You older conservatives have no idea how hard it is to apply for a job these days

Please try to read the whole thing before blowing up at me - you'll see I'm kinda on your side on this issue.

A lot of you older guys grew up in a better time when it comes to employment. You saw a "help wanted" ad in the paper or company letterhead. You put together a good resume and either mailed it to the company. You wait, maybe called the hiring manager directly. The hiring manager goes through the resume and if he liked your resume you got an interview, may a second one, and then were hired if you did a good job.

The politics and culture of employment has changed for the worse, though. Today, with most jobs, it is beyond insane the hoops you have to jump through just to get your resume on the person's desk. Even before you get your interview wrapped up, you have to do an online application, followed by dozens (if not hundreds) of these idiotic, pointless questions which are basically there to weed out those who were willing to do it and not.

The, you upload your resume - your resume is then COMPUTER SCANNED for "buzzwords" - if enough of these buzz words show up, they are eliminated from even getting to the boss' desk. They don't want repetitive buzzwords because they feel it is indicative of a bland employee.

Then, you wait - and wait you shall for about three weeks. You'll send emails, call into the boss, leave voice messages - all in hopes of just landing that one interview. And if you are lucky enough to get the interview, you are then herded into a room with an over-worked pre-hire interview process. Made to answer questions which are apparently designed to weed you out even further before the main boss even takes a look at you.

I've heard of stories of 7 interviews for a $40,000 job. And then there are references - I'm not talking 2 or 3. Try 10 - yeah, I'm not kidding you. There are jobs which require this type of vetting for will amount to $12/hr.

It takes easily 5 hours of application, resume, follow up, and interview time PER JOB - I hope you some of you older guys who call my generation (under 35) lazy and unmotivated consider that times have changed and the blame is not all on us. The system sucks, there are middle level jobs any more, and the older baby boomers are not retiring because they can't afford to.

I have a decent job and am grateful for it - but when I look at the market place as a whole it is abysmal - and the application process for these jobs has not made anything easier.

What happened to simply just submitting a resume and having the HR people base your credentials on that ?! All that mountain of extra paper work, info entry, and exam entries just to get an interview. It's disheartening - especially for those who are unemployed - spending hundreds of hours on just a handful of jobs is a waste of time and inefficient.

Don't believe me ? Check out this link to a blog about the horror stories of modern job applications - it is beyond messed up !

http://www.city-data.com/forum/work-employment/1090441-tired-jumping-through-hoops.html

 

I'm disabled and never expected to work for someone I had to work as a self-employed person or not work. I'll say this there is always some way to earn money if your able bodied, passingly intelligent and you try.

 

No, don't use the resume only approach! The filtering system is broken. Not even the professionals can get past the screening process these days.

Sure, you can send in a resume, but that's not the end of the process.

What's stopping you from going there in person and scoping the place out? Show them you're interested in working there and, even if you can't show them the world, initiative counts for something and you'll also be on their minds during the hiring process.

Reply in a timely manner, and don't check out old ads. Your window of opportunity had probably closed. If you have to wait weeks for a reply they either already have someone picked out. Or, they don't need you until a specific time of the year. Wait for their next job wanted classified to verify if they're still looking for help.

 

HR people are so busy with emails and hundreds upon hundreds of resumes that they rarely interview anyone or actually hire.. Its just massive busy work. I saw it happening in 2000.

 

Hmm, I worked for 25 years, 24/7, always had a job waiting when I finished one, always had top wages and benefits, had to take a few tests, fill in some security forms, so I really can't relate to any hardships as a proud retired Union member.

I guess it must be a nonunion problem huh? Don't they still have those expensive employment agencies to locate you a job, and a lawyer to negotiate you a wage and benefits with a firm? They used to have them.

There is always outsourcing yourself to a foreign country. The lines are probably shorter?

 

My son graduated from UT Austen 4 years ago with a BS in Comp Sci. He was un-employed for about 60 hours after graduation. About a month ago he got fed up with that job and quit so he could spend more time looking for a new one. He just got hired with an 80% (!!!) pay raise, still with just a bachelors. My brother-in-law has an Associates in CAD/CAM from a community college and routinely makes more than 100K/yr, though it is cyclical and he puts in long hours. I routinely deal with people in the Non-destructive testing field who make more money than I do with just a HS diploma. If the right things are on your resume, the right people will see it.

 

It's the result of all these years of "progressive" everything. Our economy is dysfunctional, our society is dysfunctional, and our government is dysfunctional.

All of the hoops you are having to jump thru are there b/c of your progressive views and the damage they've done to our society. It is so expensive for businesses to simply operate on a daily basis, that there isn't much room for expansion. The costs associated with hiring someone are insane.

Look at the information board at any business - all of the required legal postings take up an entire wall. Discrimination posting, drug free workplace posting, minimum wage posting, fair hiring posting, workers comp posting, on and on... at my work, all those legal postings literally take up an entire wall.

Throw on top of those costs the inane requirements of receiving unemployment. In my state, you are required to apply for 4 jobs per week. That necessitates that you apply for jobs you have no interest in, or are completely unqualified for. HR departments are under seige with all that nonsense. I might be the best candidate for a job, but my resume and application is buried in a mass of dozens, if not hundreds of useless submissions.

All of this mess is the result of government mandates, threats of lawsuits, diminishing opportunity, etc.

