Part 3 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

You arent answering anything. You may think you are but to all reading you are avoiding questions. I asked you point blank three times now to provide evidence that atheists are corrupting science. You and the OP have provided no evidence at all, none, zero, zip, nada. You are the one that made the accusation not me. Failure to post factual proof that atheists corrupted science means you have lied. A sin. You and the OP have clearly avoided the direct question. This is like the salem witch trials. They accused with no proof then murdered in the name of God. How evil. Dont you ever question yourself as to why you cant answer questions honestly and without difficulty?
So here we go again.... I asked you if God will protect us from an asteroid impact. You say yes, then say all deserving humans will go to heaven. So your answer is NO god cannot protect us from getting killed by an asteroid.

 

Jesus was not talking about His 2nd coming, nor was He talking about His resurrection. It is unlikely that Jesus would be talking about the 2nd coming because that hasn’t happened yet, and all the men and women who He was talking to are now dead. Similarly, It seems unlikely that Jesus would say to His disciples and the others gathered there that some of them would be alive at His resurrection, especially since it only happened about a year or less following this event.

So, Jesus must have been referring to some other significant event. So what significant event could Jesus be talking about here. Clearly Jesus is referring to something that some of the people listening to Jesus will experience, but others will not.

The distruction of the Temple in Jerusalem in 70 AD could very well be what Jesus was referring to. This event had occurred about 40 yrs. after Jesus spoke these words to His disciples. Many of those who were there would have lived to see the day that Jerusalem and the Temple were destroyed. Jesus Himself predicted this very event in Matthew 24.

This event was significant in that it closed the chapter on Temple worship which was no longer necessary. Jesus had become the temple, and his Holy Spirit had now been given to us, thus the temple was present with us and in the church. Therefore, when the Temple was destroyed it was a powerful, eschatological, signifier that the kingdom of God was coming into the world, and Jesus is "IN His kingdom."

Now as far as His 2nd coming, Jesus has provided clues in His Olivet Discourse (see Mark 13) that He would return only after there were believers to be gathered from the ends of the earth, (see Mark 13:27) which means in a future generation, since presumably there wasn't even time for the gospel to have spread that far in the first generation.

So Jesus is certainly speaking of all future events that have not occurred. The context of the passage is in global terms, so it appears difficult to assume that in a short amout of time there would be believers "from the ends of the earth" (See Mark 13:24-27). Jesus appears to be speaking of a future time, and that the generation alive at that time will not be completely wipred out, but will see Christ return.

The disciples of Jesus were certainly not confused or thrown back by His so-called fail to return. They did not appear to understand it as having to occur in their lifetime.

As Scripture tells us in 2 Peter 3:8-9 NLT, "But you must forget this one thing, dear friends. A day is like a thousand years to the Lord, and a thousand years is like a day. The Lord isn't really being slow about His promise, as some people think. No, He is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent."

 

Wow, this is some serious level of denial.

"24 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me. 25 For whoever wants to save their life[f] will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me will find it. 26 What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul? 27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.

28 “Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

He is clearly talking about the Second Coming.

But... your excuse... "Jesus couldn't have been talking about his Second Coming because... it didn't happen like that!"

Duh. That is the problem.

He is talking to his Disciples, not just "people".

How is the destruction of the temple a new Kingdom coming?

WOAH WOAH WOAH. False. Even Paul worshiped at the Church, it was INCREDIBLY important to early Christianity.

"26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens."

Eh... this seems to me to be a supernatural event, obviously, with angels coming down and what not. As an atheist, here are my two concerns with what you just said about this verse:

1) Could not God have sped up the process of spreading the Gospel so it COULD have been done?

and

2) This passage is easily explained if we look at what the writers at the time thought was the "entire" world when in reality it was a very small portion of it.

Okay, and two more problems:

1) The author of The Second Epistle of Peter is questionable, there is a lot of evidence that it is pseudepigraphal in nature.

and

2) This is just a repeat of #1 from above, but why could God not just speed up the process i.e. building a massive friggin boat like the Ark to travel around the world?

