Alan Sabrosky, US Marine Corps veteran says Israel did 911

Does he explain the logic behind that, because nobody else promoting the idea of explosives being involved have done so?

If it was some kind of manufactured conspiracy, regardless of who arranged it, they would be creating the impression of terrorists flying aircraft in to the buildings. Why would they bother bringing explosives in to the mix too, adding significant complexity and risk to the whole plan for no obvious motivation (after all, you're stating there is obvious evidence of explosives)? If the aim was just to trigger the anti-Muslim sentiment in the US, the buildings didn't need to actually fall (arguably, gutted buildings that remained standing could have even been more impactful) and if they had some reason for wanting or needing the buildings destroyed, they could have ensured they were deemed irreparable afterwards (with a good chance this would be true anyway) or simply manufacture a terrorist attack using explosives rather than planes in the first place.

These conspiracy theories always seem to be like this, pulling together lots of disparate claims, speculation and assumption to create a mess of general suspicion and confusion on which to hang a preferred bogyman. There never seems to be any kind of clear idea detailing the whos, hows and whys of the whole thing.

 

How is that an answer? How very bizarre! Try again, this time with an answer to the post:

Who benefits? Those who sought to undermine the US by deeply wounding terrorism.
Who had the means? Al Qaeda. They were experienced enough to enough to know how to hijack aircraft and experienced enough, through rudimentary training, to crash them into great big targets.

What else was required? Not a great deal! It's only when you expand this idiotic conspiracy up to include all the add-ons suggested, it becomes an utterly ridiculously complicated venture. All it really boils down to is 4 hijacked planes that were crashed.

 

This. It works for all variations of these daft conspiracies. How terrible would it look to have these disfigured buildings sitting in plain view?

If it was that easy to rig the buildings with invisible hushabooms and a massive team of psychopathic demolition experts, what would stop them sticking a ton of explosives in the basement?

 

I was very busy, yesterday, and that's why I couldn't fully respond.

I wrote that there are 2 ways to help determine who was responsible who was responsible for 9/11:
- Cui Bono
- Means, motive and opportunity
Israel, its lobbies, "Israel Firsters" and other Zionist Quislings within the US Government were the only ones who stood to benefit and had the means, motive and opportunity to pull off something as complex as 9/11. It was simply impossible for bin Laden & his cave dwellers to pull off alone

9/11 was just another in a series of "False Flag" Ops run by Israel's right wing element and the Lavon Affair was one of the early ones.
We can learn a lot about 9/11 by simply looking at the Lavon Affaire. When the Israel was caught, the first response from Israel's apologists and Useful idiots was the same as usual:
Howl "ANTI SEMITES!" and "It's just another anti Semitic conspiracy theory" until the evidence was irrefutable and the betrayal suddenly ceased to be news anymore.

Another Israeli False Flag was Israel's deliberate attack on the USS Liberty in which 34 American G.Is were murdered and America's most costly intelligence gathering ship was destroyed.
The fact that IDF used unmarked planes for the initial attack is proof of their intention to deceive America, blame Egypt for the attack and get the US to attack Egypt in the '67 War.

Al Qaeda, which means "little toilet" is not a single entity. It's sort of a catch all phrase for the many militant Islamic groups in the region. There's simply no way that they could have infiltrated the US Government and its innumerable security agencies without Israel's aid.

What the Lavon Affair, the USS Liberty attack and 9/11 all have in common is Israel's willingness to kill Americans to engender anti Islamic sentiment and get America to fight its wars.
The answer to your question: "Who benefits", is obvious.

Thanks,

 

I've worked in US Defense, in and out of uniform, for decades.

In that time I have seen Israel help America a lot:
- Not competing against F-16's in with their KFIR fighter in the international marketplace
- Giving us their "ARROW" missile guidance system which allowed us to upgrade our "proximity" Patriot Air Defense System to its current "Patriot PAC-3" precision Air Defense System
- Delivered on-time and in-budget the STPT (Stinger Troop Proficiency Trainer).. a Stinger Missile simulation training device (I had the opportunity to live in Israel working on this.. great people... wonderful country)
- Many. if not MOST of the individual components found in US defense electronics from radios to computers and more... are made in Israel... fairly priced and reliable)
- They gave us their IRON DOME technology (we gave them ammunition for their systems)... we now use the system throughout our military under the name C-RAM (Counter Rocket, Artillery Mortar)

 

You seem to be having trouble reading my post.

