Congressman: Jewish settlers are like termites

I hope you live there!

 

Do you condemn their "god" for saying the land is theirs?

 

God forbid if someone lived there for thousands of years, but didn't have an organized nation.

 

Because they have rockets to use in order to terrorize instead.

They call and the population obliges and they simply hide amongst them without active participation. They are still using their own people as human shields.

Can't. There's a wall.

It's 5:1. Israel is 1:1 and the numbers are low because Israel has a wall and doesn't allow them in so they can do bad stuff.

And then they make use of their human shields. They use human shields as part of their official policy Creation. No matter how you attempt to word it that's what they do. Even the UN and they themselves admit that.

Did I mention that it's illegal to do this in the IDF and they prosecute those who do. I think I did.


UN report outlines how Hamas used kids as human shields


Hamas Spokesman Urges Gazans to Act as Human Shields for Hamas Leaders

Hamas Admits to Using Civilians as Human Shields

Hamas used civilians as human shields during the 2014 Gaza war

Conclusive Proof that Hamas Uses Palestinians as Human Shields

Hamas Human Shields

And he saw that there were no human shields being used despite the leaders themselves saying there were, despite the UN saying there were, despite the people saying they allow themselves to be used for same and despite the fact that Hamas hides amongst the people?

So you admit they fire from populated areas using their own people as human shields yet say they don't use human shields. It seems I am dealing with one who cannot face the reality.

LOL the point is, they shouldn't be in any danger at all unless they have Hamas using those areas to fire rockets and thereby making those areas legitimate military targets. If there is no Israeli strike coming in because there is no target there then there would be no need to use human shields to protect a home or building would there. In any case, Hamas uses human shields pure and simple whether it is by force or volunteering.

Actually there is not much more at all. Hamas uses the entire population as human shields when they set up and turn populated areas into battlefields by attacking from those areas. No responsible military force would initiate attacks from amongst civilians and would either move outside those areas or not do it at all.

Better catch up on the news as you are falling behind, the EU didn't abide by that and have appealed it leaving Hamas on their list as a terrorist organization.

""EU keeps Hamas on terror list despite court ruling
Gaza group will remain on EU blacklist during council's appeal process, as Hamas calls decision 'unjust and wrong'.
AFP|Published: 27.03.15 , 21:57 ""

No binding chapter 7 ones if that's what you mean however, the Palestinians have not adhered to the main one which is UNGA 181. You know, the one that said they would live in peace with their neighbors and all that. Since they made war their policy Israel may use UN Charter article 51 in all it's comprehensive allowance to defend herself no matter what rumblings the UN General assembly says.

Argue that point with Hamas who says they target all Israelis not me.

Hardly. They cannot so they target civilians, that's the point. They admit to targeting all Israelis even though they would prefer to target military. They shouldn't be targeting anybody at all rather adhering to UNGA 181 and living in peace with their neighbors in order to get their own country like they should have in '48 rather than declaring war as part of the Arab League.

Yes, now you get it. They target all Israelis and when Israel acts in the defense of their people like any government would do they hide amongst their civilians using them as human shields and possibly, turning or allowing those very civilians to become accomplices of Hamas and therefore legitimate military targets by their cooperation.

I did. Hamas kills five times as many civilians per combatant as Israel does. If Israel did not protect their people that number would rise geometrically.

We are speaking of the Congressman's words and you once again fail to show how he excluded children.

I don't have to show anything as I already provided the quote where he says all Jews who reside in settlements are like termites. That is what we are discussing.

He referred to ""Jewish people.""

Here is the quote from the Congressman;

""“There has been a steady [stream], almost like termites can get into a residence and eat before you know that you’ve been eaten up and you fall in on yourself, there has been settlement activity that has marched forward with impunity and at an ever increasing rate to the point where it has become alarming,” Mr. Johnson said.

“You see one home after another being appropriated by Jewish people who come in to claim that land just because somebody did not spend the night there”""

He's calling Jews who reside there termites. That includes women and children who are Jewish who live there and is an antisemitic comment. I can understand if you are OK with somebody calling Jewish people insects but please don't try to say he didn't.

 

But Negroes can't be racist...Right?

 

No that's not true. At all.

 

No that's not a human shield.

No walls in Gaza.

Not in Gaza. Where Hamas rules. And the ratio is far better then the West in ww2.

