the same numbers as in the past, what else is going on?

    Read the whole thing.
     
  20. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    Messages:
    11,326
    Likes Received:
    5,197
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That was sort of the basis for my original post about this. We already have a huge problem convincing anybody to join the Army. Out of the small pool of potential recruits the majority of people who do tend to join the Army are Conservatives/Republicans and even most of THEM don't want to join. Yet we are shifting military culture in favor of more Progressive ideology? What for? They don't join anyway regardless and by doing that they are upsetting even the tiny pool of Conservative potential recruits who are already largely pissed off about other things and don't want to join....

    The reasons listed in the survey aren't really wrong though. You probably will suffer some form of physical damage while in the Army and likely some emotional problems based on the individual and when the time comes the Army will do everything in it's power to pretend like it had nothing to do with any of that.
     
    vman12, Seth Bullock and Lil Mike like this.
  21. Mushroom

    Mushroom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    13,160
    Likes Received:
    2,928
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Actually, the problems in this are many, but it really has nothing to do with "woke politics".

    Yes, we get classes to death on such topics. But here is the thing, we don't really care. And I have never heard of somebody wanting to get out because they did not want to hear another such lecture.

    As for retention, a lot of this actually dates back about 12 years ago when President Obama started the last major RIF process. And as part of that, the "up and out" requirement for rank compared to years of service was made even harder. This forced a lot of people out, and those standards have never changed.

    Not all that long ago, you could retire as a Sergeant. Not anymore, so a lot of those that are in the mid-range are simply getting out because otherwise they will see themselves in at 14-16 years, and not be able to stay in any longer.

    And yes, it is getting harder for recruiters to find qualified candidates now, because of basic military requirements.

    Be within the height and weight limits.
    Have a High School Diploma (or GED and 20 college credit hours)
    Clean criminal record
    No drug use.

    And all of those are major problems, especially the last two. I have talked to recruiters in California and Oregon, and they all say that it is damned near impossible to find people who are actually allowed to join without lying. And as more and more "Red" states pass Legalization laws, expect the military to come increasingly from "Blue" states, because they are going to have more that are eligible to join.
     
  22. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113
    This sounds like a pretty good solution to the recruiting crisis...Fat camp!

    US Army Plans To Create A Fat Camp For Overweight, Out Of Shape Recruits

    The Army announced plans Tuesday to establish a “prep course” for potential recruits who fall below the Army’s minimum academic requirements and exceed weight and body fat percentage caps amidst a historic recruiting crisis.

    Created in response to a “precipitous” decline in the number of young recruits who meet the Army’s enlistment requirements, the 90-day Future Soldier Preparatory Course pilot program, which begins in August, will help prospective service members lose weight and improve their academic performance, the Army said in a statement. Only 23% of young Americans are eligible to enlist based on weight and educational metrics, according to the Army.
     
  23. Farnsworth

    Farnsworth Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,956
    Likes Received:
    835
    Trophy Points:
    113
    All reasons why there is all that R&D being done on un-manned ground vehicle drones and not just un-manned aircraft and factory robots.
     
  24. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    53,981
    Likes Received:
    24,903
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Robots are not going to save a country that can't even man a military of a million and a half out of a population of over 330 million.


    upload_2022-7-28_12-57-2.png
     
  25. Farnsworth

    Farnsworth Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2010
    Messages:
    1,956
    Likes Received:
    835
    Trophy Points:
    113

    I never said they would , but replacing humans is going on in every job category, including the military. And, that 'population of 330 million' is about two thirds a caused by illegal immigration and it drags down education systems and physical well being with it.

    I hardly ever see anybody actually digging ditches by hand any more anywhere, all done by machines even on road work these days. It used yo be called 'reaping what you sow', and all of it is caused by corporate 'management' decisions, and not just govt. bureaucrats. Labor racketeering via 'out-sourcing' also kills off all kinds of skills.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2022

Share This Page