'Detransitioners' warn others against gender change

There are tons of stories emerging about this. Here are just three.

Here a complex issue was boiled down to fast-tracked transition, before Prisha fully had the time to grasp her subconscious and conscious identity. Life changing alterations were made at the hands of reckless doctors and vulnerable patients.

"By the time I was 17, I was being medicalized by a pediatrician with a high dose of testosterone. One year later, my healthy breasts were removed.
The appointment with my gender therapist was only 15 minutes long. When I walked in, my letter of recommendation was already typed up on her computer, and she was filling in my name in minutes. I had been seeing a regular therapist for several years for my mental disorders.
Even she said that all of my other conditions were caused by being born in the wrong body.
My parents were lied to and manipulated by the same therapists and by my doctors.
They were told to choose between a dead daughter and a living son."​

https://www.tiktok.com/@detransawarenessday/video/7208722920464534827

Detransitioners keep telling us that they could not consent. They were too young to understand what the impact of their decision would have. When will the medical community and lawmakers listen? Luka Hein

"At 16, the very first medical intervention I ever had was a double mastectomy.
A few months later I was then put on cross sex hormones.
I am now 21. I live with constant joint pain. To the point that is so bad that I have not been able to get out of class, out of bed, to go to class. Some days my vocal cords ache, my breasts are gone, and I will never know if I will be able to carry a child because there's a good possibility I'm sterile.
You call this care?
I could not consent to this due to both my age and my mental health conditions.
My parents were baited with the idea that I would commit suicide if this was not given to me. They were told, would you rather have a dead daughter or a living son?
These are not the words of a doctor. They are the words of a politically motivated activist.
Kids deserve a chance to grow up whole. They deserve a chance at life."​

https://www.tiktok.com/@detransawarenessday/video/7210979562455518510


'Mutilating children for profit.' California teen sues doctors over breast-removal surgery at 13 in Kaiser Permanente's 2nd blockbuster trans lawsuit

Layla Jane says her puberty blockers and hormones were a medical 'torment'
Kaiser Permanente doctors offered trans care after minutes-long consultations
Another California teen Chloe Cole last month sued the same hospital​

A California teenager has started to sue the doctors who at age 13 cut off her breasts in a medical gender change she now bitterly regrets. The 18-year-old, who is referred to as Layla Jane, says she should never have been put through the 'torment' of testosterone hormones at age 12 and puberty blockers and surgery the next year.

She is one of a growing number of detransitioners, as they are known, who come to regret their procedures and sue the doctors they accuse of pushing them into irreversible treatments instead of counselling.
"I don't think I should have been allowed to change my sex before I could legally consent to have sex. I don't think I'm better off for the experience, and I think transition just completely added fuel to the fire that was my pre-existing conditions."
According to legal papers, Layla experienced moodiness, anxiety, gender confusion and anger issues as a child. At age 11 learned about radical transgender ideology and went online to learn more about the new trend.
According to the suit, doctors at the Permanente Medical Group and Kaiser Foundation Hospitals rushed her on to cross-sex hormones and a double mastectomy without properly assessing her mental health problems. Her evaluations lasted only 30 minutes and 75 minutes, records show.
"These are decisions I will have to live with for the rest of my life," Layla said.
Layla speaks with a voice deeper than is usual for a young woman, which is understood to be the result of taking the male hormone testosterone for several years. She started to detransition at age 17.

'Mutilating children for profit.' California teen sues doctors over breast-removal surgery at 13 in Kaiser Permanente's 2nd blockbuster trans lawsuit | Sam's Alfresco Coffee (sammyboy.com)

These are children, and horrible mistakes were made. These children were not truly ready to make the decision that they made, and they're going to have to live with lifelong consequences as a result.

Mainstream media is of course not giving these types of stories much attention.

 

Yes. First they get told that they are "oppressors" but that they can become the virtuous oppressed if they cross sex identify, are love bombed when they do, and shunned when they detransition.

One state is considering a law that requires whoever was paid to transition them to provide detransition care for free. That should greatly improve the screening process that assures that a mature well-reasoned, life-time decision is being made.

 

Three stories of a medical case going wrong is NOT proof of anything other than it CAN go wrong.