No a human shield is forcing someone to remain in the line of fire. That's not what they're doing. That is what Israel has been doing.

Yes he saw no one being forced to stay in the line of fire.

Firing from these areas is not forcing people to stay .

Lol. They are in danger wherever they are. And they're not forced to stay. So again you're wrong.

Lol. Every nation in the world attacks from its areas where they live both open and closed. And Hamas attacks from all points of the map. And they don't force people to stay.

Oh sure. But in the meantime this awful organisation has been taken off the list.

They're still un resolutions and equally under the UN Charter the Palestinians can defend themselves.

Don't need to. They say they will target IDF as they're capabilities allow.

They've offered truce again and again. And they cannot target anyone.

Lol. Sending a rickety rocket up is no more targeting all Israelis than the West targeted all Germany.

Hamas kills at a far better rate than the West with alot less weaponry and if israel didn't attack them they wouldn't be attacked at all.

The children are naturally excluded for the reason given.

Indeed. He does not mention who exactly is involved because he doesn't need to.

No it naturally doesn't include children. At all.

 

Any one is 'welcome' to live where he prefers to be. But this does not give anyone the right to erode the will of the initial inhabitants under FALSE slogans... That the Jews have stolen the land of an infiltrator/roamer squatting on foreign soil..

 

You want to bet????????????????? Please go to any library and inform yourself on the Nation of Israel and come back.

 

Oh please, Arabs were probably in Israel longer, than Jews were.

 

Are you calling Palestinians liars? That's a good one! So what else are they lying about, come clean please.

Israel–Gaza barrier

Which puts Israel in the ratio of being a literal saint as theirs is five times less lethal.

Funny, they called the volunteers that went to Iraq "Human Shields" and now you are telling us they were not Human Shields.

So Palestinians in Gaza are now free to flee to safety whenever they are in danger. This flies in the face of so many arguments Palestinians azz kissers throw up. when they say there is no safe place in Gaza

Then why on earth would Hamas endanger them by inviting Israeli counter attacks by setting up offensive rocket launching equipment in order to committ terrorist attacks where they live?

Cite some examples as this one seems like something only you take for granted. Tell us how Japan attacked Pearl Harbor from the middle of Tokyo or the US has made their missile silos for ICBMs in the center of the Bronx or Russia sets up their Nuclear Submarine facilities in an apartment complex in Moscow.

Just proved to you that it's still there old bean.

Nope. Charter is quite clear they are not permitted to attack but Israel is permitted to defend.

And until they can all Israelis are targets. Can't you read what they say or is your dislexia so selective you can't even read a link?

They've yet to strike the violent destruction of Israel from their antisemitic offensive charter time and time again so no truce is anything but a rearming phase for them.

LOL Hamas says they target Israelis civilians, Israel says they target their civilians and their missiles reach Israel and kill Israeli civilians yet you say they cannot target anyone so why on earth would they fire a missile only to have it explode on it's own launching pad yet none so far have ?

Talk and argue this point with Hamas who say they use them to target Israel with as you don't seem to be getting it -

HAMAS ADMITS THEY TARGET ALL ISRAELIS WITH THEM.

Israel is 1:1 Hamas cares not about civilian lives so they kill five times the amount of civilians with a ratio of 5:1. I can see you love to see civilians being killed as long as it is Israelis.

Really now. Once again you fail to back this up with proof. I smell a guy who just has no proof to back up a lie.

He is quoted as saying Jewish residents. I take it you have another quote saying Muslim Hamas terrorists?

If they are Jewish residents then it certainly does.

Creation, even for you the above post is weak. Come strong or just let this one slide as you are dealing with a quote from a congressman who has called Jewish residents termites and Hamas who themselves state that all Israelis are their targets and admit to using human sheilds. Nothing shameful about letting it go but this is one that you can't win.

 

I already have. Ive got numerous books on it. So yes I do want to bet you.

 

We can only bring horses to water... yet, we cannot force them to drink.

 

No im calling Israeli propaganda a lie. Spefically that people are being forced to stay in the line of fire in order to become victims.

LOL. When the IDF invaded Gaza, inside the Gaza border Hamas did not use forced human waves of civilians against them. Nor again did they force anyone to stay in the line of fire. That is to their credit, and that means youre entire point is completely wrong.

LOL. Utter bull.

