Atheists Have a Suicide Problem

I'm an atheist and have had a couple of my atheist friends die by suicide. Your thoughts on this issue?

http://www.skepticink.com/dangeroustalk/2012/10/11/atheism-has-a-suicide-problem/

There is a problem within the atheist community of depression and suicide. I know we would all like to believe that atheists are happier people than religious believers and in many ways we are. But we also have to accept the reality that in some very important ways we are not. Ignorance really is bliss. People are happier when they have no idea what is going on. But when people do know what is going on, when they actually have a clearer picture of reality, they are in a better position to make themselves really happy. It is the difference between being high on drugs and being high on life. Or in this case high on Jesus vs. high on the vast wonders of the universe. Obviously, being high on life is the better kind of happiness......

 

I am not a hugely religious person so I don't mean this as an attack, but how do you know? What empirical evidence do you have at there is truly no god?

Many religious people I know have the meaning of life given to them through church, that of basically be a good person to fellow man. Yes I know there are extremists, but most churches will basically preach the Golden Rule.

People are then lead to a sense that being a good person is "the right thing to do".

Not that atheists aren't great people too, but having a "man in the sky" to be like a father figure, someone you want to be proud of you, I have seen often lead people to better decisions.

So maybe that's it, would you say many atheists feel they have no meaning to their life?


- edit - Also a close GF of mine is atheist and lost her father to suicide a few years ago. I have seen what it does to those left behind, horrible tragedies.

 

It's not a black and white, Atheist or Religion issue. My spiritual training began under the guidance of an Indian Chief. There was no religion about it at all. There was a whole lot of realizing and concentrating on our abilities and purpose as human beings. The closest comparison I've found is Buddhism.
Ignorance is certainly NOT bliss, and I believe that this is a lot of why Atheists would be likely to feel that life is pointless. Inner peace is not accessible nor attainable in world based reference. I won't prescribe anything to you. If you want suggestions, PM me.

 

Well said!

This is pretty much what I was trying to get at as well.

It's fun you say this, I didn't feel truly happy until I seriously began martial arts under an instructor who believes in spiritual guidance as well. The Asian cultures are fascinating and in many ways amazing for the soul. Wouldn't you agree?

 

Is this thread fishing for someone to come out and say something cruel, or what? Well, here goes... If you need constant reminders about how much better your beliefs are than others, then maybe killing yourself is actually doing the world a favor. No one likes an emo drag, doesn't seem to matter what is the religious belief, get over yourselves.

 

I'm really sorry. Actually I haven't heard of a suicide problem with Atheists...but I can imagine why it would be so. People who believe in God have hope that goes even beyond this life --knowing that God has a plan and future. Its the hopelessness that often carries over into suicide. Even though I believe in God....I struggle with bouts of depression. Sometimes I can put my mind where it needs to be (attitude adjustment). But there have been times that the depression was more biological then external...and anti-depressants were necessary. I am sorry about your friends.....suicide is such a waste and devastates the living.

 

Interesting post, I appreciate your honesty. I don't know the statistics regarding suicide comparisons between atheists and the religious. Catholicism views suicide as a sin against God. Not sure if that actually prevents anyone from this, but the tenet is there.

We all have to find our own meaning to life and all that it entails. Sometimes there is suffering and a person who lacks coping skills opts out of the pain for a permanent solution. One thing is for sure, people who commit suicide are in some type of pain, whether it be physical or emotional.

A relationship ends, a job loss...a major life event usually triggers the act.

You have to accept, that despite the commercialism which pushes happiness on people...
drink this soda and you'll be happy..
drive this car and you'll be happy...

Frequently there isn't all that much to be happy about...
find a way to work through it, is about all I can say...and seeking professional help is one way to do this.

I don't care if a person is atheist or religious, it's a tragic event when someone decides to take their life.
I find no solace as a religious, if indeed atheists are more statistically prone to suicide...
somehow "told you so" seems callous.