 

No, it obvious you didn't understand what I posted. The blood line of Noah and his family wasn't polluted in the sense they did not have the demonic fallen angels bloodline in them. That is why Noah and his family were spared, all 8 of them.

Satan attempted to pollute the blood line with his fallen anglels but he obviously failed because as we learn in Scripture God flooded the entire earth to rid this polluted bloodline. Below is what I posted, read it again real slow so you can understand it with clarity:

My friend WanRen explained this is on pg. 1 post #8 in Part 2. Basically God sent the flood because of the fallen angels that left heaven and came to earth to have children with the daughters of Adam and Eve. The offspring of this union were the Nephilim or giants (Genesis 6:1-4 and Jude v6).

This was an attempt by Satan to pollute the blood line of Adam and Eve which is the same blood line that our Lord Savior Jesus Christ came from (See Luke 3:23-

 

That sounds funny coming from an atheist the word "denial"...lol

That is a word more suited for an atheist...to be in "denial" of the truth!

 

The only denial here is denial of what is written in the Bible. You seem to like to make things up as you go along.

Jesus gave specific details of what would happen at the end of the world. He said these things would happen in the lifetime of the people he was speaking to.

These things never happened.

You should review Matt 24.

 

Not Jews, followers of Judaism don't mix them together. Judaism do not recognize Jesus Christ they do not accept the NT, while Christians accept both the OT (Torah of Judaism) and the NT that Jesus Christ is Son of God, Messiah and God.

 

Just like now you make up wild claims that I did not answer your question when in fact I answer them point blank that is why you have all this wild claims that no one answer your questions and decided to answer it yourself. You ask for corrupted scientist I gave you one S. Hawking here is another one Charles Darwin.

See, you don't like my answer so you make up your answers. I repeat God will protect us from asteroid impact by allowing deserving humans to enter heaven or you want single phrase answer Yes God will protect us. Are you afraid you are not deserving?

 

Jesus have not yet return, you are right.

Jesus resurrected during the life time and generation of the Apostles and St. Thomas was the last Apostle to fully worship Jesus Christ after he touch and saw Jesus in person, no ghost and no hoax "St. Thomas after touching Jesus Christ and seeing him in person he humble himself to Jesus and said "My Lord and my God" and Jesus responded "Blessed are those who have not seen me and yet believe".

Jesus Christ or the Catholic church never made any claim that Jesus Christ will return in our generation.

 

The so-called "Documentary Hypothesis of the Pentateuch" (a.k.a. "the Wellhausen Hypothesis")--to which most biblical scholars now hew--holds that the first five books of the Old Testament were not authored by Moses, but by four separate writers; two of whom were the Elohist (who uses "El" for God) and the Yahwist (who uses the Tetragrammaton, YHWH--or, Latinized, JHVH--for God).

 

Jesus Christ did not give the specific day;
Matthew 24: 36 “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.

 

Sorry that doesn't qualify as having absolute proof of God being non-existent. You and everyone else for that matter have never seen gravity but it exists.

 

Odd how you ignored that entire post and cherry picked that one statement. I also ask for non christian references for this jesus (witnesses) who saw him. Sit around for another 2000 years and people are going to be having this same discussion when he still has failed to show.

Misunderstood what?

Matthew 24:33-34

"So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."

So point to where in this verse it is speaking of a future generation 2000 years later.

Luke 11:29

"And when the people were gathered thick together, he began to say, This is an evil generation: they seek a sign; and there shall no sign be given it, but the sign of Jonas the prophet".

Both Luke and your god man say "this" generation they are not speaking in future tense they are speaking in present tense.

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Review it? Hell he has not even read it!

 

Review it? Hell he has not even read it!

 

Yeah thats your tail. I sit on mine.

 

One last time....you need to cite evidence of corruption. You failed a fourth time to answer. Because hawking doesnt agree with doesnt mean his science is wrong.