No it simply means they are an occupying force in the West Bank and laying seige to Gaza. That doesnt make their kill rates any better. When they actually fought full scale conventional wars their combatant to civilian kill ratios were no better and no worse than any one else. Least of Palestinians or Western powers. Since then they been occupying and/ or laying seige. This means their kill ratios drop dramatically.

LOL. The term originates from the 1991 Gulf war, when Saddam Hussein held a number of westerners in Baghdad to delay to prevent the West from bombing. They were forced to stay before being released. That is a policy of using a human shield.

No. They are free to flee to next place of temporary safety. Its entirely correct and doesnt fly in the face of Palestinian azz kissers etc etc.

Because they employ a logical tactic of constantly shifting their firing points around Gaza in order to evade targetting.

LOL. Take the history of Israel itself. Its urban communties armed themselves and then attacked neighboring communities before linking up with Kibbutizm in the countryside. In the UK for example, most cities contain military barracks and armouries within them. The entire history of warfare is one of attacks originating from cities and towns.

You clearly didnt read the BBC article old bean. But yes the matter was under appeal. The court has however found the original listing to be based on poor reasoning.

Nope the charter is quite clear, Israel is not permitted to attack and the Palestinians are permitted to defend.

Israelis no more all targets than al Germans were in World War Two or all Palestinians were in 48, 56, 67, 82 and the repeated Gaza invasions. What they say was not confirmed by the Hamas leadership and was a local reaction to a terror attack against a Palestinian family.

Theres no need for them to strike anything from their charter. Its an internal matter that has been described as no longer relevant by it leader Khaled Meshal.
Theres nothing to stop anyone from rearming, neither need there be. Israel can rearm, and does. Hamas can rearm. The question is, can anyone trust Israel to not attack palestinians in Gaza? No.

LOL. Answered above. The rockets are no better at hitting a target than an artillery shell. H

Thats not their official position as answered above.

LOL. Rubbish as usual, Hamas kills at a far better rate than the West with alot less weaponry and if israel didn't attack them they wouldn't be attacked at all.

Oh you want proof that children are natrually excluded from condemnation of people or people's actions? Look up the legal ages of responsibility across the western world. Or the laws on guardianship, consent and capacity.

Yes, jewish residents, clearly referring to the adults of the house who have taken the decisions he condemns.

Only if somehow the adults have not chosen to move the children there.

No DrewBedson, again ive got you. You try and try to wriggle but Im on to you. Im better at this, more informed and more humane than you. And alot more honest. Thats why I take your rubbish on every time.

The congressman refers to settlers, that being logically the adults who choose to be settlers. Thats right and fair to call those people the termintes and scum that they are. Innocents are not included. You have not and cannot show otherwise so Ive got you.

Hamas do not target all israelis, its not their official policy and they dont force anyone to stay on areas that become targets after their military units fire from them. You have not and cannot show otherwise so Ive got you. Again.

But please, bring it.....

 

What is to be liked of people who believe their god even justifies genocide to thieve the land of Canaan? Do also note they believe their Jew God massacred innocent Egyptian babies so the Jew could march to Canaan to commit genocide. And look at them Jews go even today, ethnic cleansing and oppressing to get as much of the land of Canaan as possible. No country on this planet approves their thieving colonizing campaigns. Says enough about these termites

 

Yes, religion approves of even genicide (the "flood" genocide, as well), so it needs to end.

 

I posted the words of Hamas themselves as well as the UN.

Nice try at changing the discussion. I never said anything about human wave attacks you did so go have a talk with yourself and be sure to build a big fat strawman.

NATO in Afghanistan 4:1 Hamas 5:1 Israel 1:1 and even dropped that down to as low as 1:30 and is regularly below 1:3 which makes them the lowest in the world continually while operating in a built up area.

Nice try but we are talking conflict not when things are quiet. When things are quiet the rates for everybody go down to 0:0. In conflict Israel recently kills one combatant for every civilian and far less in other conflicts, NATO kills four civilians for every combatant and Hamas kills four civilians for every Israeli combatant. Israel is by far taken more care to safeguard civilians in the history of warfare while operating in urban areas.

Gulf War huh? Strange, did the SS have a time machine when they used the term when they placed civilians to protect them while they attacked insurgents positions or the Japanese used civilians to shield them against US troops during WWII?