It was YOUR question I answered! And my response was the TOTALLY OBVIOUS version! I want a response to MY version.
Your version is utterly ludicrous, convoluted and ignores fundamental issues.

You make this absurd statement:

Hijack four planes and crash them! How the hell is that complex!?

Bullshit and playing this ridiculous "cave dweller" card. Get 4 people to be able to control a hijacked passenger plane and crash it.

Who are you referring to here?

It means Base. Like any language, a phrase or word in context, can change its meaning.

Irrelevant.

What the hell? Why would they need to "infiltrate" anything!?

1. How does Israel need to get involved to hijack a plane and crash it?
2. You ignored my post #23 - it has numerous replies to false claims you have made - kindly reply to it.

 

I'm sorry that today is a busy day too but I like to respond to all civil and substantive comments like yours.

First, I did not mean you as one of: "Israel's apologists and Useful idiots" and in no way meant to slander you because I fully believe that people can have different opinions and still discuss them with civility and mutual respect.

My perspective of America's Middle East involvement is, I suspect, very different than yours because I remember when Israel attacked the USS Liberty and have been following events in the region ever since.
The reason I focus on Middle East dynamics and spent 10 - 11 months walking and hitch hiking around the Middle East is because I believe that is where a WW 3 is most likely to start and even more likely to occur as long as Israeli lobbies have so much influence over US Policy making.

The Iraq war proved that Israel's influential lobbies can drive the US into fighting its wars:

“QUIETLY LOBBYING CONGRESS TO APPROVE THE USE OF FORCE IN IRAQ WAS ONE OF AIPAC’S SUCCESSES OVER THE PAST YEAR.”
AIPAC Executive Director Howard Kohr; N.Y. Sun, Jan. 2003

As a Veteran of an earlier war, I've spent lots of time in our underfunded V.A. hospitals with mutilated, burned, traumatized and dismembered young G.I. who paid the real price for AIPAC's "quiet successes".

Regrettably, the "Chicken hawks" who were all supportive of that war are eager to send more Americans to die fighting Iran.

My reason for bringing up these previous False Flags and betrayals is to show the degree to which Israel's right wing (not "the Jews") has already infiltrated multiple US Security Agencies & NGOs.
In fact, officials from the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), the State Department, the FBI and the National Counterintelligence Directorate have been notified that:
“No other country close to the United States continues to cross the line on espionage like the Israelis do,” (1)

As you know, George Washington warned Americans about the dangers of prolonged foreign entanglements and America's one-sided entanglement with Israel's right wing is of the most dangerous and detrimental type.

As Netanyahu predicted, 9/11 has been very good for Israel's right wing:

- American troops are stationed in Israel to die for Israel after being put under Israeli command.
- Unfettered aid to Israel is well into the $ Trillions.
- Americans who can't find Iran on a map are eager to kill all the Iranians for resisting Israel's invasions of S. Lebanon.
- Most of all, 9/11 was more successful in supporting the "West vs East" culture warriors and feeding militant Islamophobes around the Western world than anything Israel's right wing could have done.


Finally, I see little point in haggling over the "nuts and bolts" of 9/11 because it could take forever.

My reasoning is that it seems that both sides of the debate has its team of expert engineers, airline pilots, demolition specialists and authorities on bombs, skyscrapers and fires so our discussion would just be a battle of the experts.

Thats why I chose to focus on Cui Bono and "Means, Motive and Opportunity", all of which point to the only country in the world to gain the most from 9/11 and its unparalleled history of spying. on the US and selling Americas secrets to hostile powers. (2)

For over 56 years, I've watched as Israel's right wing has betrayed, manipulated, spied on, extorted ("Sampson Option") and attacked America at home and abroad. With MSM pro Israel bias, Israel know that it could play a major role in 9/11 and still have its unquestioning supporters.

I will look into your Post # 23 but I have other Posts to respond to and am supposed to be admitted into the hospital today for cancer treatment. It might take a few days but I'll respond.

Thanks,


(1). "ISRAEL WON'T STOP SPYING ON THE US"
http://www.newsweek.com/2014/05/16/israel-wont-stop-spying-us-249757.html

EXCERPT "The Jewish state’s primary target: America’s industrial and technical secrets.

