U.S. Gasoline Falls to $3.48 a Gallon, Lundberg Survey Shows

I am not defending that view, and I do not care who is responsible for the causes of artificially increasing the cost of producing gas. I just want it fixed.

I'm curious about your opinions on the following:

1) How much more expensive is it to produce gas when boutique fuels of many different formulations - formulations that are mandated to change seasonally and geographically - are required?

2) What effect does the perception of a POTUS' position have - as adversarial to, or complicit with regard to creating the economic environment which nurtures oil production and fuel refining - on the speculation market?

3) How much land which contains viable oil leases are in the hands of the US Government?

4) What impact does US policy with regard to Syria, Egypt and Iran have on fuel prices?

5) What amount per gallon of gas should the US tax? What amount should States tax?

Let's start with these.

 

I actually see an original, non-'copy and paste' response. I'm interested in knowing what you think was the reason the cost was near $4/gallon and now its dropping...

 

OK, so you do not defend the view I was attacking in my post you jumped in on. Do you agree with me that economic factors caused the price of gas to drop from $4/gal to $2/gal in a year and that it was not because of Bush's policies?

why do you say it was "artifically" increased? What "artificial" factors caused it to increase, in your view?

No idea even what you are talking about. Though I shouldn't think the cost to produce gas would be affected by non-oil alternatives, if that is what you are talking about. Why would that affect the cost of production of gas?

I doubt it has much effect at all. Supply and demand are much bigger drivers. US production is only a marginal part of world production and demand.

I don't know.

It can affect the actual or percieved supply.

At this time I don't think it should be taxed much or at all. When it was $2/gal in the 1990s and earlier 2000s it should have been taxed a $1/gal or more. That would have incentivized more efficiency and alternative production so we wouldn't have been caught with our pants down -- again -- in the last price spike.

Sure. I'm still wondering what relevance this has to what we were discussing.

 

I don't hold myself out to be an expert on oil prices, but a combination of softening demand expectations as well as increases in production in the US and elsewhere and maybe less concern that Iran is going to blow up any minute.

 

Anything to back that up? Or just speculation on your part?

 

Stuff I've read and heard. What difference does it make?

 

I have seen a lot of $4-$5 per gallon gasoline in California. That was as recently as last month in fact.

It sounds as though you think that dropping oil prices is a great thing. Unfortunately, it is happening because of a weakening global economic outlook. Oil is dropping because factory activity in China is slowing, the Eurozone is disintegrating, housing data/unemployment numbers/sales reports etc. in the US are disappointing and so on. There is a real fear that the demand for oil is going to really wain worldwide, and that is not a good thing.

OIL FUTURES: Crude Falls on Renewed EU Worries

 

Odd. Many of our conservative "expedrts" claimed it was Obama's policies that were causing prices to go up just a couple months ago.

 

Nothing odd at all, unless you either don't actually follow current events or simply can't understand them.

I certainly can't speak for the "experts" you are referring to, but just a couple of months ago nobody was expecting Greece was going to start threatening to leave the Eurozone. Experts around the world were taken by surprise by the latest global developments.

 

Great points. All those who were blaming Obama for higher gas prices a couple months ago obviously don't actually follow current events or simply can't understand them.

 

The price of gas was higher a couple of months ago.

Bush was blamed for high gas prices. The liberals claimed he was pushing up the price of gas to help out his buddies in the oil industry.

Since Obama took so much money in campaign contributions from the oil industry, isn't it fair to suggest that he has pushed up the price of oil to help out his buddies in the oil industry? I'm not saying he did myself, I'm simply attempting to speculate as to why these people you are referring to might have made the assertions they made.

At any rate. Do you think that the lower oil prices are a good thing? If so can you explain why?

 

Sure. They reduce the cost of of production of goods and services and increase income available for other expenditures on other things.

 

The whole situation shows fragile the overall economy of the world is. Although lower oil does indeed help in many ways, it clearly isn't helping enough at the moment to offset the factors that are causing its price to drop.

