A new Florida law made gun-carry permits optional. A dramatic drop in safety classes followed

This was to be expected. If there is no requirement for a CCW, then why would people get one, and sure enough, there has been a massive drop in classes which educate people about gun safety and legal aspects. I think there will be a drastic increase in easily preventable mistakes by law abiding gun owners, which will put the owner in prison, and someone else in an early grave, and it looks like its already happening. First time gun owners with no prior experience with firearms SHOULD get the training whether or not its required by law.

A new Florida law made gun-carry permits optional. A dramatic drop in safety classes followed
https://www.sun-sentinel.com/2023/1...l-a-dramatic-drop-in-safety-classes-followed/
Floridians no longer need a permit to carry a concealed firearm, and gun owners are overwhelmingly opting out of the safety and educational training once required for a license.

Firearms instructors are seeing a dramatic drop in student sign-ups for such courses, which teach safety and explain the state’s laws about where and how gun owners can lawfully carry pistols and legally use them in self-defense.

As more people forgo basic safety and legal training, instructors say they’re concerned about the safety of communities — and the impacts to their businesses.

After the new state law went into effect, the number of people who applied for concealed carry permits — which are now optional and include hours-long classes on safety and legal issues – dropped by about 64% over the same three-month period a year ago. There are about 2.5 million people in Florida with concealed carry permits, according to state figures.

Brian Doyle, 56, is president of Direct Hit Firearms Training in Pompano Beach, and he also is worried about guns in the hands of untrained users.

“I’m disheartened that people don’t want to be educated — and that’s what the state is telling them: that they don’t need to be educated to carry a firearm,” Doyle said.

Having a permit can help even if someone breaks the law: If someone is found carrying a firearm within 1,000 feet of a school, having a concealed carry permit could bump a felony charge down to a misdemeanor.

“This law is almost a trick. It makes people think there’s no reason to get a permit,” said Christian Perez, 29, head instructor for Florida Defensive Training with locations around South Florida.

 

Continued from article:
"Doyle regularly teaches students with court orders from the Broward County State Attorney’s Office to take his class in exchange for reduced firearm negligence charges. Most of these students mistakenly carry their weapons into the airport.

“I’m a Second Amendment guy — I get it,” Doyle said. “But if you’re one of my clients and you come back to me with a court order because you broke the law, I’m not going to be happy.”

His classes are designed to understand Florida law: what, where, when, and how to carry concealed. And like many instructors, he’s seen a dip in attendance. Before the law changed, Doyle used to teach weekly classes of a dozen students. Now he teaches about six students every other week.

“We see a lot of people who say, ‘I’ve been around guns all my life,’ but then they realize how much they don’t know,” he said.

 

So, what is the logic here... classes are no longer mandatory, and folks aren't taking the classes... ergo? So, you are saying what? Did you expect that folks would still spend the money on the classes? Really?

 

When I said "this was to be expected", I meant I did not expect them to take them. How did you not get it?

Responsible people will still take the classes, but it seems they are in the minority.

 

Hmm... ergo what? If you tell folks they don't have to take the class, but you still expected them to, what's the point you are trying to make other than, folks aren't taking the classes, which you expected as the outcome? That seems circular at best. So, who cares? Obviously, you're trying to bait us into what your real intent is here, so why not just get to it....

 

Since you have nothing to share I guess you can just move on. Have a nice day.

My intent was to discuss the topic, and clearly that is not your intent, hence you can move on.

 

Just means the unsafe Americans are more unsafe.

 

In what way? I learned more from traditional instruction than I ever did from a weapons expert. Given that I spent a long time around jobs/roles that required use of weapons, I believe I have a pretty good grasp on what safety means regarding weapons and usage/misuse, etc. The question then, should I have to spend money to make my usage of a weapon somehow more safe? I find that unlikely.