These human shields traveled to Iraq of their own free will so the term means anybody who is attempting to deter an attack by their presence.

Human Shield
""a person or group of people located or intentionally placed in a potential line of fire or in an area likely to be attacked. ""

Voluntary or forced a human shield is a person located to deter attack. Hamas uses them every day, twice on Sundays.

Yes, moving from one populated area to another in order to make maximum use of their human shields to set up and fire terrorist weapons. All one and a half million of their Human Shields.

I asked for examples where nations have actually fired from their populated areas and you post examples of where soldiers stay and then walk out of the next day to travel and then take up firing positions and then fire. You said ""Every nation in the world attacks from its areas where they live both open and closed. ""

Show us examples of a few nations that take up positions in their cities or populated areas and attack the enemy from there please.

I did read your article dated 2014, you obviously did not read my article dated 2015. And in the meantime Hamas is still officially regarded as a terrorist group by the EU;

""As a result of the appeal, Hamas will remain on the EU's terrorism list and its assets will remain frozen pending a judgment by the Court of Justice, the highest legal authority.""

Rockets fired at civilians are not defensive weapons rather are terrorist attacks, taking out terrorist launching sites is a legitimate military operation and target and is permissible under article 51.

Now to prove your point show us all where, in the UN Charter it states that firing missiles at all Israelis is a defensive action.

Which link stated that? And what about the other links stating Hamas uses human shields?


UN report outlines how Hamas used kids as human shields


Hamas Spokesman Urges Gazans to Act as Human Shields for Hamas Leaders

Hamas Admits to Using Civilians as Human Shields

Hamas used civilians as human shields during the 2014 Gaza war

Conclusive Proof that Hamas Uses Palestinians as Human Shields

Hamas Human Shields

It's their official policy for crying out loud. As for it being no longer relevant show us how this has changed and then show us where the leadership have all joined together to change it and then explain why it has yet to be changed as this is what Meshal says;

""“We are not giving up any inch of Palestine. It will remain Islamic and Arab for us and nobody else. Jihad and armed resistance is the only way,” Mashaal said, referring to holy war. “We cannot recognize Israel’s legitimacy.”

“From the sea to the river, from north to south, we will not give up any part of Palestine — it is our country, our right and our homeland,” said the Hamas chief. “We are all one,” he added, referring to Palestinians residing in the West Bank, the Gaza Strip and inside Israel. “We are all united in the way of resistance.”""

Seeing as how modern artillery can hit the same target within a meter over and over again from miles away I'd say that you are agreeing with me now.

Then why do they use area weapons fired at Israel and why do their leaders say they target all Israelis?

""Hamas: 'Every Israeli is now a legitimate target' ""

Nope. NATO in Afghanistan kills four civilians for every combatant whereas Hamas kills five civilians for every IDF.

I asked for proof and you come back with a question. Pony up with the proof to back your stuff with otherwise we can all surmise you don't have a clue as to what you are arguing about. And if you can find some proof show us where anything says that this is the rules the congressman was working with when he called all the "Jewish people" in the settlements - men, women, children "termites" otherwise we can just assume by "Jewish people" he meant ................

Jewish people.

So now you want to tell us that children are not people to you? That children are not permitted to be counted as human or allowed to be counted as a resident? And show us all where this is so so "clear" by providing a rule book and showing this is what he was working with. That would be "clear" but you have yet to produce anything of the sort so, we can go by his words which were "Jewish people" and "residents."

And while you are going to show us this rule book the congressman was using during this speech show us all which page of it he used to strike his comments of "Jewish people" to exclude all children from it.

Sure do. Links a year behind mine if you come up with any at all, telling us what a congressman is saying even though his words say the exact opposite, telling us that rockets are not accurate and then telling us they are just as accurate as artillery that can hit the same target over and over from thirty miles away till the cows come home, telling us that Hamas leaders rescinded their charter when in fact they publicly state the exact same vile crap in their public speeches and the creme de la creme is telling us that it's perfectly fine to hide behind a million and a half men women and children to set up terrorist weapons to target civilians with, telling us that Hamas killing five civilians to every combatant is a good thing while Israel only kills one civilian to every combatant, and then telling us all that other nations fire from the middle of their cities all the time yet can't produce one example much less a whole bunch of them as you say you have but you topped it all off when you gave your blessing for Hamas to use terrorism when you said;

""It's rocket attacks are merely proportional attacks using the weapons it has.""