An atheist to me, is a potential religious. A work in progress...death of course ends the project and when it's brought upon by your own hand, it is all the more tragic.

A rather incoherent post here, but even if it's true that atheism holds a greater risk for suicide it is not something I wish upon anyone..and may the good Lord have mercy on them..for they know not what they do.

 

Totally off topic but it's ironic that you have Kurt Cobain quoted in your signature and post about suicide Not a slam at all and I'm a big fan of Nirvana myself.

I only know one side so I can't speak for being atheist, but my personal life's experiences have shown that true happiness comes from very deep within. Depression is an attack on that part of us and is crushing when it takes hold. I personally believe our inner peace, some may call it their soul, or whatever you choose to identify that very core of your being as....it must be satisfied with who you are and what you stand for, and it needs to remain positively unwavering to the best of our ability. I'm not putting it into words correctly I'm sure, but at our very central person we have to be true to ourselves and satisfied with what we see there within us. Whether that is reconciled with religion, spirituality, science or just life's experience, it just seems critical to know who we are and what we stand for, even if that makes it difficult to fit in or be a part of something bigger.

Self Reliance, written by Emerson, is an incredible essay that explains it so much better. It changed my life in high school and I've never forgotten it. I found my inner peace by finding who I am and guiding my life by what I believe.

http://www.emersoncentral.com/selfreliance.htm

Those who I know who took their lives in some way allowed life to interfere with their core rather than adjusting life to their core being. We have that control to change things around us, but often it feels the opposite and that's when the walls feel like they're coming in for many. Once they give in completely to it they succumb to it and find suicide as a way out.

I wish I had an answer or insight for it, but that's my experience.

 

I think if a lot of militant atheists focused on positive stuff, instead of how much 'they hate' religion, the Bible, Christianity, etc - then they'd be a lot less depressing and less likely to commit suicide.

That's one thing that some religious people do right - they at least have a positive outlook and mindset - militant atheists spend most of their time dwelling on all the things they 'hate' - and since many of them believe they're just an 'accident' that's no more special than any other animal, with no purpose or meaning, that doesn't give em much of a reason to live

 

If I didn't agree, I would be mistaken. I see little difference between an accomplished martial artist and a Yogi, except that each is predisposed differently. How better to illustrate that than to offer this:
http://eawc.evansville.edu/anthology/gita.htm
One of the most magnificent writings in the human archive!
There are similar lessons to be learned from warfare and from pacifism, in that we are in the world, but not of it. I can go for long periods sometimes, accepting "the world" as entirely metaphorical and illustrative of that which really matters. It's an easy stretch to believe that our capacity for contrivance exists only for the purpose of enforcing the discipline that is necessary for one to keep "the world" in proper perspective.
While I'm not well studied in the ways of Buddha, one of my favorite stories in all teachings is about his awakening. As an infant, his mother laid him in the grass while she went about some chore. As he lay there, he noticed that a fierce battle was taking place in the roots of the grass. Terrible looking little beasts were eating one another, and trying to keep from being devoured. Buddha realized that his perspective as the infant was correct, in that he was already "above the battle field".
As for atheists being depressed.... Depression is the abyss. In correct response, one should do as Paramahansa Yogananda was taught by his Yogi. That is to seek self realization with the same fervor that a man seeks water whose hair is on fire.
My teacher didn't provide "answers" so much as he gave me very clear suggestions as to why the pursuit is the most important thing a man can apply himself to. I read nearly 60,000 volumes of every manner of "wisdom" I could find. That tapered off as I came to realize that I had moved from the class room and into the field.
I still get depressed! Cancer is not a kind mistress. Gout can drive a man to wish for an end to the suffering. Obama and his minions are no help, either. But there is no doubt in my mind that there was a point where I asked God: "Who are You"? His response was unmistakable, and He only said "I AM". He did NOT say "I am easy...."