Hospitals I know would not perform anything irreversible without there being significant counseling. Other options would be presented as preferable.

If you want to present an argument for mistakes being made, please:
- find actual studies that include significant numbers of those who got transition surgery and using randomized methodologies for selecting participants.

- include factors such as what type of institution did the work, how the decision was made, etc.

 

Yikes! I'm glad mommy didn't wish I had been born a little girl and had me operated on like that. I'd really miss my man parts in later life for sure.

 

Amen to that!!

Plus, that HAS happened for a LONG LONG time, as some babies come with genitals that aren't clearly one way or the other (as everybody in the world knows, right?).

So, the obvious(??) solution is for the doctor to start carving.

 

"My name is Prisha Mosley and I'm a 25-year-old woman and detransitioner. Since childhood, I have struggled with my mental health. As is the case for many girls, my teen years were particularly difficult. Tragically, at age 14, I suffered from a sexual assault. At age 15, I was hospitalized for depression. By age 16, I was diagnosed with major depressive disorder, obsessive-compulsive disorder, and an eating disorder. I engaged in self-harm by cutting myself, which became so serious that I was taken to the emergency room.​

Starting when I was 16 years old, and continuing into my teen and young adult years, doctors and counselors set me on a path of medicalized "gender transition". They told me that changing my body to look like a boy’s body would cure my mental health problems. They told me that injecting large amounts of testosterone into my female body would be good for me. They also encouraged me to undergo surgery to remove my healthy breasts.​

I trusted these health care providers to take care of me. Because of that relationship of trust, and my vulnerable condition, I believed what they said and I thought they were treating me properly.​

Years later, I realized that I had been lied to and misled in the worst possible way. Years of taking testosterone prevented my body from developing as it should have. It caused significant vaginal atrophy and the inability to have intercourse.​

My voice was permanently changed; I was no longer able to lift my voice and sing, which I used to love doing. I experienced severe pain in my shoulders, neck, and genital area. I do not know if I will be able to conceive and give birth to a child.
As a result of breast surgery, I have to live without my breasts and I am unable to nurse a child, should I be able to conceive one. I have pain in my chest where my breasts used to be.​

This "gender-affirming care" was anything but. Instead of addressing my severe mental health issues and helping me feel comfortable in my feminine body, my doctors and counselors pushed me into the belief that damaging my body was the answer. It was not the answer. Their "care" - in the form of testosterone injections and breast surgery - left me broken [...] It did not cure my mental health problems and instead made them worse.​

I also want troubled teenagers, who are looking for belonging and acceptance like I was, to know that you can be accepted for who you are. Trying to change your body won't fix you. It'll break you."​

I began 'gender transition' at 16. I was lied to in a terrible way. Now I am seeking justice , Fox News, July 20, 2023, Opinion by Prisha Mosley

 

Doctors sometimes **** up. Sometimes, they should be sued or even lose their licenses, but more often it's a part of continuous improvement of medical practices and even more often than that, there are simply risks for any surgery. While affirmation is the standard of care for trans, the stakes are indeed high getting it wrong. Use actual data if you want to challenge the standard of care, not anecdotes.

Also: Kaiser is an HMO. They LOSE money doing big surgeries. So the trans surgery was not based upon them trying to get more money.

 

California recently passed a law that prevents medical providers from being sued for providing gender change treatment to children.

(plenty of articles about this, look up "California Transgender Youth Sanctuary State")

 

You cited examples of California doctors being sued. Being sued BY the "trans" person who was not adequately evaluated should not be outlawed, if that's what you mean. But the sanctuary state law as described by articles does not do what you imply.

 

Why are they suing the people they chose to follow. We told them not to do it, and we gave them every reason in creation to support our plea. But they dismissed us as being hateful, bigoted, unconcerned, and out of touch. What gets me is that the wrongness of it is self evident, like jumping from a high place will kill you. But they do it anyway. Now they act like they've been misled and taken advantage of. Part of me feels sorry for them. But another part of me is angry with them.

 

The doctor didn't do anything he was not supposed to do. Isn't that correct?
Why would the doctor's license be taken away? If what he did was exactly what he was being paid to do, was what the patient said they wanted, and was legal to do.

The issue here is not the doctor making a mistake with that specific patient. That seems to be red herring coming from you.