 

IMO the rapid and dramatic price variations in the world market cause more harm to the economy than a marginally higher stable price would.

 

Which policies and experts?

 

Not exclusively. I believe the speculation market anticipated a reduction in global supply chain restriction, as the world public began to realize that Iraq - and the ME in general - wasstabilizing post-invasion. I believe that had much to do with it, along with the new discoveries of untapped oil reserves at the time.

I have listed them. I'll add another one: ethanol production actually consumes more energy per gallon to produce than it creates.

That's not what I'm talking about - though you can see from the link above that you're not correct on that assertion either.

A boutique fuel is gas mixed with additives - and there are a ton of different 'recipes' for different parts of the country, and for different times of year. These are mandated by Government, and cause massive supply throttling as refineries and distribution hubs have to revamp regularly to accomodate these stupid EPA mandates that do little and cost much.

Except that the speculation market is based in the US, and is largely predicated on US assets. It has a substantial effect - just as there is speculation that the larger Romney's polling lead gets, the better the stock market will do. Same principle.

Fortunately for you, I do. The US Government controls over 70% of all drillable oil land.

And - in a neat corralling of your earlier assertion - in 2008, when President Bush lifted the executive drilling moratorium that applied to most of the Outer Continental Shelf, the price of oil immediately dropped more than $9 per barrel.

So - apparently - what the POTUS says and does IS a substantial factor.

Absolutely - though it is spelled 'perceived'. And whether it is actual or perceived, the speculation market will react and magnify that perception in the price. Obama continuing his pet project in Afghanistan, and destabilizing Libya and Egypt have such an effect.

That's nuts. Government should not socially engineer, and screw with our economy so severely. High prices chill economies - don't you know that? Moreoever: our economy doesn't require Government interference through artificially increasing prices to promote "more efficiency and alternative production". Just WTF would be the point of damaging the economy only to help it, if not CONTROL, regardless?

Real alternatives have as their motivation market demand. More efficiency is likewise a market motivation. They come when they're viable; not before. We have been caught "with our pants down" because they've been pulled down - by the same people who claim that alternative energy is the answer. They've made the energy market very volatile with their social engineering stupidity.

Your inability to discern how discussing factors that lead to price volatility of gasoline when the topic is about the price of gasoline paints you in an unflattering light.

 

If that was the case, then why did prices climb back up as the world economy recovered? Iraq is no less stable and more oil is being produced in the US now than ever.

I missed it where you listed them. But doesn't ethanol reduce the demand for oil? Therefore that is a "natural" act under your definition.

A boutique fuel is gas mixed with additives - and there are a ton of different 'recipes' for different parts of the country, and for different times of year. These are mandated by Government, and cause massive supply throttling as refineries and distribution hubs have to revamp regularly to accomodate these stupid EPA mandates that do little and cost much. [/quote]

OK. I assume there is some point to all this?

What is the evidence for that? You're saying worldwide oil prices are driven by the US assets? I'd need to see the data supporting that to believe it.

Putting aside the credibility of an organization supported by the Koch family, so what?

So the fact I'm paying $.70/gal less at the pump is Obama's doing?

Thank you Obama.

PHP:

Absolutely - though it is spelled 'perceived'. And whether it is actual or perceived, the speculation market will react and magnify that perception in the price. Obama continuing his pet project in Afghanistan, and destabilizing Libya and Egypt have such an effect.

How did continuing Afghanistan destablize it, Lybia is now stable, thanks to the terrorist dictator having been removed with a cost less than 1/1000 that of Iraq, and what is Egypt's portion of global oil production?

If oil price had a direct effect on economies, Saudi Arbia would be the world's economic superpower.

It is the wild fluctions in oil prices that hurt the economy. Don't you know that? Rather than our economy being pummelled by huge gasoline spikes, only to be lulled into complaceny by periods of low cost gas only to be whacked again by a price spike, a better policy would be one where the price was stablized and the peaks smoothed out to hill by a policy that adds to the cost when it is cheaper and then reduces the cost when prices spike. People would by fewer gas guzzlers when the prices were low, but the economy would be better equipped and less vulnerable to price spikes.

