Can anyone point me towards useful articles on what happened during the war. I have read quite a bit about it so and have come to the conclusion that everyone committed horrible crimes but the most were committed by Serbians. I have friends from Bosnia, Croatia and Serbia and all have different stories. Saying that though it seems to be only my Serbian friends that still have a strong hatred for the others while the others don't have a strong hatred towards Serbians. Why is it that only the Serbians still harbour resentment. Also I have another question why is it that Bosnians are called Muslim Bosnians? Why aren't Serbians called Orthodox Serbs or Catholic Croats? Why does religion matter when they are Islamic but not that other people have religions as well? Your help with any relevant NON BIAS articles to further research what happened would be greatly appreciated.
Frankly, this is a very complex issue. We are Russians supports the Serbs, but try do not meddle in those conflicts, because we know the complexity of issue. I think the whole reason of hate between Serbs and Albanians , is Kosovo. But by and large Kosovo is a fact of stupidity of United Nation . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo_independence_precedent
Bosnian is used for all people who live in Bosnia, Bosniaks, Serbs and Croats. Muslim Bosnians are Islamised Slavs today called Bosniaks. In former Yugoslavia they were referred only as Muslims (Muslim by nationality) because of language, culture and origin being mostly the same with rest of Bosnia Slavs. Religion was the only major difference . That's kinda very hard, everyone had and still have some interests in the region, the West , the Russia ..and the most of others are influenced by western mass media . The truth is somewhere in the middle. I think you should check The Weight of Chains, its well made documentary and i'm not claiming its fully not bias, such a thing doesn't exits in reality. But at least you could see things from another point of view, and not usual western views of former Yugoslavia. [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Qi50Mun4RA"]Weight of Chains | NEW TRAILER - YouTube[/ame] That depends from where your friends are, here in Serbia the most of people didn't feel a real war. So people here tender to be less radicalized by the war. But we do have a still lot of refugees from Bosnia, Croatia, Kosovo.300.000-400.000 the most of all former republics. And most of them have family in Serbia .
The issue indeed is a complex one and war crimes were committed by all sides. As for the term Bosniaks, the term was historically used to refer to all the people living on the territory of Bosnia and Herzegovina (or Bosnians), but has in the last 20 years been largely used for just the Muslim people living in that region. It was used during the war in former Yugoslavia so as to avoid calling them simply Muslims. It would be wrong to call all Croats catholic or all Serbs othodox since their ethnicity does not have any relation to their religion, so it is worth noting that Bosniaks are not just Muslims, there are Bosniaks of all religions. It can be confusing since the war itself was closely identified as a conflict between the three main religions in Bosnia and Herzegovina. We could say that the term Bosniaks can be refered to any person who considers Bosnia and Herzegovina to be their ethnic country. Bosniaks have their own diaspora living both in the neighbouring countries and abroad.
I must mark that there is no "former Yugoslavia" as there is no "the former Soviet Union".Think,if your grandma is dead you would not call her "my former grandma".
THE REPUBLIC OF SERBIAN KRAJINA - GOVERNMENT IN EXILE 11.080 Земун, Магистратски трг 3 - Тел: 3077-028, vladarsk@gmail.com Бр. 1438/12 01. 02. 2012. The Government of the Republic of Serbian Krajina points out that the execution of anti-Serb colonial policies is supported with many documents, historic books and other evidence. Therefore, it is very odd that the EU has been disregarding this all and supporting Croatia, especially supporting the Croatian genocidal crimes against the Republic of Serbian Krajina between 1990 and 1995. This is supported by the fact that the EU and Vatican continue that same anti-Serb policy, as executed by the Vatican and Austria in the past. A file from a book (from 175 of an Austrian writer and reporter, Johan Heinrich Schviker, gives a good explanation of the nature of these crimes against the Serbs. The book is titled as the history of the catholization of the Serbs in Krajina. It points out that Austria forced the local Serbs to assimilate into the Croatian nation, by catholizing them and murdering and prosecuting the Serbian Orthodox priests. In this case, it concerns Serbs near Zagreb of the place Zumberk. At that point, 17 Serbian Orthodox priests served in the community, today Serbs do not live there. Bishop Jaksic testified about the destiny of these Serbian Orthodox priests. The Serbian priests from the community had been expelled and even prosecuted, which was ordered by colonel Johan Pencinger in 1750. That occurred when Serbian priest Teodor Pruscevic was very ill. Furthermore, the mentioned file from the book describes how Austrian authorities replaced Serbian Orthodox priests with Serbian priests who were loyal to the Vatican. In addition, the Serbian priests who were not loyal to the Vatican were prosecuted, tortured and murdered by Austrian (German) authorities. When Serbian priest from Zumberk, Teodor Pruscevic, passed away, a pro-Vatican priest was brought into his position by the local Austrian (German) military authority. That new priest demanded from the other members of the Serbian Orthodox church of Zumberg , to accept the authority of the Vatican. A Serbian priest named Janko Pruscevic refused to participate in that. Following, Janko Pruscevic had been imprisoned, tortured and killed by the Austrian military authorities. The Government of RS Krajina states that such behavior of a German country (Austria) against the Serbs and their church should be discussed within the EU. However, the EU and NATO nations are today obligated to reserve the consequences of the colonial policies by German countries against the Serbs and their territories. The ethnic cleansing of 800.000 Serbs in the Krajina region and Croatia between 1990 and 1995 en the seizing of their private property, are consequences of these anti-Serb colonial measures by Austria (a German country). The RS Krajina Government reminds that the descendants of the Serbian inhabitants of Zumberk from the 18th century, are today members of the Croatian nation. Only a very small part of them, has the courage to admit that they belong to the Serbian nation. The Republic of Serbian Krajina Government in Exile
I have an interesting question. How does serbia krajina have any historical ties with serbia proper? Give me some dates? Did a serbian king from serbia proper rule serbia krajina? Was there a serbia krajina in 10 AD?