Even if a "gatekeeper" does exist, some person who is in charge of trying to assess the child to determine whether a gender change is "appropriate" for that specific child, it is going to be very difficult to later prove that gatekeeper did not properly do their job, or hold that gatekeeper to account for the responsibility of what went wrong.

The doctor, the person who is actually providing the gender change treatment, is not going to be the one deciding if that treatment is psychologically appropriate for that child. Medical care simply does not work that way. Doctors are far too busy to sit down and have long discussions with their patients about their life and feelings, and do not have expertise to make psychological assessments. That responsibility is just simply not going to fall on the doctor.

 

I was speaking generally, not a specific judgement about a specific doctor. In these lawsuits, however, the allegation is that the doctors deviated from the standard of care by not adequately evaluating the patient to confirm they truly had gender dysphoria, rather than some other mental illness, and that this led to harm in the form of an unneeded gender affirming care that caused permanent damage. A successful medical lawsuit involves harm coming to a patient due to the doctor deviating from the standard of care (not just a bad outcome - there are always risks). Generally, the threshold to lose their license is a bit higher than being successfully sued once, but especially egregious breaches of the standard of care could lead to both at the same time.

 

You're not listening. That is NOT the doctor's responsibility or area of care.
You are being naive and unrealistic if you think it is.

So the question is, who exactly is or should be responsible?

The doctor didn't do anything "wrong" that they shouldn't have done in that specific situation. (Well, besides of course from providing transgender treatment to minors)

 

You're going to have to be more specific. I was responding to lawsuits from detransitioners. If the doctors followed the standard of care, the lawsuits ought to fail (but you never know with juries). If the doctors were acting upon false information from other doctors, it's those doctors who are truly liable.

Your issue is probably with the standard of care. The standard of care should be determined by evidence of harms and benefits, not politics, left or right.

 

Theoretically. But in reality it's not going to work that way. They are never going to hold one expert entirely accountable and responsible for the medical treatment that another doctor provided.
As I said, it is very difficult to later prove that the gatekeeper did not properly do their job.

 

Instead of trying to teach that its OK to be a feminine dude or a masculine woman, they are teaching they are instead in the WRONG body. Why? because money! The kid then eats the hype, gets diagnosed in ONE sit down with gender dysphoria, gets hormones and then goes under the knife (BIG MONEY IN THIS). What does the left do? BLAME IT ON THE PARENTS! Why did the parents consent? Because the DOCTORS tell them you can have a dead cis kid or a living trans one.
SICK SICK SICK !!!!!!!!!!

 

Well, that and once the kid transitions it's pretty much almost guaranteed that you'll have a Democrat voter.

Isn't it interesting that the number of young adults identifying as "trans" has actually now exceeded the number who identify as gay?

 

thread with another story:
Another HORRIFYING detransition story of mutilated 15 year old

"Penny was just 11 years old when she decided that people online were right -- that she was 'transgender.' At 13, she was prescribed hormone blockers, and by 15, she’d had a double mastectomy. Now, at 16, she’s raising money on gofundme for a breast reconstruction."

"Very shortly after surgery, my depression got worse. I hated myself just as much as ever, leading me to a psychiatric hospitalization in October 2019."

"From the very start, people online told me that if I was uncomfortable with my body, I was probably trans."
​

Double Mastectomy at 15, Detrans 16-Year-Old Now Seeks Reversal, The Velvet Chronicle, Julia Diana Robertson

 

related thread: Canadian transgender demands free assisted suicide because surgery went wrong (posted by kazenatsu in Current Events section, August 17, 2023)

"So I just got diagnosed with vaginal stenosis (silly fake womanly laugh but in deeper voice). Hi, I'm Zaya, I'm transgender, and like 8 months ago I got bottom surgery, or gender confirmation surgery. So I had a peepee and now I have a vagina. and let me just preface this by saying I do not regret getting surgery. I do not regret it. So I don't want any of y'all conservative a** b***** to twist my words. I do not f***ing regret surgery. (now beginning to emotionally break down, almost crying) However, I knew recovery was going to be hard. But nobody tells you that it could be this f***ing hard. But yeah, I was diagnosed with vaginal stenosis, and if you don't know what that is, it's basically when scar tissue gets built up inside of the vaginal canal, to the point where it's extremely tight and uncomfortable. and the thing is for the first year after getting the bottom surgeryyou have to dilate you vagina religiously because it's a brand new canal. And now that I have this stenosis I physically cannot dilate (beginning to breakdown, almost crying) ... which means that I have to get another surgery. I basically just have to get the surgery all over again (crying), and get my vagina replaced. ... No one would choose this."
TikTok, zayaperysian Zaya 2022-11-25 "I am so mentally drained"

