BMW Ends ICE Production in Germany! Mercedes?

Discussion in 'Science' started by WillReadmore, Nov 17, 2023.

  1. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    You haven't even cited it.

    You can look at LA, cities in China and other places to see the disgusting results of ICE pollution.

    But, that doesn't measure the healthcare costs.

    Recent studies show that LA is becoming cleaner due to the movement toward EVs.
     
  2. Polydectes

    Polydectes Banned

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    this is a religious belief and it's completely false. First you have to make the stupid thing and that's already a bigger carbon footprint than driving 400,000 miles and a gas guzzling pickup truck. Then when that piece of crap fills in 60,000 miles because it's not going to last that long you have to throw it away and they don't recycle batteries they're too complicated recycled battery would cost about five times more than one made out of natural resources.

    So after you're done with this stupid little chunk of you waste you spent too much money on and it was less effective than a gasoline-powered car built 30 years ago you have to dump it somewhere. And if the heavy metals and toxic components in the battery don't ignite they'll leach into the water table.

    That's not considering the hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of tons of coal you have to burn to power them. I don't tell me about your stupid little windmills you're barely producing enough power right now for those things to even amount to about 5% of our energy. When you increase the demand by six times which is what you have to do when you want to charge stupid little virtue signaling car imitations you have to create the energy somehow. And that'll be coal.
    meanwhile every electric car manufacturer is allowed to lie through their teeth about range. If someone tells you that this car is going to get 500 mi of range it'll probably be 310 at the very best. If you turn on your AC and want to use window wipers and headlights probably 96.
    yeah it's essentially just ignore all the pollution that electric car is produce.

    Particularly in their manufacture and in their disposal.

    You're trying to build a box around the car and say the air in the box of course pretending that tires don't wear it's clean but really the boxes around the planet and producing them is not clean and neither is disposing of them.
     
  3. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Not possible. Pollution from ICEs has been and continues to be measured.

    You can't make up some other reality.
     
  4. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Now you are complaining about EV batteries.

    But, batteries are still worth far to much to simply discard at the end of their life in an EV.

    You don't have ANY argument about EV pollution.

    And, you clearly don't know about electricity generation. In fact, you can't even read my posts about it.
     
  5. Polydectes

    Polydectes Banned

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    and with electric cars it's ignored to the point where you don't even think there is any.
    I got the one lying to myself about how much energy we need to produce to power cars that are less useful, find a muscle not the one lying to myself about how there will be this magical recycling plant that will recycle electric car batteries and they won't be just dumped somewhere.

    You have no idea what reality is. That's why you operate in religious belief.

    When landfills are piled high with toxic batteries leaching heavy metals into the water table or eternal fires burning belching out poisonous gas then you'll learn how dumb your position is.

    I just hope most people in the world aren't as remedial As You Are.
     
  6. Polydectes

    Polydectes Banned

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    because first it's why they suck, second it's why they will absolutely destroy the ecosystem.
    then why are Teslas with no battery damage but no longer Street Worthy piling up in salvage lots and you can't even give them away?

    Why is the resale value on a 3-year-old electric car absolutely in the toilet?

    In fact all the years that EV batteries are liability they're expensive to possess and dangerous.
    yes I do The dumping of heavy metals in the battery if they don't ignite is catastrophic.
    in that I don't believe that it's not magical fairy unicorn dust that you can just demand six times as much as you produce and not produce a single megawatt more.

    No I don't know about your religions version of electrical generation because it's not real I don't waste my time learning nonsense.

    I focus on what is and what actually can be done not stupid electric car religion nonsense.
    Well I can and do read your posts that's why I'm extremely pessimistic for our education system because you don't know anything.

    You think you can just magic up a more electricity you have no idea how much more electricity the world is going to demand if we increase the amount of electric cars from less than 1% where they are now to just 5%.

    You are too caught up in the belief to the point where absolutely blind to reality.

    When I read your posts it makes me sad that you were denied education.
     
  7. Polydectes

    Polydectes Banned

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    Will you're an evangelist. Nobody should waste their time citing anything to you. You choose to believe in falsehoods because you want them to be true.

    This is not the and for logical discussion.

    I don't discuss evolution with young Earth creationists and I don't discuss orbit with flat earthers. Not seriously anyway.
     
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  8. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    Yes, there is no question that EVs are extremely effective at improving city air quality. China’s auto sales are now over 50% EVs. At one time they had extreme pollution problems. I just looked up the US for a different thread. Counting hybrids, EVs, and plug-in hybrids, we are at 16%.
     
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  9. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    Tsk tsk.

    Accounting for only 1% of all vehicles on U.S. roads, EVs are still rare in most parts of the country.Mar 19, 2024

    What Is the Percentage of Electric Cars in the U.S.? - Edmunds
     
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  10. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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  11. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I can't get that subsidy, and I'd bet you can't, either.

    Let's hope legacy auto can learn to make and sell competitive EVs before we're inundated by less expensive, high quality vehicles from China. Legacy auto faces a challenge not unlike the Japanese invasion that nearly drove legacy auto to bankruptcy.

    I have my doubts. By contract law, legacy auto sales are through dealerships that don't want to sell EVs. And, the amount legacy auto loses on every EV sale dwarfs the $7,500 subsidy. Even if they figure out how to make great EVs, they face a serious uphill battle here, at a time when competition is at our shores.
     
  12. Base

    Base Newly Registered

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    That is a stupid statement, if I've ever heard one. Dealerships want to sell whatever their customers want to buy.
     
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  13. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Dealerships make an important percent of their profit from service contracts. They note that they have nothing to gain after sale.

    Some benefits of EVs are hard for dealerships to sell. How do they explain that the customer stands to benefit from less maintenance cost than if they buy one of their ICE cars?

    Also, the manufacturer (say, Ford) has less control over sales price, since that is what the dealership controls. So, price reductions by Ford don't have the market effect Ford might desire.

    Jim Farley sees the dealership model (enforced by law) as being a big problem.

    Tesla has no dealerships. They sell direct. Even if you buy from one of their sites, the sale is made over the internet direct. That is an important advantage for Tesla.
     
  14. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    Interesting link. It states that 6-1/2% of new sales are EVs, but only 1% of cars on the road are EVs. I guess the other 5-1/2% of buyers just park the car in the garage.
     
  15. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Also, EVs suck comparatively vs. ICE vehicles.
     
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  16. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    Hardly, EVs exceed ICEs in many issues - just a few - Regenerative braking, much simpler design, with very little maintenance costs, and much more!
     
  17. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    They suck at the most important aspect- work.

    And that's ultimately why they'll always be a niche vehicle.
     
  18. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    That’s just rhetoric. They do great, and outperform ICEs in many aspects.
     
  19. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    No. It's technical truth.

    And the rest of the aspects don't matter.
     
  20. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    So you think all cars on the road are new each year? Hmmmm.
     
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  21. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    As you wish.:rolleyes:
     
  22. Jack Hays

    Jack Hays Well-Known Member Donor

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    No. You are conflating new sales with the total number on the road (we'll call those old sales).
     
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  23. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    These are the people that want to control climate policy, supposedly on the back of “science”.
     
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  24. Media_Truth

    Media_Truth Well-Known Member Donor

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    No confusion on my part. If people bought them, presumably the reason was to drive them "on the road".
     
  25. Pieces of Malarkey

    Pieces of Malarkey Well-Known Member

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    Modern EVs in this country have been available for 30 years at least. Tesla has existed for a little better than 20 years.

    No matter how many were sold last year, in the entire fleet of vehicles on the road currently, some 20-30 years old at least, 99% of them are ICE.

    Can't be that hard to figure out.
     
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