I do sympathize with the serb victims of this massacre. How does a political krajina establish itself?
Krajina was in the middle ages an integral part of tsarist Serbia, ruled by Serbian tsar Dusan Nemanjic. The European maps of Dusan's Serbia before the Berlin's congress of 1887 include Bosnia & Herzegovina and Krajina. http://0.tqn.com/d/historymedren/1/0/C/9/eurse1354b.gif Since the Berlin congress, the Serbian history has been adopted/ falsified: the original map of tsarist Serbia has been reduced. The purpose of that was to justify the decentralization of Serbia into smaller states, but also to protect Austro-Hungary's territorial integrity which occupied Serbian territories at that time. In addition, On the Krajina territories, the Serbs were state-building nation in medieval Serbia, in Hungary since 1471, in Austria in 1630, in Venice in 1627 and in Yugoslavia in 1918. However, the Croatian parliament eliminated the Serbian constituent rights in 1990 and reduced them to a national minority. Following that, the Croatian army and police started to expel the Krajina Serbs from their lands, dynamiting their homes, conducting crimes amongst them, etc. The autochthony of the Serbs in Krajina has been proved through archeological research. In Dalmatia, Lika and Bosnian Krajina Serbian tombs from the fourth century AD have been found. In that way the hypothesis of the Serbian arrival to the Balkan Peninsula only in the sixth or seventh centuries AD has been denied. The Serbs in Krajina and Croatia are mentioned in old European documents. A chronicler of the Frankish emperor refers to them in Einhard's Chronicles for the years 818 and 822 AD. Two thirds of the Dalmatian sea-shore were part of medieval Serbia and of Serbian Bosnia. After the Turkish conquest of the Balkans the Krajina Serbs in Austria organized their own organs of local government–and in 1630 they were given the Serbian Constitution (Statuta Valachorum) by the Austrian emperor. The Serbs had local government and even municipality courts as well as the Supreme Court. In return, they defended the Austrian border against the Turks. Austrian emperor Leopold II gives testimony about the Serbian Krajina, writing in 1790: "As for myself, I maintain that the Serbian people lived in Srem, Slavonia and Bačka even before the war with the Turks, and during the war decidedly took part in the recapture of the same regions, still living there, and this is why the Serbs most rightly claim the possession of these lands".
1) I can understand Serbian Krajina in the late 1700s and into the 1800s. I cannot accept your credibility of serbian tombs found in 4th AD when slavic speaking migrations happened around the 6th and 7th AD. I see contradiction. ( In this sense, you are sounding more like your albanian counterparts with their illyrian arguments. ) 2) You also dismissed one important event that divided all of the empire builders whether its the byzantines, serbs or bulgarians. You forgot the schism of 1054 which basically was the medieval iron curtain that divided the roman catholics and the christian orthodox in trade. So serbian dalmatia would never have existed because of this schism. Venice basically destroyed constantinople in the 4th crusade for economic power and likewise they wouldn't want to have any competition from the serbs. Get it?????? Dalmatia was under Venice for 800 years and later parts of it had been under the Ottoman Empire. By the way, the merchant venetian jews had been under power between both sides..Just a side note
I understand. But I do not think that one should rely too much on official history. I do not believe in Slavic migrations in the 7th century, since Slavs (Serbs) are natives of Europe and have lived there even before the so called Slavic migrations. I believe that that is a historic falsification. I also heard from some sources that the word Illyrian used to be the synonym for Serbs. The Albanian identify them selves with Illyrians to prove their autochtonity in Kosovo, but the Albanians were brought to Kosovo by the Turkish occupaying forces and the term Illyrian represents the native of the Balkans which are Serbs. The official history neglects this, but I do believe that the official history was falsified to a certain extent. These falsifications have been used to justify the expulsion of the Serbs from Krajina and Kosovo and the creation of new states on Serbian historic soil. Hence, false history has been used as a tool to justify genocidal acts. The schism divided the Serbian territories into two church administration territories. On the aministrative territories which belong to the Vatican, the Vatican tried to catholize the Serbs as much as possible. After the fall of the Serbian tsarist Empire, Dalmatia was occupied by Venice and later by Hungary and Austria. As said before, the official history neglects that tsarist Serbia did not rule with Dalmatia, which is a falsification. Tsarist Serbia had acces to the Dalmatian coast. Even the allies in WW2 offered the Serbs regain the Dalmatian territories that belonged to the Serbian tsar Dusan Nemanjic. Old European maps of Tsarist Serbia include also Dalmatia and Bosnia and Herzegovina.