 

it's not a medical case going wrong it's abuse. Lying to kids and telling them that they can change their sex or change their secondary sexual characteristics enough to fool people into believing they're the opposite sex is immoral to the extreme.

And I'm starting to wonder if it's just a scam to have lifelong committed patients.

that is an assumption you're making.

The burden of proof is on you to show that I don't care if you just claim it. That's not even an argument.

that's not his burden. You have to prove success rate and no one or two Cherry picked studies is not going to be enough.

The position is first Do no harm that's the starting point. If you're giving children castration drugs which is what puberty blockers are for people who don't have precocious puberty, you are necessarily doing harm you must prove that you're not that is your burden.

No that's not how it works people don't have to prove things you'll believe wrong you have to prove them correct.

We've gone through 150,000 years of evolution prior to what about the 1970s without needing to castrate children so why all the sudden do we need to?

 

Teen girl who underwent de-transitioning after transgender surgery claims, "I feel mutilated and like an experiment gone wrong"

A teen girl from the UK who underwent transgender surgery partly called out the gender clinic and shared that transitioning made her feel worse at every phase.

Jasmine, the teen who had her breasts removed and later regretted her decision, so she de-transitioned, said, "I don’t really know what it’s like to have the body of an adult." She continued, “When people do know I'm de-transitioned, they reframe it as a journey, and I would not consider it a journey… I think it was a mistake I made, but because I was a child, I also think that part of the onus is on the various professionals that treated me."

Jasmine said, "I feel a little bit mutilated and like an experiment gone wrong walking through society sometimes. I feel, like, sometimes jealous of other people, women, who are biologically female. That they still have their natural voice, their natural characteristics. And I don’t anymore."

Keira Bell, also a patient at Tavistock Clinic, shared in a blog post, "By the time I got to the Tavistock, I was adamant that I needed to transition. It was the kind of brash assertion that’s typical of teenagers. What was really going on was that I was a girl insecure in my body who had experienced parental abandonment, felt alienated from my peers, suffered from anxiety and depression, and struggled with my sexual orientation. After a series of superficial conversations with social workers, I was put on puberty blockers at age 16. A year later, I was receiving testosterone shots. When 20, I had a double mastectomy. But the further my transition went, the more I realized I wasn't a man and never would be."

"As I matured, I recognized that gender dysphoria was a symptom of my overall misery, not its cause." Due to hormonal treatment with testosterone, she felt unable to cry, so she shared, "One of the first signs that I was becoming Keira again was that -- thankfully, at last -- I was able to cry. And I had a lot to cry about."

The woman still does not know if she will be able to have children due to all the surgeries. "Before beginning on testosterone, I was asked if I wanted children or if I wanted to consider freezing my eggs because of the possibility that transition would make me infertile. As a teenager, I couldn’t imagine having kids… "
Bell now sees things clearly, and says, "As a young adult, I see that I didn’t truly understand back then the implications of infertility. Having children is a basic right, and I don’t know if that has been taken from me." The hormonal treatment left her with facial hair and a deeper voice, and she warned, "What happened to me is happening across the Western world."

 

Tragic. But how many are successful?

 

so the means justify the ends? what about non trans rights?

 

And one is Chloe Fole who is making a very very lucrative living off of stirring up outrage

 

The idea that because we only have three examples of the flaw in this treatment that the treatment is good is a logical fallacy. the idea that someone gets notoriety for telling their story doesn't discount their story.

Wanting to ignore issues because it goes against narrative is dishonest. If you believe in this treatment is useful or even vital for people and you care about these people you would want it applied properly and wouldn't attempt to disparage people who received it without need. you would advocate making sure the people seeking it need it.

the fact that people don't do that indicates their only interest is political.