 

Yes, the unsafe will be more unsafe, but not everyone is unsafe. Like I said in the OP the first time gun owners with no prior experience with firearms should get the training whether or not its required by law. Lot of people are already comfortable with firearms, because they were trained by their parents, or the military, etc, but many were never trained or instructed by anyone, and they are prone to costly mistakes no matter now "nice" or well meaning they might be. And its not just about safe handling of the firearm, but knowing the law, - when and were you can carry, what kind of firearm use can get you in legal trouble, what to avoid, etc

 

I believe anyone who carries a gun should have training. I have over 160 hours of formal training and I have spent several hundred hours teaching people and several thousand hours competing in shooting events that are highly relevant to defensive shooting. That being said, I support the right of people to keep and bear arms without mandatory training though it's stupid for anyone who carries not to train

 

not really the case. what is amusing is watching those who oppose lawful firearms ownership complaining about unsafe owners when they oppose all ownership

 

I was one of the very first people in Ohio to get a CCW even though my job made me immune from state prosecution if I carried concealed (though in some situations I would have been reprimanded by my superiors at DOJ). I continue to renew that license because there are several benefits to the license including out of state carry and making it easier to buy from both FFLs and diligent private citizens. If someone has a valid CCW you are pretty well guaranteed that you aren't selling to a felon or other prohibited person

 

I guess there are those who are cool with unsafe gun owners. Most gunowners are not cool with those who don't know how to handle their firearms because they can be dangerous. People get thrown out of gun ranges all the time, because they don't know how to handle their guns.

Those are some benefits, and there are more, as stated in the OP

You don't need a license to buy from a private seller

Sure, if they show it to you.

 

YOU MISSED MY POINT There are a few people who want mandatory training who aren't gun banners. But gun banners don't want anyone carrying guns

 

Well, this thread has nothing to do with gun bans.

 

The course costs money. Make it free and you'll see more people taking it.

 

There is no "baiting," going on. The real question, is how anyone could miss the point, so clearly staring them in the face? That point, is that many, so called "responsible gun owners," will only take safety classes, if they are required, and so, if it is believed that these classes minimize gun accidents-- which apparently was the thinking behind requiring them, in the first place-- they should remain a requirement!

 

The anti-gunners have millions in their coffers. They could easily fund firearms safety classes at no cost to the students. But, we all know that'll never happen.

 

Yes. That’s why the guys who taught the classes are moaning. They can’t make a couple grand on Saturday at their side gig anymore.

 

LOL! It is other people's responsibility to pay for gun owners' safety classes! And, as you have previously said, it's also those who are concerned about gun safety, and guns falling into the wrong hands, who should pay for gun safes, for gun owners. No responsibility for the safety to the community, for the weapons which they choose to own, should fall upon those actual owners?... I guess we should pay for your liability insurance, as well.

Here, we now see what is really meant, by the phrase, "responsible gun owners."


Actually, to be more accurate, I should specify that not all "responsible gun owners," feel such an utter lack of responsibility, for their choice, as do you, Kelso. Unfortunately, however, I don't think you are a rarity, either.

 

sure they do-gun banners want to impose incremental obstacles to owning guns. Mandatory training to own a gun being one of them. And before you use your normal argument-that being if we oppose mandatory training then that means we want untrained people packing heat-don't. It's the same nonsense that claims those of us who reject mandatory psych exams to own a gun want whack jobs running around with machine guns.

 

Ok. I don't know which post you are referring to, so I'll just move on.

If you know the roof is leaking, and not only do you refuse to fix it, but stand in the way of others fixing it, the it will make you look like you want it to leak. Deny it all you want, but that's how it comes across. Training WOULD save lives, including of those of honest but ignorant gun owners.

Its not about the cost. Most people won't bother even if it was free.

Sometimes people who are socialist at heart don't even realize they are socialists.

Yes, even NRA promotes responsible gun ownership, but not everyone is on board with that idea. People like Turtledude claim they are for it, but will fight to tooth and nail to prevent it from becoming reality

 

I just saw this as front page news on Google about 24 hours ago. It didn't take it very long to make it here.

Anyone that owns a gun doesn't need to pay some fat guy x number of dollars to sit in a class for 4 hours to explain to them when it is and is not acceptable to shoot in self-defense.

Heaven forbid that people should be able to exercise a constitutional right without jumping through all kinds of hoops.

And if what the op is speculating should come to pass, then it should be easy to demonstrate that in cases from other states that have already dropped these requirements years ago.

 

SunSentinel is a local South Florida paper. Maybe it made it to Google News from there.

Yes, like having to register to vote. The horror.....

 

I have proposed here that basic gun safety should be taught in the public school system and several of the liberals around here, balked at the idea.

Really makes one question their true motives