Using this reasoning if Hamas didn't have rockets it would be perfectly fine if they snuck into Israel and slit the throats of four children just as long as the fifth person was a soldier I suppose.

I go by his antisemitic words rather than try to get inside the mind of a racist like he.

You mean the "Jewish people" that he referred to. I see where you might be coming from. Distance yourself or embrace him so your intent can be clarified please.

They are "Jewish people" and residents so are included. You have not shown where they are not and not finding anything wrong with using terrorism to kill four Israeli civilians for each Israeli soldier your motives are suspect at this point.

They say they do, their area weapons kill more civilians than military so yes they do.

Human shield means a person who protects a target by their presence and does not have to be forced or coerced as I showed from the above links and definition Secondly, since Gazans cannot leave that means they are forced to stay while Hamas fires from amongst them (as no other nation on earth does on a regular basis during war as Hamas does despite you saying different and not having one shred of proof to back this up with.)

Poof, bring proof. Dare to be the new you Creation, bring some proof to counter the twenty or so that I have provided for a change.

 

British Commander: IDF Most Moral Army World Has Ever Known

Col. Richard Kemp, the former commander of all British forces in Afghanistan, is in Israel this week to lend support to the military campaign in Gaza and to take on take on detractors who claim the Israeli army is perpetrating war crimes there.

“No other army in the world has ever done more than Israel is doing now to save the lives of innocent civilians in a combat zone,” Kemp said in an interview with Channel 2 News, adding that when world leaders demand Israel do more, “perhaps Israel should ask what more it can do.”

Having served in both Iraq and Afghanistan, Kemp is intimately familiar with exactly the kind of enemy Israel is facing, and the environment in which it is fighting.

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/Default.aspx?tabid=178&nid=24780

 

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com...terinsurgency-apologist-colonel-richard-kemp/

 

Those words do not include any admission of people being forced to stay in the line of fire or being held as hostages. So again youre wrong.

No changing needed, you wanted to brag about Israel not killing people despite being able to and I countered by praising Hamas for not sending people needlessly to their deaths in human wave attacks. Its the same discussion. And youre not the only one who decides where it goes.

Uh no. Thats not remotely fair, you clearly know nothing of offensive operations. I was in Afghanistan a few years ago fighting for the UK. ISAF is not controlling the local population in any sense. It is conducting support for the Afghan government against a highly mobile guerrilla force operating from a safe haven in Pakistan. Israel is beseiging an immobile population whose mass movements it completely controls. We have the very best in surveillance and weaponry. Hamas has none of these things. Theres little point in bragging about Israel here, its not the best army or the most moral, its simply in a different situation.

Thats when things are quiet.

In Israel's major conventional conflicts its record is no better than anyones.

LOL. The SS forced people to walk in front of them etc etc. As did the japanese. Hamas didnt force anyone, thus they are arent using human shields. Its clear that people may choose to stay in their homes, that doesnt mean that Hamas can be condemned for using human shields or forcing people to stay in their homes or holding people as hostages.

Here you go;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_shield

LOL.

LOL.

I just did. Israel. Its own history in the 1947-48 war is replete with firing from its own neighborhoods, launching attacks from there before moving out in large units across the countryside.

LOL. The decision was appealed, not overturned. Admit it.

Actually rocket attacks disrupt Israeli life enough to make them recognise that beseiging an entire population and denying it access to its own air and sea space is not without cost. I'll show where rocket attacks are allowed in the UN charter when you show me where collective punishment is allowed.

Its right there in the link you posted. No confirmation of any change in official Hamas policy from any Hamas leadership.

And the links? They dont show Human Shield, as in a policy of holding people against their will, is in use.

The IRA has never given up its claim to a seek a united Ireland. Doesnt mean it isnt at peace with its neighbours.

Its relevance has changed for decades since Israel left Gaza originally and Hamas offered Israel peace in line with a return to the 67 lines. Or when it actually held to a long standing ceasefire which Israel broke in 2008.

Theres no reason for Hamas under the current threat of mass assassination to change anything. Israel has consistently assassinated any leaders who's position it knows of.

LOL, no in fact thet rockets are alot worse than modern artillery at hitting targets because they rudimentary and made from scrap materials. So now youre agreeing with me.

Answered above.

Answered above.

