Capitalist Genocide on the Irish

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by ManifestDestiny, Jan 8, 2015.

  1. ManifestDestiny

    ManifestDestiny Well-Known Member

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    Last time I made a thread about Capitalist genocide it was flooded with "But but, that wasnt the fault of Capitalism it was imperialism!" so I will focus on the Irish genocide because this one is clear cut and very direct, Capitalism was undoubtedly the cause of this and there are no "if" "and's" or "but's".

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Famine_(Ireland)#Government_response

    "F. S. L. Lyons characterised the initial response of the British government to the early less severe phase of the famine as "prompt and relatively successful".[62] The government hoped that they would not "stifle private enterprise" and that their actions would not act as a disincentive to local relief efforts. (Capitalism) In March, Peel set up a programme of public works in Ireland[68] but the famine situation worsened during 1846 and the repeal of the Corn Laws in that year did little to help the starving Irish; the measure split the Conservative Party, leading to the fall of Peel's ministry.[69] The measures undertaken by Peel's successor, Russell, proved comparatively "inadequate" as the crisis deepened. The new Whig administration, influenced by the doctrine of laissez-faire,[71] believed that the market would provide the food needed and refused to intervene against food exports to England, then halted the previous government's food and relief works, leaving many hundreds of thousands of people without any work, money or food.[72] Charles Trevelyan, who was in charge of the administration of government relief, limited the Government's food aid programme because of a firm belief in laissez-faire.[74] He thought "the judgement of God sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson". In Ireland before and after the famine, Cormac O'Grada points out, "Although the potato crop failed, the country was still producing and exporting more than enough grain crops to feed the population. But that was a 'money crop' and not a 'food crop' and could not be interfered with."[81]"


    There is absolutely NO way to say this was not the fault of Capitalism, it really could not be anymore direct over and over is references to "laissez-faire" and not wanting to "stifle private enterprise" through "public works", 100% the exact same arguments Capitalists still use to this day while people die of healthcare and live in food insecure households while attempting to cut their food stamps and minimum wage because its government interference, which it is. Really you guys only have one of two options, admit Capitalism is to blame the same way you guys scream Communism is to blame for the Soviet Union, or deny the ENTIRE thing and make yourself look like an absolute fool to everybody who thinks rationally and can see the blatant direct link to Capitalism. Many British politicians tried to help the Irish, but the Conservatives stopped them because its government interference into the economy, and that would be evil "Socialism!" which the conservatives wanted no part in, they would rather let the Irish starve by the hundreds of thousands than cave into socialism, and thats exactly what they did.
     
  2. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    So basically what the article says is that stupid government policy caused the problem. There are certain things that capitalism cannot fix in the short term. One of those is when a staple crop is rendered defunct by disease. As was the case in the potato famine.
     
  3. ManifestDestiny

    ManifestDestiny Well-Known Member

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    Wow, you didnt even try to read the whole thing.......It did not say government policy caused this problem, you pulled that right out of your ass, it was the potato blight that caused this and nature is to blame. The problem is, they had more than enough food to feed their people but they COULDNT AFFORD IT so they shipped it off to places where they can sell it to people who can afford it, that is the free market plain and simple it has absolutely nothing to do with government interference. "Cormac O'Grada points out, "Although the potato crop failed, the country was still producing and exporting more than enough grain crops to feed the population. But that was a 'money crop' and not a 'food crop' and could not be interfered with."

    The government intervention was helping, than the whigs took charge and got rid of the government help making the situation incredibly worse, "The new Whig administration, influenced by the doctrine of laissez-faire,[71] believed that the market would provide the food needed and refused to intervene against food exports to England, then halted the previous government's food and relief works, leaving many hundreds of thousands of people without any work, money or food.[72] Charles Trevelyan, who was in charge of the administration of government relief, limited the Government's food aid programme because of a firm belief in laissez-faire.[74]" not because of government intervention, you damn propagandist
     
  4. Sanskrit

    Sanskrit Well-Known Member

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    1. Thank you. You just put me, via my Irish forebears, on equal footing with any purportedly "oppressed" group in history including blacks, Indians and women. You also singlehandedly removed the rationale for any claims of "white privilege." Don't worry, I won't be running out to wave a "white power" placard or lobby for affirmative action on those grounds. I won't resort to framing history dishonestly as oppression against my group only. I won't advocate violence against groups who are supposedly oppressing "my Irish people." I won't do these things because I'm not an idiot or a jackass.

    2. So you posted a link to the potato famine, and are trying to blame capitalism for a famine?! So tell us all, and we'll anxiously await your reply, how many "famines" do we have today in developed capitalist countries as opposed to other areas of the world? How many do they have? These are not hard questions to answer.
     
  5. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    And it is a stupid government policy to continue to allow shipping food off while your population starves. And shipping food out in the middle of a famine serves only to drive up the cost of food. I suppose it was also the fault of capitalism that millions of Ukrainians starved while Linen shipped their food elsewhere.
     
  6. ManifestDestiny

    ManifestDestiny Well-Known Member

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    Wow your reading comprehension is absolutely atrocious, it is the GOVERNMENT who wanted to END the shipping of food outside of Ireland, but the CONSERVATIVES stopped them because having the government stop exports is GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE INTO THE FREE MARKET, so they did not allow it. Your semantics are not going to work
     
  7. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    You misunderstand that background. It is the government who had prevented the Irish farmers from owning their own land and denied them access to the product of their own labor thereby insuring their starvation through the bastardization of the natural capitalist system.
     
  8. ManifestDestiny

    ManifestDestiny Well-Known Member

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    proof?
     
  9. CJtheModerate

    CJtheModerate New Member

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