That would be much better for the economies. But worse for Big Oil, which is why we have never seen it.

Real alternatives have as their motivation market demand. More efficiency is likewise a market motivation. They come when they're viable; not before. We have been caught "with our pants down" because they've been pulled down - by the same people who claim that alternative energy is the answer. They've made the energy market very volatile with their social engineering stupidity.



Your inability to discern how discussing factors that lead to price volatility of gasoline when the topic is about the price of gasoline paints you in an unflattering light.[/QUOTE]

 

Obama will rue the day he blocked the northern part of th Keystone XL pipeline.

 

If that was the case, then why did prices climb back up as the world economy recovered? Iraq is no less stable and more oil is being produced in the US now than ever.

I missed it where you listed them. But doesn't ethanol reduce the demand for oil? Therefore that is a "natural" act under your definition.

A boutique fuel is gas mixed with additives - and there are a ton of different 'recipes' for different parts of the country, and for different times of year. These are mandated by Government, and cause massive supply throttling as refineries and distribution hubs have to revamp regularly to accomodate these stupid EPA mandates that do little and cost much. [/quote]

OK. I assume there is some point to all this?

What is the evidence for that? You're saying worldwide oil prices are driven by the US assets? I'd need to see the data supporting that to believe it.

Putting aside the credibility of an organization supported by the Koch family, so what?

So the fact I'm paying $.70/gal less at the pump is Obama's doing?

Thank you Obama.

How did continuing Afghanistan destablize it, Lybia is now stable, thanks to the terrorist dictator having been removed with a cost less than 1/1000 that of Iraq, and what is Egypt's portion of global oil production?

If oil price had a direct effect on economies, Saudi Arbia would be the world's economic superpower.

It is the wild fluctions in oil prices that hurt the economy. Don't you know that? Rather than our economy being pummelled by huge gasoline spikes, only to be lulled into complaceny by periods of low cost gas only to be whacked again by a price spike, a better policy would be one where the price was stablized and the peaks smoothed out to hill by a policy that adds to the cost when it is cheaper and then reduces the cost when prices spike. People would by fewer gas guzzlers when the prices were low, but the economy would be better equipped and less vulnerable to price spikes.

That would be much better for the economies. But worse for Big Oil, which is why we have never seen it.

Market prices swing greatly. We have been caught with our pants down by periods of relatively low oil prices and lack of any coherent policy except to enrich big oil. Thus, instead of have efficient cars we drive guzzlers and waste fuel, and our economy takes a hit when prices spike up.

Thanks for sharing your opinion. I disagree with it and also your improper use of grammar. But factors relating to price volatility is directly related to the topic we've been discussing. And I'll withhold my opinion on how your posts present you out of respect for the rules.

 

Because the Republican Govenor of Kansas demanded it?

 

Gas is so high because of 1. inflation, which idiot lefties love so much, and 2. wall street speculation which idiot righties love so much.

(Obviously yes, the price of gasoline and oil are both much more complicated than those 2 reasons, but anyone that's followed recent history knows that those 2 things are enormous factors). I'd wager my own balls that without an inflationary currency and without wall street speculation, gas would be ...


...ohhhh wait. Nevermind. I forgot. It's also very high bevcause Big Oil is colluding with Big Government to make sure that (recently) before EVERY presidential election, gas prices plummet. Why? Because Big Oil and Big Government want you to think that gas prices are a Democrat-Republican partisan issue, rather than having you realize that in reality, Big Oil and Big Government are the causes of high gas prices.

Yet, you partisan retards will keep saying it's Bush's fault or Obana's fault yadda yadda yadda. Gas prices are low when recent new presidents come in, then get higher than hell shortly after then decrease again when another election comes around, of any party. Moron partisan hacks can't catch on to this.

Yeah, I'm gonna get a lot of dislikes on this post by retarded partisan hacks on both sides, but whatever.