“No other country close to the United States continues to cross the line on espionage like the Israelis do,” said a former congressional staffer who attended another classified briefing in late 2013, one of several in recent months given by officials from the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), the State Department, the FBI and the National Counterintelligence Directorate.

The intelligence agencies didn’t go into specifics, the former aide said, but cited “industrial espionage—folks coming over here on trade missions or with Israeli companies working in collaboration with American companies, [or] intelligence operatives being run directly by the government, which I assume meant out of the [Israeli] Embassy.” CONTINUED


(2). "How Israel Has Betrayed America"
https://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2014/06/06/how-israel-has-betrayed-america/

EXCERPT "A recent report by Newsweek magazine that Israel has spied on the United States at “an alarming level” and has done so “more than any other ally does” raises a very serious issue concerning how much Israel has betrayed America, which is something that the American mainstream media have time and again refused to debate in public.

Another Israeli news site, Aretz Sheva, reports the U.S. is concerned the technology could ultimately find its way to Iran, which last year sought to buy military equipment from China for its nuclear program,” as reported by Bryant Jordan on December 24, 2013.

But this is not an isolated case, as “Israel has a long record of getting U.S. military technology to China." CONTINUED

 

The actual quote, which was a little distasteful but accurate:
""We are benefiting from one thing, and that is the attack on the Twin Towers and Pentagon, and the American struggle in Iraq," Ma'ariv quoted the former prime minister as saying. He reportedly added that these events "swung American public opinion in our favor.""

I'm not interested in hearing you establishing Israel as a beneficiary. I showed quite clearly the motive for Al Qaeda and the opportunity to complete this non-complex action. At its base level this terrorist attack was straightforward. As soon as you involve an outside country or the US itself and incorporate all the myriad of claims it becomes a ludicrous undertaking right from conception to its completion, all in total secrecy.

Now I asked specifically what Israel needed to do to be involved in this and am awaiting a simple answer. It doesn't make any sense. Israel DID pass on intel about what they knew and of course, OF COURSE, they would directly benefit from the US siding against Al Qaeda - which is a firm motive to actually pass on the intel. If you want to distort Netanyahu's meaning, how the hell does it benefit Israel if the US work out they actually did this!? Or seriously, do you think only the skeptic-public are able to "join the dots"? And what crazy directive from operational control allows "dancing and celebration" - a ridiculous thing to do to draw attention.

That's another question, where is the source for the "dancing" bit?

 

Please name the unit of American troops that are stationed in Iraq? From time to time we send Special Ops guys there to train and be trained... maybe a dozen at a time or so. We have no troops stationed in Israel permanently... except for Embassy/consulate guards. Your post would suggest that we have combat units stationed in Israel and that is simply not true.

Israel cannot drive us into wars... what a silly statement.

VA funding has nothing to do with Israel. Apples and space shuttles.

Please identify the names of anyone proposing we send troops to fight Iran. No one is reporting that anywhere. Who is proposing that? Do you have a link?

("Unfettered aid"?) Israel has paid us back well for the aid we have given them:
- Not competing against F-16's in with their KFIR fighter in the international marketplace
- Giving us their "ARROW" missile guidance system which allowed us to upgrade our "proximity" Patriot Air Defense System to its current "Patriot PAC-3" precision Air Defense System
- Delivered on-time and in-budget the STPT (Stinger Troop Proficiency Trainer).. a Stinger Missile simulation training device (I had the opportunity to live in Israel working on this.. great people... wonderful country)
- Many. if not MOST of the individual components found in US defense electronics from radios to computers and more... are made in Israel... fairly priced and reliable)
- They gave us their IRON DOME technology (we gave them ammunition for their systems)... we now use the system throughout our military under the name C-RAM (Counter Rocket, Artillery Mortar)

Iran worries me a lot... but that has nothing to do with Israel. Iranian nukes scare the hell out of me.

 

You are asking for more and more information while ignoring salient information I have already provided showing Israel's established history of spying on, betraying, manipulating, exploiting and even attacking Americans.

It seems like we disagree, primarily on Israel's willingness to manipulate America into fighting another war for Israel via another False Flag Op.
And:
In spite of the evidence I've already provided,The Lavon Affaire, the USS Liberty attack, unrivaled spying on the US, sale of US secrets to China etc, you don't seem to believe that Israel would exploit the US and had no motive to participate in 9/11.