Look up the legal ages of responsibility across the western world. Or the laws on guardianship, consent and capacity.

Look up the legal ages of responsibility across the western world. Or the laws on guardianship, consent and capacity.

Its simple, look up the legal ages of responsibility across the western world. Or the laws on guardianship, consent and capacity.

I keep saying that to you but you seem to have trouble with the concept, perhaps its blowing your mind.

LOL, this is why you fail against me every time - you dont even know what youre saying, completely misrepresent the points made when you lose your cool and ignore it when I provide examples right in the very text you are quoting from.

LOL, thats exactly what Israel did when it assassinated Rantissi. They bombed an apartment block. Why dont you ever pay attention to the details?

Youre simply trying to demonise his criticism of settlers. If he is a real racist he would have simply said Jewish people are termites.

Ill be clear as you say; all settlers, that being those considered adults who have taken their own decision to settle on occupied land are termites and the scum of the earth. The children of those people are innocents.

Without the capacity to make their own decisions the children are not included logically. The framework and discourse of our entire collective western civilisation confirm that every day. Ive shown that over and over in this thread and those prior. You refuse to counter that because you cannot.

Answered above, they do not say they do, and their weapons do not target anyone.

No a human shield, in the pejorative sense you use against Hamas, means a person who is held or coerced as is shown from both the definition and the history of the use of human shields. As Amnesty International is shown to confirm above.

Ive pointed you to the history of Israel itself, which you as usual ignore because you are unable to deal with.

Already done numerous times, thats why you ignore anything you dont like again and again. Please, bring it.

 

Polish and Russian Jews today are not the same people as the Jews who lived in Palestine two thousand years ago and have no moral right to live in the Occupied Territories.

 

I really and sincerely hope that today's Polish and Russian Jews are not 2000 years old. Creepy.

Jokes aside, I believe everyone should have the right to live anywhere, provided he/she/it respects the laws and customs of the place. Sadly, this can't be. At least yet.

I'm not sure what you mean by "not the same people as the Jews who lived in Palestine two thousand years ago". Not the same nation as in "Ashkenazi Jews are Khazars" theory, or not the same nation as in "American-born Italians are no longer vero Italians" theory.

Let's not get into scientific theories about genes or social constructs. Jews have always seen themselves as a nation, not as an ethnic group, not as a race - much like Americans, though not quite. We're bound by our Jewishness wherever and whenever we live, this is a fact non-Jews find very hard to understand, but it's a fact anyway. Polish and Russian Jews are as much Jews as those who lived on the territory of today's Iraq for 2500 years, as those who lived in China for centuries, as those who lived in Ethiopia, as the Jewish Berbers and the Lemba.

Do the Hashemite Bedouins from the Arabian Peninsula, who invaded most of Palestine in the '20 and again in 1948, have the moral right to live on occupied Palestinian territory?

Who decides what our moral rights should be, and on what grounds?

 

Richard Falk? That Richard Falk?

He has no credibility left.

Reality check: Hamas is digging tunnels into Israel to send people needlessly to their deaths in human wave attacks. They tried, and failed. They also tried to enter Israel by sea, and failed. They claim responsibility for almost every terrorist attack on Israelis. You need to stay tuned to realities on the ground.

They're not sending more people because they can't, not because they don't want to.

 

Let's stick to the arguments made rather than contesting who has credibility just yet. You guys want to trot out Richard Kemp who praises you repeatedly. I countered. That's all.

Tell Gilad Shalit that they failed to get him. Lol.

Hamas have a long history of successful attacks on the IDF. I'll grant you that it's costly. But it remains worthwhile as long as Israel only seeks their destruction. All people have a moral right to resist. You agree with that.

 

Good post. But all people having a right to live anywhere is immoral and wrong.

And the bedouin were nomadic people by nature. Where they finally stopped. All across the middle east is where they're morally allowed to live.

And no Jews may feel themselves a nation etc etc. But it doesn't mean that Polish Jews were the same people as those who lived in palestine a thousand years ago. They weren't. Aren't. Some of them may see themselves differently but no one can really know what goes on in the minds of humans so they could be just making it all up for the purpose of stealing land.

Moral rights are indeed a conundrum but generally it must be argued over what does the greatest good for the greatest number of people. On provable and practical grounds. Religious ethnic feelings etc etc are worth considering but no answer.