F-22 (Raptor) attacked a Russian attack aircrafts Su-25

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by st256, Dec 17, 2017.

  1. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    I'm not interested in your link. I didn't bother with it. If it satisfies you, then it satisfies you.

    I claim the Irish people voted in a referendum not to join the EU.
    Historical fact.

    My country is a NATO member.
    When we were invaded in 1982, NATO members chose not to enact the NATO treaty. They decided it did not apply.
    We could have decided the same thing after 9/11 had we have so chosen. But instead of choosing to uphold the letter of the treaty, we chose to uphold the spirit of it.
    Despite countless terrorist attacks on our own soil, no NATO member has ever offered to enact this treaty in our defence. I simply have no expectation of any NATO member coming to my countries defence. Only the other way round.
    A truly pointless mutual defence pact.

    The Greeks have defaulted on their debts. I expect them to continue doing so.

    I speak for myself.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2017
  2. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    "Don't confuse me with the facts!" you say. It seems to be a pattern with you--make outrageous false claims and then ignore the facts when they're pointed out to you.
    They voted against a new EU treaty, not against joining the EU.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/jun/13/ireland

    Your claim they want out of the EU is a lie.
    The Falkland Islands? Read Articles 5 and 6. Besides, Thatcher wanted to go it alone.
    Can you identify a country harboring the terrorists attacking your country?
    Then quit. You'll become even less important than you are already.
     
  3. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Important to who?

    And this is the key to it really, if you dream of ruling the world....
    Of self importance and global importance, I an no ally of yours. I am your enemy.
     
  4. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

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    The USSR tried to implant soviet system in Afghanistan. You tried to implant liberal democracy. But Ussr didn't interfere with American attempts.
     
  5. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

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    The Afghanistan state?! How did they attack the USA?
     
  6. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    So what?
     
  7. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    They had their chance to deal with the terrorists who were training in their country.
     
  8. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

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    If you say that the USSR performed an aggression in Afghanistan and not Afghanistan made an aggression against it then you also need to regard the actions of the USA as an aggression. Not as a strike back. Otherwise you just use the double standards, when you are just smart and lucky commiting the same as others are doing brutally and aggressively. :)
     
  9. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

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    1. The money came from Saudi Arabia. At least this is what is said now. Saudi Arabia is not Afghanistan.
    2. The training camps of jihadists were organized and financed by the USA government against the activities of the USSR Red Army. These guys were not formed by the will of Afghanistan. They were made by the USA. So logically if the adequate answer for the terrorist attack was bombing the people who stood behind the terrorists the strike should have happened over Pentagon, White House and someresidencies of former officials somewhere in Santa-Barabara. But not the Afghanistan.
     
  10. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

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    Would you care to show me where I said Russia is less corrupt than the EU?

    Thought not.

    While you're formulating a deflective response, you might consider providing that evidence I asked for proving that Putin is a kleptomaniac. For all I know he may well be - probably is no different to most politicians who surreptitiously trouser other people's money. But it's evidence that counts. Not your word saying so.

    Be my guest. Go ahead and break a leg.
     
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  11. st256

    st256 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, wasn't it an aggression?
     
  12. Yazverg

    Yazverg Well-Known Member

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    I think it was. Despite the fact that I would always support a preventive act of an aggression against ISIS-like formations, I need to say that it is nevertheless an aggression.
    I also regard Soviet-Finland (winter) war as an aggression from the side of the USSR. Though I understand that Stalin did everything possible diplomatic moves to prevent the war and I do understand the necessity of it for the USSR. Leningrad was second (at least and in some parameters the first) industrial center of the USSR. Its location was too vulnerable and the USSR's vital interest was to either have a treaty with Finland or to move the border somehow into the territory of Finland. But anyway no matter the situation it was the USSR which started an aggressive war.
    Unfortunately I don't see the same attitude from the USA mainstream propaganda.
     
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  13. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    I have no comment about the Soviet Union in Afghanistan. The Taliban Afghan government in 2001 protected the terrorists who attacked the WTC.
     
  14. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    The terrorists themselves were based in Afghanistan. America demanded Afghanistan stop being a safe base for terrorists attacking the United States. The Taliban refused and the U.S. took them out.
     
  15. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    You started it with a stupid challenge to prove the Russian kleptocracy is more corrupt than the EU. I never claimed you said "Russia is less corrupt than the EU."
    Why am I not surprised?
    I said Russia is a kleptocracy, not that Putin is a kleptomaniac.
     
  16. st256

    st256 Well-Known Member

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    Like the USA is.
     
  17. Striped Horse

    Striped Horse Well-Known Member

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    Can't be arsed with you, frankly.
     
  18. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  19. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    They gave safe haven to the people who attacked the WTC.
     
  20. Richfaceboy

    Richfaceboy Active Member

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    Russia is punching way above its weight. Turkey shot down 1 of their planes and Russians responded with a statement. Russia is only formidable in one military sphere alone "Nuclear Weapons" conventionally they are no match for the US air superiority.
     
  21. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Serbia was.

    Russia could easily be.
    To my mind it hinges on their SAMs.
     
  22. 22catch

    22catch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And the Saudis not only financed it, they created then kept kenneled their rabid militant attack dogs for decades. Releasing them when needed. They got loose and then the WTC attack. In the below article written by the highest ranking Muslim US diplomat I know of ever.. in a respected liberal leaning news source Politico.. They admit it to him.

    Your assessment is over simplified in its explanation of US reasoning for invading Afghanistan as having any merit whatsoever. Particularly with its high cost of American lives and our trillions of tax dollars

    If we invaded Afghanistan for allowing militants on their soil then why havnt we cut off all ties with Saudi Arabia, seized all of their assets here in the US and paid for one of these stupid wars? 3/4 of the WTC bombers were Saudi, Saudi admits to the creation, funding and using of terrorists as weapons... We ourselves fund/ed and use the same headchoppers in Iraq, Libya, and Syria using the Sauds as our liason and vetter. This is proven. There's enough selfies of John McCain and Hillary taken with ISIS and Al Qaeda to fill a scrapbook. Brave freedom fighters they call them. We use these groups ourselves to this day.

    So. Tone it down a tad. Drink less of the Kool aid your poured.

    https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/saudi-arabia-terrorism-funding-214241
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2017
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  23. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Saudi and Germany complied fully with American demands for investigation and the hand over of any suspects.
    Afghanistan refused.

    A scapegoat was needed, Afghanistan volunteered.

     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2017
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  24. Montecresto

    Montecresto Banned

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    Well, with regards to Syria, the Russians and the Iranians are the only ones invited and are not in violation of IL.
     
  25. zoom_copter66

    zoom_copter66 Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm, were they invited into Crimea...LDPR east Ukraine? Georgia?
     

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