I already posted a quote from AIPAC showing their "quiet success" in getting the US to destroy Iraq, its enemy. Why should I dig up other facts for you to either ignore or dismiss as "conspiracy" stuff.

If you've made up your mind that Lavon, the Liberty and Israeli spying, theft and sale of US secrets to hostile powers etc are all "conspiracy stuff", there no point in presenting more facts.

The following article is long because it lives up to its title.
An excerpt I chose shows that only Israelis working at the Pentagon and the Towers got warnings.

“Israel did 9/11 - ALL THE PROOF IN THE WORLD”
https://shqiperia.yahoogroups.narkive.com/JSnZ4f8D/israel-did-9-11-all-the-proof-in-the-world

EXCERPT:

“Israeli Citizens Get Tipped Off”

“Israeli instant messaging company, Odigo, admitted that two of its employees received instant messages warning of an impeding attack 2 hours prior to the first plane hitting.

This warning was not passed on to authorities, which could have saved thousands of lives.


Odigo has a feature on its service that allows the passing on of messages

through a search feature based on nationality, such as Israeli. Knowing

these two particular Israelis were forewarned, it is very likely they

passed the message on to other Israelis considering that out of the 4000

Israelis believed to be in and around the WTC and the Pentagon only

FIVE died. 5/4000 Israelis. Mathematically (if Israelis were not

forewarned) about 10% (400/4000) would have died; even as low as

200-300/4000 would not really indicate foreknowledge. Yet only FIVE Israelis died and two of the five were actually aboard the supposedly hijacked flights; therefore only three

Israelis died at the WTC on 9/11. An astonishing feat. We're talking

about 'Israelis' here, not 'American Jews'. Many Jews died in the wtc

on 9/11.

Odigo has offices in New York, and in Herzliya, Israel. Herzliya happens to be the Head Quarters of Mossad. Do the math.” CONTINUED


Please let me know what you think.

Thanks,

 

No I am not! I'm asking for the same things I originally asked for which you still have not provided.

It's not salient at all. The attacks were 4 hijacked aircraft that were crashed. You just keep going on about isolated incidents a considerably long time ago that mean nothing pertaining to the attacks! How many more times, I don't care what "evidence" you wish to submit that you think "proves" something. At best it's circumstantial and at worst, which is the case, totally irrelevant.

1. How did Israel need to contribute to the 911 attack?
2. Where is your direct witness source for the "dancing" Israelis?
3. What did you mean by "infiltrate" the US government - how is that necessary?
4. How was hijacking and crashing 4 planes too "complex" for "cave dwellers"?

I actually don't care. I don't have any problem believing ANY country would exploit another for economic or political gain.

Islamic propaganda! This is just absurd. This document goes in to extensive detail on each and every one of these rubbish claims:
#2172 conspiracy theories2(DH) (adl.org)

To what end? Who are you trying to convince - me? Start with DIRECT evidence and involvement, detailed and justified. Try not to put things up that are 20 years old debunked hogwash. Answer the 4 questions.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, do you mean "Iraq" or "Israel" in the following sentence ?

I'll assume that you mean "Israel" so the US Troops stationed in Israel to die for Israel are part of the US Third Air Force:

"US Commander: ‘US Troops Prepared to Die for Israel’ in War against Syria, Hezbollah"
https://www.mintpressnews.com/israe...a-harbinger-of-war-on-syria-hezbollah/238768/

EXCERPT "In addition, Israel has been laying the groundwork for an invasion of Syria since last year and is largely responsible for the current conflict in Syria that has raged on for seven years. Israel’s current push to invade Syria is also based on flimsy evidence suggesting that Iran is establishing bases in Syria to target Israel."CONTINUED

"On the brink: Unpacking Israel’s unilateral strike threat against Iran"
https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-745470

EXCERPT "Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu repeated his threats against Iran on Sunday during a cabinet meeting held as part of a national war drill."CONTINUED

And:

"Netanyahu’s ‘War’ Comment Wasn’t an Accident"
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/a...etanyahu-s-iran-war-threat-wasn-t-an-accident

EXCERPT "The gathering of more 60 nations -- including Arab countries -- is, he said, an important step in pursuing their “common interest in advancing war with Iran."
This was the official English translation of the prime minister’s remark, published by the Government Press Office of Israel. An hour or so later, Netanyahu’s office removed the word "war" and watered down the comment to a "common interest in combating Iran." This change was explained as the correction of a translating error. It wasn't. Netanyahu plainly said “war”; and he meant war."CONTINUED