 

How exactly do atheists have a suicide problem based on a couple of personal accounts with zero statistical studies to back up their claims?

 

http://www.adherents.com/misc/religion_suicide.html

 

There could be some truth to this. I've dealt with suicidal thoughts off and on for the past five years, and sometimes I wish I could fall back on some ideology or religion that would offer comfort.

 

Great read, you sound like my sensei.

Domo

 

What's stopping you?
Faith is a process...as is losing faith.

Even if you decide an organized religion is not for you...you can seek spirituality in everyday life. You just have to look past the materialism which is so prevalent and which preaches "meaning and purpose can be bought."

What can be bought is distraction, but the wealthiest man on Earth still must face his or her own mortality...
Yes wealth can ease the suffering from financial struggle, but if one embraces the struggle...there is spirituality to be found.

If all you are is what you own...and all you own is taken away, you're the equivalent to nothing...if you embrace the precept that happiness can only be found in the pursuit of wealth, in the absence of wealth you not only have no worth, you have no self-worth. Seems a tenuous proposition to me to follow materialisms dead end.

The poorest of the poor...is not nothing to God.

You know, atheists like to consider themselves the rebellious sorts. They see folks walking into some Church as self-deluded sheep. Let me allow you in on a secret. The religious are often rebels ourselves...we reject the World of empiricism, that only what can be counted, counts. The smartest, most educated PhD in astro-physics can tell me...there is no God, I have mathematical proofs...proving beyond a shadow of a doubt..God is a figment of your imagination.

Excuse me Professor, I'm late for Mass.

The religious are rebels in their own right..they may be perceived as self delusional...they simply look past empiricism and towards the transcendents of the material.

 

I do not understand, people will believe theories as long as it is tagged to Science, even theories proved wrong. But God? cant be, we are sooo much smarter than that. What is so wrong with a theory about a Creator?

Science clearly states a parallel Universe is possible, so are other dimensions,,,but a Creator?,,,naaaaaa. I am not a Bible person per say, books are written by man. However I am open minded enough to know that I do not have the answers for everything, and either does anybody else. When somebody tells me they know there is no Creator, I think of what science calls a singularity...

It's their answer for,,,,,,we don't know...

I'll keep what comforts me, and I will not call it a singularity, I call it Faith.

 

Thanks for that, Herk.
I believe that it's important to understand that there is not just one "way and light". Consider that materialism is the realm of the ego. Ego has a viable function only in that it keeps us wary in the ways of the world. Ego is the "self", with a small "s".
The germ of (what is commonly referred to as) God is in each of us as well, and our desire to be self actualized in our spiritual Self (with a capital "S") is as deep in our instincts as the will of birds to fly South.
Feeling that this drive is being obstructed or denied certainly is depressing. It was in such thought that R.W. Emerson quoted from an author who preceded him: "On the brink of the waters of life and truth, we are miserably dying".
This depression is not uncommon. Some beliefs hold that one has to experience a "dark night of the soul" before one is motivated to pursue knowledge, much like an alcoholic has to hit bottom before he truly wants to recover.

 

I am an atheist who used to be a Born-Again Christian of the Southern Baptist variety. I am happy I deconverted but it wouldn’t surprise in the least if it was true that atheists had higher suicide rates for many reasons.

First, theists are more likely to belong to a supportive community like a church. That means when things get rough there are more people you can reach out to for help. Also, you have free counseling services right there for the taking from your minister/priest.

Second, I think it is easier for theists to have hope. Even false hope is hope. When life is falling apart around a religious person he can tell himself it is just God testing him and as long as he endures he will be rewarded in the long run for his faith. An atheist has to admit that sometimes life just sucks and there is no guarantee it will get better.