And the bad news is that it will never improve. We have passed the tipping point - we are now living in an era of big government, massive debt, and political correctness run amok. It's sad - but it is the doing of you liberals.

 

Yes channe and you get to do it all without ever leaving the comfort of your home. Everything to day is on line. Even flipping jobs in which you have as much chance of ever seeing a computer as you do of walking to the moon. The last time I tried pounding the payment while hunting for a job almost every door I walked up to had a sign on the door that said apply on line at www.whatever. If you work in the skilled trades don't even bother trying to apply directly center your search on places like standby personel or Manpower or other temp agencies. Most HR staffs now have all they can do to keep up with the ever more cumbersome rules and regulations that the people they have on hand fall under without trying to figure out all the hoops and hurdles involved on their side of the interview process so they basically have outsourced that function.

 

And therein lies the problem with liberals.

 

I am 63 and the thing is your premise is BS

 

As a young man, I can agree it is all bull(*)(*)(*)(*).

I have had 6 jobs in 2 years, mainly contract and seasonal. It's the norm that I accept. I am trying to build up some CS be more long-term employable, but I'm enjoying the traveling, moving, no-loyalty jobs to companies so much that I might continue to do it.

But it is ridiculous to get a job. Not even worth it, when your chance of getting hired is .00000001% and it takes 5 hours to fill out an app.

That being said, there are better ways to find jobs.

 

As I understand the premise of the original post, an insinuation is being made that "older" conservatives are out of touch with the more modern hiring practices today's youth must navigate.

Rather than a lengthy expose' breaking down your premise and arguing each point...I'll provide an anecdote.

I'm 49 years old, and I'm not sure if that qualifies to be regarded as one of these "older" conservatives you reference.

In 1984, as a sophomore, I applied for a 2- year ROTC scholarship to assist with tuition payments while attending college. Below, I'm listing the paperwork I had to navigate through to complete the process of applying for and activating the scholarship.

AFROTC Form 20
AFROTC Form 500
AFROTC Form 35
DD Form 93
AF Form 883
DD Form 2005
AF Form 2030
AFROTC Form 48
AF Form 3010
Statement of Understanding
Address Information Sheet
Release of Student Records
Mandatory Medical Forms

In addition to these forms, I also needed to provide copies of the following:

Notarized birth certificate
Social Security card
Selective Service number
Air Force ROTC Form 310 - Jr. ROTC certificate of completion
Air Force Form 1256 - Certificate of training
College transcripts
High School transcripts

Granted, none of this was for a job application, and I can provide another anecdotal experience in applying for the USAF Reserves, a process entailing an equal amount of paperwork and forms to navigate....I'm guessing the forum readers would be bored however.

So to sum up...
yes you young whipper snappers today have it tough, much tougher than what I had to go through. (sarcasm)

 

what exactly is the problem?? he said that he worked for himself

 

I was applying for work during the Carter years, it was a horrible time but we got through it and your generation will too

 

I was laid off in July 2001. In Sept, the bottom fell out of the job market. You shouldve tried finding a job then. I ended with a dispatchers job for $8/hr. Two yrs later, I was at $12 hr plus bonuses.

Every age has its challenges. Apply for something totally unrelated to what you usually do. Sometimes its just what you need to get your career rolling in the direction you wanna go.

 

The part I bolded... "you try". I wasn't talking about him. I was insinuating liberals don't try... they have an entitlement mentality and expect handouts.

 

it was that way back in the 60s too...

 

Yes, the Carter years were no piece of cake. Stagflation and industrial collapse under a tidal wave of regulations and litigation.

These days I'm often of the other side of the line of scrimmage - hiring skilled people.

The resume process is brutal because of all the wildly inflated resumes we see. If some of these resumes were true, the guy would have to be 120 years old. References are useless, because 1) often the old employer is out of business or 2) if an old employer gave you any information beyond "Yeah he worked here form date one to date two." he would be subject to a lawsuit. The first interview is more often than not a BS detection process. You have to hire somebody and sometimes outright lies slip by the best of review processes.

Do yourself a favor - get your visible tats removed. They scream "prison" to most hiring agents.

Don't ask 50% more than the job is worth up front. No, electricians do not rate $50/hr.

Be willing to relocate and work shift work.

 

I think it probably is more difficult. One reason may be that businesses are very cautious in expanding, due in good part to political uncertainty, and their perception that the current administration is anti-business.

 

just checkin

 

I believe everything that you have just said. I have 'just' gone through it and it is unfortunate because these companies are missing some of the best and the brightest with some of these hard core tactics to find the right fit. It is a joke.

 

one thing i notice that is much different know is that people only look at craigslist for jobs..and those listing will draw alot of people..i used to just go to businesses and apply..might take a 100 or so times but it worked for me

 

i don't like my current job but i'm making like $20/hr so it's hard to walk away from - i just wish the process of getting the first interview was better and easier. why can't i just send my resume and get an interview and then IF i get the job i will fill out all the applications they are desiring ?

 

because when 100s apply they want to sort it down in numbers maybe just 10 for each job..so the more they know early will help them reach that number

 

You're describing the job search in the bloated white collar industry. There are PLENTY of good-paying blue collar jobs readily available that Americans simply are not going after. Why? Because they've been conditioned by academia and their allies in the government to spend money on academia instead of getting work experience.

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