Ancient Egyptian Race Controversy

Discussion in 'Africa' started by JohnConstantine, Oct 18, 2013.

  1. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Don't project... My view is that modern Egyptians look like Arabs/Greeks/Nubians... and since Egypt sits on the Mediterranean, they have probably been a mixed race people for a long, long time.
     
  2. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    istated it before, this is why the Arabs NEEDED to expand. That is why Egypt became an Arab dominion. That is why Khartoum became an Arab dominion, this is why Israel became an Arab dominion. Slavery played an important role in the expansion.
     
  3. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    Yes and all the while becoming less and less Afrikan. To the extent that most egyptians see themselves as more Arab than Afrikan.
    With the constant invasions by Army upon army upon army in egypt, from then to now...where do you think the defeated army went? Home? To turkey? to greece? to rome? to persia?
     
  4. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    How many African slaves were in Israel?
     
  5. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    From what period?
     
  6. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    After the Muslims arrived... Every patch of arable land was under cultivation and they weren't growing any "plantation crops" in Israel.. Look at the tiny stone terraces in Palestine that date from the Roman times.. to maximize water usage,

    I can see slaves being important in Egypt especially after the introduction of cotton... I just can't get my head around it.
     
  7. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    my opinion is less of an opinion than yours as my pov is based on historical evidence, your opinion is based on nothing but wishful thinking...
     
  8. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    incorrect Margret, the first Nubian pyramid built was by the 1st 25th Dynasty Pharaoh Taharqa, about 500 yrs after the last Egyptian pyramid was constructed, it would appear the Nubian Pharaoh after conquering Egypt was so impressed with the ancient Pharaohs pyramids he decide Nubian kings should have them as well...this happened about 600 BC, the earliest eyptian pyramid construction began 2,600 bc...
     
  9. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Oops.. Thanks for the correction.
     
  10. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    you need to get past this misconception of "race" there just isn't any such thing....there are no pure ethnic group of any kind, we are all a mixture of many...there is no definitive Egyptian "race" the genetic difference between Egyptians and their neighbours will be fuzzy just as it is for every ethnic group, in Egypt's southern edges there will be more of a nubian mix, in it's northern regions there will be more additional diverse genetics(Greeks,Arabs,Romans,Turks etc) but Egypt's core is still Egyptian which it has been for many thousands of years...
     
  11. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    it's cultural Jonah, it reflects who they do do business with and who they relate with culturally and nothing more...

    we are all originally Africans no matter where we live or the colour of our skin...how we see ourselves align culturally is not a slight against Africa or sub Saharan Africans...I live in North america but I have little in common in with central Americans which part of North america, even though we live on the same continent our outlook on the world is very different...
     
  12. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    believe what you like, youre all hot air imo :wink:
     
  13. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    Gene flow may account for the homogeneity across these Nubian and Egyptian groups and is consistent with the biological diffusion precept. Small geographic distances between groups allow for the exchange of genes. One of the Nubian groups in this analysis is located in Upper Egypt (Hesa/Biga), near Egyptian occupation, and contact between the two populations may have been commonplace. Specifically, Nubians were often captured and enslaved by Egyptians to build pyramids, or employed by the Egyptian army (Trigger, 1976). Occasionally, Nubians were even directed to fight other Nubians as part of their duties as troops (Trigger, 1976). Moreover, some groups of Nubians allied with the Egyptians for the conquest of Nubian areas, primarily during Dynasty I (Trigger, 1976). Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, trade between Nubians and Egyptians flourished at Kerma and Meroe, during the time periods named after the sites, and enabled contact for potential gene flow. As a result of their respective histories, the multitude of interactions between them, geographic locations, and their biological composition, it appears that gene flow was possibly occurring between the two populations.