And:

"Does Iran Really Want to Nuke Israel? Is Israel Stronger Than Iran? A Top Security Expert Explains"
https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east...oes-iran-really-want-to-nuke-israel-1.6244003

EXCERPT "Netanyahu wants the United States to do the work for us.”
Meaning to attack Iran?
“Yes. And the same is true regarding Syria and the Palestinians.” CONTINUED

Re:

Neither you nor I have any Idea what Israel has received, stolen or been given because so much aid to Israel is secretly added to other Bills:

"The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: $3 Trillion"
https://www.wrmea.org/003-june/the-...israeli-palestinian-conflict-$3-trillion.html
By Thomas R. Stauffer
EXCERPT "Similarly, aid to Israel—and thus the regional total—also is understated, since much is outside of the foreign aid appropriation process or implicit in other programs. Support for Israel comes to $1.8 trillion, including special trade advantages, preferential contracts, or aid buried in other accounts. In addition to the financial outlay, U.S. aid to Israel costs some 275,000 American jobs each year."CONTINUED

On top of that, aid to Israel is prohibited by the Symington - Glen Amendment prohibiting aid to countries that do not sign the NPT:

"Lawsuit Claims Aid to Nuclear Israel Illegal Under Symington Glenn Amendments"
https://www.corporatecrimereporter....ael-illegal-under-symington-glenn-amendments/

EXCERPT "A lawsuit filed in federal court in Washington, D.C. claims that United States aid to Israel is illegal under a law passed in the 1970s that prohibits aid to nuclear powers that don’t sign the Nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Such aid violates longstanding bans on foreign aid to non-signatories to the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty (NPT) with nuclear weapons programs, the lawsuit alleges."CONTINUED

Naturally, Israel's influential lobbies have already found a way around US Law.

Re:

Everything you listed is eclipsed by the damage and loyal American lives lost resulting from what Israeli spy, Jonathan Pollard, stole from the US, gave to Israel which, in turn, sold it to the former USSR

Re:

I've been to Iran and the people would very much like to be like the West. A friend of mine, a General at the Pentagon, has worked with the Iranians for years and been stationed in Israel is more concerned with Israel's threats under its Sampson Option than anything that the Iranians might do.
Please remember that Iran has attacked no one in over 300 years while Israel has invaded Lebanon at least twice, repeatedly attacked it neighbors as well as America's USS Liberty.

Thanks,

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Those that fail to learn from history, are doomed to repeat it."
Winston Churchill


Re:

Is that your position, that history is not salient?

The fact that Israel's right wing has murdered American G.I.s, fire bombed American facilities in an early False Flag attempt, continues to steal America's top secrets and sell them to hostile states and brags about how gullible Americans are is, indeed, proof that Israel's right wingers had the means, motive and opportunity as well as a huge benefit of turning gullible Americans against the entire Islamic World.

Israel's innumerable betrayals of the US are as relevant today as they were when they occurred but you are determined to ignore the destructive nature of the one-sided US - Israel relationship and dismiss facts I've presented that you don't like as "Arab propaganda" or "debunked hogwash".

I have looked at your posts throughout this thread and seen you dismiss other facts you don't like as: "total conspiracy hogwash".

For example:

(From Post # 2)

Meanwhile, there were, indeed, Israelis taken into custody then and for weeks afterward.

"5 Israelis Detained for Puzzling Behavior' After WTC Tragedy"
https://www.haaretz.com/2001-09-17/...-tragedy/0000017f-db50-d3ff-a7ff-fbf0d7830000

EXCERPT " Five Israelis who had worked for a moving company based in New Jersey are being held in U.S. prisons for what the Federal Bureau of Investigation has described as "puzzling behavior" following the terror attack on the World Trade Center in New York last Tuesday. The five are expected to be deported" CONTINUED

You are clearly passionate in defending Israel's crimes and betrayals of the US but I don't see much sense in my continuing to produce facts related to this topic for you if you're going to reject those facts as: "total conspiracy hogwash", "Arab propaganda" or "irrelevant".

Do you see my point.

