Ancient DNA reveals first known case of sex-development disorder

Discussion in 'Science' started by Bowerbird, Jan 16, 2024.

  1. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41...ail&utm_term=0_b27a691814-85f5a47832-51847612

    Showing that intersex conditions are not new and have been part of our societies since pre history. As I keep saying many many societies have intersex/transsexual positions within the societies and are therefor accepting that sex is a spectrum not a binary
     
  2. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    That's a chromosome abnormality, not a sex development disorder.
    Nonsense. If you have a Y chromosome, you're male; if not, female. The only exception I am aware of is androgen insensitivity, where a person with a Y chromosome does not respond normally to the release of testosterone, and develops as and appears -- and believes themselves -- to be female. Such people do not go through puberty, never menstruate, have no pubic or underarm hair (though they often develop breasts), cannot become pregnant (because they have no ovaries), etc.
     
  3. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Yes there is the anomalous hermaphrodite.
    However, the vast majority of these transsexuals pretending to be the opposite sex are born with clearly defined genitals and chromosomes.

    If you obviously have a penis and testicles then you are obviously a male. If you obviously have a vagina and breast then you are obviously a female. This is really not hard to understand.

    Screenshot_20240126-070912.png
     
  4. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    A human being can die and be dug up by an anthropologist several centuries later and they can clearly tell you whether it was a male or a female. Science is awesome like that.
     
  5. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    It is both as Klinefelters and turners syndromes are well known in medicine
     
  6. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    How little you know!
    Just take the syndrome of androgen insensitivity. Because they have an XY chromosomes but the cells in thier bodies do not recognise androgens they will develop as females

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_androgen_insensitivity_syndrome
     
  7. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    They are both chromosomal abnormalities, not sexual development disorders. Turners patients are female as they have no Y chromosome, Klinefelters patients are male, as they do.
     
  8. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    how little you know. You got any statistics on how many transgenders actually suffer from the condition you describe above? Screenshot_20231018-110902.png
     
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  9. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    So essentially kleinfelter's syndrome has existed since the human genome that's not hard to believe.

    I don't think that it's intersexed because the only people that kleinfelter's syndrome affects are males. It doesn't put them in any ambiguity between the sexes. It just means that their anatomy might be ambiguous.

    I remember hearing some rumors that certain Egyptian pharaohs were sufferers of klinefelter's syndrome.
     
  10. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Transgender people typically suffer from autism.

    Imagine that you can socially pressure someone into doing something to fit in if they suffer from a social disorder.

    This whole trans thing is predatory, creepy and vile.

    The more conspiracy-minded of me is suggesting that it's eugenics. Making artistic people unable to breed.
     
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  11. Polydectes

    Polydectes Well-Known Member

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    Klinefelter syndrome which is a male with an extra X chromosome typically results in ambiguous genitalia. The fact that it only affects males suggests that it's not an ambiguous sex. It just interferes with the development of genitalia.

    You also have Jacob's syndrome where a male has an extra Y chromosome.

    These people appear taller than average and typically have learning disabilities but other than that they're otherwise normal.

    But again they are always male.
    The way we determine male or female biologically speaking is the size of gametes. This is why we say the male seahorse gets pregnant. Instead of just calling the pregnant when the female because the one that gives birth to the babies produces small gametes.

    There are boys that are extraordinarily rare that when they're born they appear to be girls. As they reach puberty they'll grow breasts they don't have penis or testicles they're women anatomically speaking but they're not because they don't produce large gametes.

    They aren't some third sex because there can't be some third sex. There are large gametes and there are small gametes. There is no in between sized gametes. There are sperm and eggs no spergs or speggs.

    All gender is, is the cultural or maybe even biological signaling of your sex. To let people know that you are an egg producer or a sperm producer.

    So all of this other gobbledygook that people want to point to and say sex isn't black and white they're pointing at things that are black and white.

    Klinefelter syndrome and Jacob syndrome only occur in males. Xo syndrome and triple X syndrome only occur in females.

    Anatomy may be ambiguous but sex is not.

    So when they say intersex they are lying that doesn't exist.
     
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  12. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/917990-overview?form=fpf#a2

    This makes the argument that phenotypic deviation from genotype (hormonal abnormalities) and variations in genotype (genetic abnormalities) are causing dysphoria very weak. If very few individuals exhibiting dysphoria have genetic or hormonal abnormalities we have to look somewhere else for causality.

    The folks who start these threads don’t understand genetics or the literature on dysphoria and incongruence.

    It’s nutbaggery equivalent to saying folks who are unhappy with their features should get plastic surgery to resemble Down syndrome features because we discovered ancient remains with trisomy 21.
     
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  13. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

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    The Nature paper is openly accessible.

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s42003-023-05642-z
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2024
  14. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This has little to nothing to do with transgenderism, but I suspect they are trying to suggest a connection and that this research paper got more publication attention because it can be used to make people think something along the lines of "Transgenders have existed since ancient times so it's normal."

    That intersex abnormalities have existed since very ancient times is no surprise, and is really not news.
     
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  15. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    How do you know?
     
  16. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Science.
     
  17. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Vast majority having "clearly defined genitals"? When did he carry out his observations?

    My post wasn't actually a serious post anyway
     
  18. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    I’m slowly learning the science denial crowd isn’t very serious.

    Why would a PF member have to look at anyone’s genitalia to know such a thing?
     
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  19. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    I find it incredibly difficult to take anyone seriously who buys into this gender is whatever you feel like it pseudoscience delusion.
     
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  20. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Whatever!
     
  21. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Yeh, who cares about evidence, right? LOL. If the thinly veiled personal attacks fail in face of evidence…..whatever.
     
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  22. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Maybe because one of the defining characteristics of gender dysphoria is a mismatch between self-perceived gender and evident physiological sex?
     
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