    The similarities uncovered by this study may be explained by another force, adaptation. As stated above, the results appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis because the Nubian and Egyptian groups are biologically similar. However, this resemblance may be indicative of a common adaptation to a similar geographic location, rather than gene flow. Carlson and Van Gerven (1979) stated this idea in reference to common adaptations of Nubian, Paleolithic, and aboriginal Australian populations. Additionally, Carlson (1976), Prowse and Lovell (1995), Van Gerven (1982), and Van Gerven et al., 1977 D. Van Gerven, G. Armelagos and A. Rohr, Continuity and change in cranial morphology of three Nubian archaeological populations, Man 2 (1977), pp. 270–277. View Record in Scopus | Cited By in Scopus (9)Van Gerven et al. (1977) also recognized this form of natural selection as a mechanism for in situ biological change; Egypt and Nubia have similar terrain and climate. Because of the similarity between and the overlapping of the two territories that would require similar adaptations to the environment, common adaptation cannot be discounted.

    In summation, a portion of the in situ hypothesis in Nubians is supported in this paper, namely homogeneity. Gene flow appears likely between the Egyptians and Nubians, although common adaptations to a similar environment may have also been a factor in their cranial similarities. This study does not rule out the possibility that in situ biological evolution occurred at other times not represented by the samples in this analysis. Further research should incorporate more populations the Nubians were in contact with, to further shed light on Nubian population structure. Additionally, Konigsberg’s (1990) spatial–temporal isolation model should be applied to the dataset here to further explicate the results.

    Godde, K. "An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?." HOMO-Journal of Comparative Human Biology 60.5 (2009): 389-404.
     
  14. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    The pyramids were built as a national project. Egyptians worked for periods of time between Nile floods and planting. Archeologists have excavated the worker camps not far from the base of the pyramids.
     
  15. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    the evidence indicates the pyramid builders were not nubian or jewish slaves but skilled Egyptian craftsmen..
     
  16. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    They werent egyptian because that word never existed in 3000bce, that is a greek word from 500bce
     
  17. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Of course they''re not exactly the same. Saying it is would be as absurd as saying they are the same people, somehow immortal and still alive after all these millenia

    I can think of NO major culture existing today that is not mainly or at least largely an admixture of others. Can you?
     
  18. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    that's just really weird jonah...
     
  19. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    that is true but unless the new culture arrives in significant numbers they'll be absorbed into the much greater host population both culturally and physically...over time they will become indistinguishable from the host the only physical trace of them will be found at a genetic level...Romans brought literally millions of slaves into their midst many of them black Africans but physically there is no trace of them, it had no noticeable effect on the general physical characteristics...genetically they were too small in numbers to change the ethnic appearance of roman's, they disappeared their descendents becoming as roman in appearance as the Romans...
     
  20. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    Really, how did you reach this conclusion? Must admit, inever heard this before!!

    - - - Updated - - -

    The english never existed 2,000 years ago because that is a german word given to them by the german invaders, the culture and ppl had changed.
     
  21. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    basic genetics Jonah...given unrestricted opportunity to interbreed the genetic minority will be overwhelmed by the majority...


    so what you're claiming is because our term "slavery" wasn't an Egyptian word slavery didn't exist?..that's a bizarre bit of logic....

    and the german's(Anglo-Frisians ) never named the english, "english"...the "english" were the Germanic invaders from Frisland and today's northwest Germany ... at the time of the Anglo-Frisian invasions the occupants of the islands were known as the Britanni ...so it's more likely the Brittani named the invaders the Angles

    and if some recent DNA sampling is correct the population England today may be one case where the original host population was largely swept away by the Anglo-frisian invader, with the islands pre-roman inhabitants remaining the majority in Scotland, Wales and Ireland...
     
  22. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    No, imean where is your evidence that 'many of the millions' taken captive to rome were so-called black ppl?
     
  23. wyly

    wyly Well-Known Member

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    :roll: that's not what I wrote..."millions of slaves into their midst many of them black Africans" the roman slave trade gathered people from everywhere...
     
  24. J0NAH

    J0NAH Banned

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    oh ic, another of your fairytales:wink:
     

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