Third, I think it is easier for an atheist to commit suicide. Many religious people think it is a sin to commit suicide and others just aren’t sure. So the religious person committing suicide doesn’t know what is going to happen when he pulls that trigger. Will he go to heaven? Will he be punished for taking his own life? An atheist, on the other hand, realizes when he pulls that trigger he is just going to go into what amounts to a dreamless sleep sort of like before he was born. Not all that scary when you think about it.

Frankly, I would be surprised if atheists DIDN’T have higher suicide rates.

 

Well, the fact that some theories are eventually proven wrong is sort of the point. In order for something to rise to the level of "theory" in science it must be testable and falsifiable in addition to being able to make predictions. I have yet to see a proposed “theory” about a Creator that actually meets the requirements of being a theory. I am certainly open to such a theory. I can give you all sorts of examples of discoveries, if made, would have caused most scientists to renounce the evolutionary model or Big Bang model. Can you give me an example of a discovery if made would cause you to abandon the idea of a Creator? The problem is whatever discovery is made you can always say, “Well, the Creator just designed the universe in such a way that it appears that way.” For example, I might say “If the universe is only 10,000 years old, why can we see stars that are millions of light years away.” A Creationist can dismiss the question with “Will, God just created the universe so that the light from the stars was already in transit.” And then is you throw a malevolent entity like Satan into the mix then you can always blame undesired results on him trying to mislead people.

Magic has no place in science.

 

The same empirical evidence you have that says you are not being stalked by an invisible entity which can never be seen, heard, measured, or otherwise known. I'm not trying to be an ass but honestly the question isn't "prove that god doesn't exist" but rather "prove that god does exists." In the end there is no proof either way, and the only reason to believe god exists is because you are told that is true. You may as well believe in Santa. The only difference is that since Santa lives at the North Pole and delivers gifts/coal his existence can be disproven. Well that is until 2801 when Santa is invented but due to a programming error judges everyone as naughty but even then he lives on Neptune.



Seriously though the argument you presented annoys me to no end. When there is no evidence for X it's on those who say "X is real" to prove it is real not those who say that because there is no evidence it is false. You can't disprove the existence of something that doesn't exist.

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Honestly knowing that life is meaningless does bring up the point of why bother living. Honestly I can't answer that question. I have no kids or mate so I'm essentially just sucking up resources that could be used to better the species, but why even bother caring about that?

 

But the first person in recorded history (whoever that was), who came up with the concept of a God, wasn't 'told that' by anyone

That would be like saying, if a person believes that life may exist elsewhere in the universe, then "they may as well believe in Darth Vader"

That would be proving a negative, however you've failed to prove that 'it doesn't exist' to begin with

People don't "know" that life is meaningless, they only believe so because they've been told it enough (or told themselves enough)

If life though is "meaningless", then it just as well is 'meaningful', by the very definition of 'meaningless'

Misanthropy does tend to be a turn off to women, if you weren't such a misanthrope then maybe you wouldn't believe yourself so meaningless (and seem that way to potential mates)

I'm living for a greater purpose and mission while you're 'sucking up resources' - by the definition of 'meaningless', both are equally true - so why pick that which is worse? The only reason people pretend to believe that 'life is meaningless' is so they can feel better about being mediocre - I can guarantee you that no one who ever actually did anything meaningful in their life (be it Bill Gates, MLK, etc) thought it was 'meaningless'

 

Perhaps people prone to suicide are also prone to being atheists, at least at some point in their lives? I've had my lows, though funnily enough they were in my Christian, i.e. younger years.

Don't be an atheist to find happiness.. Don't be anything unless it's what you truly think and feel is right. Be honest with yourself and find yourself. Then maybe you'll find a measure of peace and happiness, no matter which religious label would best describe you at that point.

 

That's kind of contradictory

 

Use the black guide book and test what it tells you do. If it works consistently, then there is a god. If it doesn't work, or only works once in a great while, there is no god.

Try this one. Ask for something simple, a ink pen from Hyatt Hotel. A piglet from farmer johns field.

King James Bible
And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.