Thanks,

 

Wow, way to go with the non sequitur! I'm saying it's not salient because none of it is relevant to 911 events! YOUR observations are not salient. Producing incidents whereby a country has(in the past) been less than favorable are not indicative of current affairs. How far back do we go? Do we ostracize Germany and Japan!? Clearly both had the same "motive".

A ludicrous exaggeration and an arm-waved dismissal of Arab propaganda.

Funnily enough, they WERE conspiracy hogwash!

A rather pathetic example.

The dancing bit, celebrating at their "success" is the conspiracy hogwash.

Right, so yet again, YET AGAIN! you fail to show the "dancing" bit. They were HELD. It was all reported and they they were deported for legal reasons pertaining to their visas etc. Basically your entire account of this was false. The "puzzling behaviour" is the witness account of one person. People exhibit all sorts of odd behaviours in the face of extreme events.

What a crock - emphasis mine! You seem to post in any thread with a conspiracy against Israel and your rhetoric about "crimes and betrayal" is rather odd. I don't "defend" a damn thing, I debate nonsensical conspiracies - this being one of them. Insert any country, you'd get the same response. It is nothing to do with it being Israel.

I don't recall asking you to and if you want to excuse yourself from yet another jew-bashing thread, feel free. But maybe you could actually respond to simple request, like below?

Answer my questions and retry number 2!
1. How did Israel need to contribute to the 911 attack?
2. Where is your direct witness source for the "dancing" Israelis?
3. What did you mean by "infiltrate" the US government - how is that necessary?
4. How was hijacking and crashing 4 planes too "complex" for "cave dwellers"?

 

Did you know (probably not) or do you care (probably not) that the Comptroller at the Pentagon in the months before 911 was a US born, dual citizen ordained Rabbi named Dov Zakheim?

Do you know what AIPAC is? Are you aware of how many members of Congress are members of AIPAC. Do you know that the FARA, Foreign Asset Registration Act, is not enforced for members of AIPAC or any other Jewish organization

 

yes, and?

 

Likely you have not read the book Erasing The Liberty by Phillip Tourney. He was a sailor on the boat that day.

NOT in his book, but somewhere on the internet, sorry for no link, it's only scuttlebutt, maybe true, maybe not.

After the Liberty affair, rumor had it that some patriots in the US Navy had revenge against Israel for what they did. According to the story, Israel at the time was operating old diesel subs they had bought from somebody. USN knew where that sub was, and while it was submerged, destroyed it with depth charges. Ah, revenge can be sweet.

 

I'm going with "definitely not" as to whether anyone, who is looking at this sensibly, cares. How many were Christians? Does that mean they are all right-wing? How many are Islamic? Does that mean they are "in on it"? How many are half German/Japanese/Vietnamese etc. all with an axe to grind over past wars!

Did you know (probably not) or do you care (probably not) that a) your whole argument by association is crap and that the "missing trillions" weren't missing!? The US had a whole barrage of individual, segregated software packages that were not compatible with each other. Basically one accounting software didn't know about any other software.

THAT was the problem. It was all traceable, it was all accountable, just not in one easy to follow place. The work required to streamline it was the issue faced by Rumsfeld.
Fact Check: Rumsfeld did not reveal the loss of $2.3 trillion day before 9/11 | Reuters

The crowd went "oooooo"
AIPAC Election Role Raises Question of Foreign Agent Registration – North America - WRMEA

 

Yes, Imeant Israel. oops.. my secretary had the day off.

Oh, Air Force. We have Air Forces in Iceland, the Philippines' and all over the world. That's to be able to GET wherever they need. You made it sound like we had tanks and Infantry ready to fight and die in Israel. And we3 don't. Thanks for clearing that up.

Laying groundwork? We have thousands of "contingency plans" to move our forces anywhere for any purpose. Planning is just planning.

Words are just words. It's ACTIONS that count.

We have given Israel a lot. Israel has given us a lot. Here's just a few examples:
- Not competing against F-16's in with their KFIR fighter in the international marketplace
- Giving us their "ARROW" missile guidance system which allowed us to upgrade our "proximity" Patriot Air Defense System to its current "Patriot PAC-3" precision Air Defense System
- Delivered on-time and in-budget the STPT (Stinger Troop Proficiency Trainer).. a Stinger Missile simulation training device (I had the opportunity to live in Israel working on this.. great people... wonderful country)
- Many. if not MOST of the individual components found in US defense electronics from radios to computers and more... are made in Israel... fairly priced and reliable)
- They gave us their IRON DOME technology (we gave them ammunition for their systems)... we now use the system throughout our military under the name C-RAM (Counter Rocket, Artillery Mortar)

 

Yes, you "definitely are not aware", thank you for clarifying that.