 

He didn't ask for a corrupted scientist. He wants to know if you have any evidence that the science they shared with the world is corrupted in some way.
This would require that you know something about science and could show how they have erred in their research. You don't do that. You simply make declarative statements that they are corrupted, but never show that they are in any way other than they disagree with your chosen interpretation of a biblical worldview.
Can you do that?
An honest faith in God has to take knowledge from wherever it may come and utilize it to understand the greater truth with more clarity, not reject knowledge in an effort to maintain an arbitrary worldview.
Science isn't religions enemy. They are partners in the search for answers to the greatest questions man can ask.

 

No one said he did ?

He said it would happen during the lifetime of those listening to him.

Never happened during their lifetime.

So then, this leaves us with limited choices:

1) Jesus was mistaken
2) The Bible is not inerrant and the writer if Matt made a mistake
3) Deny reality and pretend the passage does not exist, or make up some ridiculous story to try and explain away reality.

 

We have very strong evidence for its existence, though. We can predict the movement of celestial objects very accurately based on our knowledge of their masses which allows us to know what their gravitational fields are, which allows us to predict celestial movements with extreme accuracy. Not only that, we've developed tools that can measure changes in gravity on earth between areas with different altitudes and different soil and rock compositions (for instance, an area with a large concentration of metal ores high in the mountains is going to have a stronger gravitational pull than a sandy beach at sea level) and even determine the gravitational pull of large buildings. We can clearly observe, replicate, and predict gravity and its effects on the universe at large. We cannot do the same with any deity.

 

This is often the case. So often we hear folks reciting doctrine that they heard from the local fundamentalist leader, not realising that what they are saying is contradicted by the Bible.

I have yet to see any of the "tough questions" answered with anything but avoidance (just have faith= don't question and just believe).

Proverbs/Ecclesiastes says seek knowledge and wisdom.

Jesus says to beware of false prophets and that even the elect will be deceived, or be deceivers.

The mantra of denial (just have faith) is then best rephrased as , "Just have faith in those that are trying to deceive"

I wonder if "just have faith" was what Martin Luther was thinking when he was writing his list of complaints against the Church ?

 

Who knows. Then he got all pissed because the Jews rejected his thesis....maybe he should have hung it on another door.

 

Just make sure you don't scream ouch and blame others on self inflicted pain.

 

And not for the last time I repeat, for the fourth time you have deny that Charles Darwin and S. Hawking corrupted science with their unfounded and unsupported theories influencing people such as you to believe and accept his corrupted science that God is none existence. S. Hawking should just stick to his physicist and mathematical abilities and stay away from the science of theology that he is not equip or have enough knowledge to understand and if to you that is not corruption then...."Houston we have a problem". And this go the same with Charles Darwin.

 

Their theories are very well supported. The Theory of Evolution is one of the most well supported, if not the mos well supported, scientific theory humans have developed. Dr. Hawking's theories are also very well supported and have very strong evidence for them.

Ha! Theology is not a science. It does not partake in any part of the scientific method.

Darwin never really said anything about the existence or non-existence of any deity. However, I also don't see why they should not have done so, either.

 

No science is not enemy of religion especially to Christianity and I have stated that many times, but scientist listen carefully I said scientist some of them will twist theories present them as facts to debunk theology for bias reasons or for lack of knowledge and as soon as they do that it substantially affect their credibility. These scientist who claim to only follow logic and facts and yet since they have no sufficient facts to proof that God is none existence they go on to try and relate their science to their personal opinion.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/may/15/stephen-hawking-interview-there-is-no-heaven
A belief that heaven or an afterlife awaits us is a "fairy story" for people afraid of death, Stephen Hawking has said.

In a dismissal that underlines his firm rejection of religious comforts, Britain's most eminent scientist said there was nothing beyond the moment when the brain flickers for the final time.

"I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark," he added.

Hawking's latest comments go beyond those laid out in his 2010 book, The Grand Design, in which he asserted that there is no need for a creator to explain the existence of the universe. The book provoked a backlash from some religious leaders, including the chief rabbi, Lord Sacks, who accused Hawking of committing an "elementary fallacy" of logic.

This is how corrupt S. Hawking science is if the brain is a computer then like the computer someone has to put them together to program it to make it functional. He implies that the brain computer created itself???