BMW Ends ICE Production in Germany! Mercedes?

Discussion in 'Science' started by WillReadmore, Nov 17, 2023.

  1. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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  2. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    LOL - that was the issue! You want to see that as an indication of collapse of the EV.

    I'm pointing out that it does not show that at all.

    Maybe EVs WILL collapse. But, it isn't show by what you have cited.
     
  3. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I'm not even slightly impressed.

    Compare this to Ford's record with recalls.

    I'm fine with EVs being held to a higher standard, though. ALL vehicles should be held to a higher standard.

    I do see these articles as being predatory, however. The idea that a recall on the pedal is a major issue is ridiculous when compared to recalls on other trucks.

    The "car wash mode" is a great idea. People go through car washes with their windows and skylights open. It's not something that anyone wants, as it does do damage.

    The reason for the Cybertruck locking up isn't made clear. If the windows were all closed, what actually happened???
     
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  4. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    ICE don't realize that gasoline has to get from A to B.

     
  5. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    And EVs don't realize that work needs to get done in this world.

    And EVs suck at doing work.
     
  6. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    EVs are doing just fine in all their uses. And they get better every day. Can't say that about ICE vehicles. Compared to EVs, they're inefficient, noisy, and just not as cool!
     
  7. Base

    Base Newly Registered

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    I don't think about being cool when buying a vehicle. I buy it for dependable transportation. The only reason to worry about buying a cool vehicle is if you are compensating....
     
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  8. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    Compensating for what?
     
  9. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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  10. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    The only thing useful about EVs is satisfying the malignant narcissism of the "climate change" zombies.

    And given the pending destruction of the zombies one note tune in the Supreme Court AND the lawsuit recently filed by fully half the states https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/s...S&cvid=0592155b302844b6a4c81ec97ae16c7a&ei=22 , the government will soon lose the fascist ability to force EVs on people who don't want them.

    Then we can determine objectively just how good EVs are compared to ICE.

    Be prepared to be disappointed.
     
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  11. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Climate change is NOT the only benefit of EVs, as has been pointed out over and over.

    We have never had to wait to compare EVs and ICEs.
     
  12. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Weird opinion. EVs can't "destroy" driving.

    New car registrations in EU have been on hard times, showing a decrease of sales in the 5% range.

    EU has been struggling economically. It's not surprising that new car sales have been down OR that manufacturers are working to generate sales.
     
  13. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Correct. We've been comparing EVs and ICEs for 30 years. There's never been any waiting.

    And what we know quite clearly is that EVs suck and have sucked. The only reason they're currently being promoted has to do with CO2.

    And left to an actual free market, they still suck.

    And as far as anyone knows right now, they will continue to suck.
     
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  14. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Many are freely choosing EVs today - all over the world.
     
  15. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Then why not end the subsidies and mandates (like the EPAs)?

    Let people freely choose them.
     
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  16. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    There is PLENTY of price gamesmanship throughout the auto industry.

    Imagine what would happen if manufacturers were required to make a profit!

    Or, if dealerships had to sell at MSRP.
     
  17. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    There aren't subsidies and mandates for ICE vehicles. And ICE manufacturers do make a profit.

    So put EVs on the same level playing field and let them sink or swim.
     
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  18. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's a double-edge sword with ICE subsidies. Oil and gas is subsidized and ICE vehicles are subsidized. Also remember the US auto industry bailouts of 2008?

    https://e360.yale.edu/digest/fossil-fuels-received-5-9-trillion-in-subsidies-in-2020-report-finds

    Fossil Fuels Received $5.9 Trillion In Subsidies in 2020, Report Finds

    Coal, oil, and natural gas received $5.9 trillion in subsidies in 2020 — or roughly $11 million every minute — according to a new analysis from the International Monetary Fund.

    https://stacker.com/society/how-driving-subsidized-america

    How driving is subsidized in America

    A report published in the April of 2022 issue of Ecological Economics teased out the lifetime cost of driving a small car to be roughly $641,000, with society subsidizing about 41% of that cost. Individual expenses include everything from sale price and repairs to fuel, maintenance bills, and repairs. In the forthcoming list, Stacker explores myriad ways driving is subsidized in the U.S.
     
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  19. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Amen.

    Plus, externalities are also subsidies. We subsidize ICEs by breathing their exhaust and then suffering the health care impact - in higher insurance costs, lost work, etc.
     
  20. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, right.

    Environazis have been paper-whipping BS like this since at least the Clinton administration. Back then it was proudly declared that the "real" price of a gallon of gasoline was $15 a gallon. The real problem with that claptrap was that the price at the pump on every street corner was more like a buck fifty.

    It's no wonder real people don't listen to nonsense like this anymore.

    "Ecological Economics" is a pure oxymoron. Emphasis on "moron".

    And do you remember the recession of 2008? The bankruptcies? The bailouts of JP Morgan, etc. I sure as heck do. Complete economic disaster. And Barry's claim of all those shovel ready jobs that never materialized?

    Please.

    The simple fact is that changing definitions is the only way the left can survive. Mangling the language is the primary tool of deception.

    We don't strive for equality. We push for equity.

    So reparations continue to be a thing. And burning down Minneapolis is just a peaceful protest.

    Tell you what. Level the playing field for EVs. Get rid of the subsidies and mandates. Let them compete fairly.

    Then we'll really know what works for actual people.

    Or are you scared to try to compete in a free market.

    Cause that's what you're going to have to do come the end of June.
     
  21. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    That is false.

    Your post includes advocacy disguised as research.
    "The ISEE is a transdisciplinary partnership of scholars, professionals, and activists from a broad range of backgrounds. Through education, research, policy, and social action, we foster transformation towards an equitable and ecologically sustainable society with respect for the rights of people and nature, biological and cultural diversity. . . . "
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
  22. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    The article suggests otherwise.
     
  23. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    It's nothing more than the inevitable truth of a forced EV market conversion. This article is about Britain, but the same thing is queueing up here, although it doesn't appear that the US system is as flexible in merely backing out of a stupid decision as Britain is (we've got the 8000 lb. gorilla of craven politicized narcissism, the EPA, to fight here).

    But the story's the same. Force automakers to sell things people don't want and ban automakers from producing products people do want.

    EVs get so cheap nobody can turn a profit and ICE gets so expensive nobody can afford it (if you can find one to buy).

    Automakers have no choice but to collapse taking one of the hearts of our industrial base with it.

    And then we'll be back to a 12th century feudal agrarian economy.

    Which is exactly what the environazis want.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
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  24. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    Sounds like somebody doesn't support the free market.
     
  25. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Like you?
     

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