 

The Liberty incident has bveen cited over and over as the way "The Fog of War" confuses things. No one knew what was going on. As a result of the Liberty fiasco, "Situational Awareness" was finally defined and efforts went underway in earnest to address the problem. We've made LOTS of progress.

 

I'm sorry if I mischaracterized your fondness for Israel but you do little to dispel it by calling this "another Jew bashing thread" when it is about a betrayal of America by a foreign country that receives more aid from Americans than any other country in the world.

Additionally, you are confusing my condemnation Israel's Right Wing / Settler Element with condemnation of Israel in general.
I had planned on visiting Israel when I was in S. Lebanon but the '73 War broke out
Why would I go to a country I didn't Like.
It's a given that Israelis have contributed much to enrich the world.

As far as your 4 questions go, I've either already answered them or they were answered in one of the many links I've provided so far and you have already rejected the facts they provide because the ADL disagreed with one (Big surprise!)

1. How did Israel need to contribute to the 911 attack?

- Israel was needed to pull off 9/11 because its organizations were in charge of security at the Towers' Complex and necessary airports.
Additionally, Israel has the most effective and greatest number of spies on the US and has already run numerous False Flags Ops and outright attacks on the US and still gets rewarded with $ Billions.

2. Where is your direct witness source for the "dancing" Israelis?

All you need to do is Google: "dancing Israelis 9/11" and you'll see dozens of links. There were several witnesses in a nearby apartment building. Because those who reported the 5 dancing Israelis wanted to stay alive, they chose to remain anonymous.

Please note:

EXCERPT "Police received several calls from angry New Jersey residents claiming "middle-eastern" men with a white van were videotaping the disaster with shouts of joy and mockery. (2)

"They were like happy, you know … They didn't look shocked to me" said a witness. (3)

[T]hey were seen by New Jersey residents on Sept. 11 making fun of the World Trade Center ruins and going to extreme lengths to photograph themselves in front of the wreckage. (4)

Witnesses saw them jumping for joy in Liberty State Park after the initial impact (5). Later on, other witnesses saw them celebrating on a roof in Weehawken, and still more witnesses later saw them celebrating with high fives in a Jersey City parking lot. (6)

"It looked like they're hooked in with this. It looked like they knew what was going to happen when they were at Liberty State Park." CONTINUED (1)

Additionally, one of the Israelis photographed his lighter in front of the burning towers:

EXCERPT "The FBI seized and developed their photos, one of which shows Sivan Kurzberg flicking a cigarette lighter in front of the smouldering ruins in an apparently celebratory gesture." CONTINUED (1)

Not only were the 5 arrested Israelis joyful at America's tragedy but the Israelis at "Urban Movers" were laughing and joking too.

Proof that Mossad had foreknowledge of 9/11 is in an interview, later, on an Israeli talk show:

EXCERPT "Several of the detainees discussed their experience in America on an Israeli talk show after their return home. Said one of the men, denying that they were laughing or happy on the morning of Sept. 11, "The fact of the matter is we are coming from a country that experiences terror daily. Our purpose was to document the event." (26)

How did they know there would be an event to document on 9/11?
It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to connect the dots of the dancing Israeli Mossad agents - here's the most logical scenario:" CONTINUED

3. What did you mean by "infiltrate" the US government - how is that necessary?
4. How was hijacking and crashing 4 planes too "complex" for "cave dwellers"?

I believe that the following words from bin Laden address your questions # 3 and # 4.

QUOTE "I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks. ... The American system is totally in control of the Jews, whose first priority is Israel, not the United States." CONTINUED

I'll bet you've never heard or read that before in Western MSM.

Finally, based on a much earlier video I saw and the word of a friend who works in the Pentagon, I don't believe that an airliner hit the Pentagon, I believe it was a type of Cruise missile but that's another topic.

I'm sure that you disagree with that too which is entirely your right.

I think I've addressed your questions and hope that you'll read the following article with an open mind.

Thanks,



(1). "The Five Dancing Israelis Arrested On 9-11"
https://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

 

What dispels the "Fog of War" claim concerning the USS Liberty is that the initial attack was carried out by unmarked Israel Mirage Fighters and a confession of an ethical Israeli pilot.(1)
Finally, they strafed lowered life rafts which is a war crime and then took a tattered life raft as a trophy and then hung it in a museum(2)

No country uses unmarked aircraft except in the process of another False Flag attack just 13 years after the Lavon Affaire.

Did you know these things?

Thanks,


(1). "Israeli Pilot Speaks Up"
https://www.wrmea.org/1993-june/the-assault-on-the-uss-liberty-still-covered-up-after-26-years.html

EXCERPT "Fifteen years after the attack, an Israeli pilot approached Liberty survivors and then held extensive interviews with former Congressman Paul N. (Pete) McCloskey about his role. According to this senior Israeli lead pilot, he recognized the Liberty as American immediately, so informed his headquarters, and was told to ignore the American flag and continue his attack. He refused to do so and returned to base, where he was arrested."CONTINUED


(2). "The Forgotten Sneak Attack"
https://www.counterpunch.org/2016/12/09/the-forgotten-sneak-attack/

EXCERPT "The life raft taken by the Israeli torpedo boat and the wheel of the torpedo boat that succeeded in hitting Liberty are on display at Israel’s National Maritime Museum in Haifa. In Israel, those who participated in the attack are celebrated as national heroes."CONTINUED

 

Re:

I just have a few minutes at the moment but I agree that the Israelis can be great people and I almost made it there except for the '73 War.
There is much there that I would love to see.

My problem has been with Israel's militant right wing element, Settlers etc and the multiple betrayals of which I am aware.

As a Veteran of the same time period, the USS Liberty attack, subsequent cover up and shabby treatment of survivors is inexcusable.
After Laos, I was assigned to the 82nd Airborne's Rapid Deployment Team for the Middle East. We were warned not to trust IDF.

Briefly put, I'm trying to be objective but you know about old dogs and new tricks.

Thanks,

 

Neither are relevant, especially the tower security. As stated numerous times - hijack 4 planes crash them. No need for any "tower security" and the appallingly complacent lax security prior to 911 meant there was not even a chance of them being stopped. Israel provided the US with full intelligence on a potential attack. Americans were on duty at the boarding gates, Americans worked for the security firm. The flimsiest of flimsiest claims is that somehow Israel managed to allow these men on board the planes!? And THAT is the extent of their total involvement?

Nineteen Al Qaeda operatives boarded the planes, not suicidal Jewish people, not suicidal Mossad agents! Arabs carried out 911. Your answer is fairly useless to your basic claim.

And yet again you fail! There was 1 recorded witness of their behaviour!
No "dancing" here: Dancing Israelis Police and FBI Reports 9/11/01 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

You made a lot of noise about ME "disregarding" your evidence, yet all you are doing is repeating what was effectively ingrained Arab propaganda! The witness report quite specifically does not say a damn thing about any "dancing"! I pointed out that people react very differently to disaster, all this demonstrates is a bunch of ignorant people who were later rightly deported. Your claim it was some hush job is nonsense. The "dancing" part was from the source I showed you. You cannot find a single source that directly says they were dancing, just somebody who says they "seemed to be celebrating".

Prior knowledge of an impending attack was passed on to the US security services, who had their own sources for such.
What the CIA knew before 9/11: New details – POLITICO

Conjecture! Why is the US witness regarded as 100% accurate in their interpretation!? Maybe they were high-fiving at being able to capture this event from such a good position! What brainless world does an event like this have the unfeasible perpetrators celebrating their "triumph" in public! It is nonsense. Jewish people DO witness nasty crap like this all the time, it is absolutely not out of the question that they would react differently.

Conspiracy hogwash. It takes bias and disregard to connect "dots" that shouldn't be connected!

No, really they do not. Answer the questions properly. Why is it necessary for any government infiltration to crash four planes!? Why was this too difficult for Al Qaeda?

Of course I have, do you think his knee-jerk denial was a secret!? He composed videos and letters later on when he realized his denial was not going to save him! BUT hey, surprise surprise, he's trying to redirect blame! Are you new to this subject?

My god, another "no-planer"! Drop in and answer even one of these issues!
The absurdly unfeasible problems with "no-planes" on 911 | PoliticalForum.com - Forum for US and Intl Politics

How about YOU read something:
#2172 conspiracy theories2(DH) (adl.org)