1. Yes I agree serbs are indigenous to the european continent as the croats and bosnians. They already have genetics done on the population and proved them to be the oldest group of people that migrated from the middle east almost 45000 years just after the ice age confronting the neanderthals.. you could say they would be the direct descendants of cro magnon man like several other ethnic european nations. Technically speaking they are a subgroup of an older group that came to Europe before written history. 2. Allies never helped serbs gain dalmatian territory. Fascist Italians bent on exterminating roman catholic croatians from dalmatia allied with Serbs using them as their henchmen to ethnically cleanse croats on concentration camps located in Rab and some other places... The irony in this story would be a fellow roman catholic exterminating another roman catholic using their opponents THE ORTHODOX CHRISTIAN SERB? Mussollini Fascist Italian troops were not allies of the US or Britian. As a matter of fact, there were internment camps in the US held for some Italian Americans living in the US. just a note. TZarist serbs never had dalmatian territory. They invaded montenegro that had once had connections with Croatians. As I explained the schism of 1054 divided the 2 christians apart economically and the serbs took montenegro and not dalmatia. Croatian and Serb rivalry occured when montenergo had been taken by the serbian czars.. ONE OTHER QUESTION? What about the Bogomil? What about the Bulgarian takeover of Beograd preceding Czar Dusan? Does any of those have any relevance to serbian history?
No, you do not understand. But it seems being a serb is a synonym for lie. serbs were a nomadic tribe, who made a long journey, coming and occupying land of Illyrian tribes. By settling there, they(serbs) ashamed from their nomadic and invader past, set the goal that their intelligence elite should project myths and lies in order of proving their "Illyric" nature. since the day, serbs set they foot in Balkans, the region never knew any peaceful period. Your barbaric nature could not accommodate and behave civilized. It is written in all the books worldwide, that your nation is NOMADIC and did harmed neighbors constantly. Which sources ? "srpska liar mreza", maybe ?!? Albanians are Illyrians, that was proved by the majority of the historic books written by international authors. Nothing terrifies more your genocidal nation, than that of Illyrian origin of Albanians. That shadow will hunt you as long as the mankind exists. It will remind you, that serbs are nothing more than a nomadic nation whose destiny is Beligradski Pashaluk. Stop spreading lies. Croats did perfect job by expelling those criminals from their land. We, Albanians in Kosovo should take that model ("Oluja") of solving the serbian genocidal problm, once for all !
Your sheet of text of your answers are always depressed , that's make me think that your profession is dumper for crap
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I complained so much about your insulting posts from the past. Why don't you leave us alone to debate? Please don't join this thread. Everyone is going to neglect you. Ok. ????? And please get over your homophobia?????
Davinci is a troll. I have complained so much about her flamebaits, news spams, and obsession of hatred with serbs. It seems like anyone against serbs are her friends. NOT!!!!!! Mona Lisa's logic just has irrational tendecies.. By the way, Mona Lisa is a girl . Because she called Frozy "Sweetie" ? Or not?
buddy, stick to this: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzV9D_ziaJg&feature=related"]Pokemon Sezona 1 - YouTube[/ame]
THE REPUBLIC OF SERBIAN KRAJINA GOVERNMENT IN EXILE 11.080 Земун, Магистратски трг 3 Тел. 3077-028, vladarsk@gmail.com, Бр. 1446/12 27. II 2012. The Government of the Republic of Serbian Krajina in exile is honored to welcome the diplomatic consular representatives of Serbia and to remind them that Western Europe and the US are spreading untruths about the Serbs and their territories, such as that the Serbs perpetrated genocidal crimes against Bosnian muslims in Srebrenica. The Government of RS Krajina points out that an ethical woman from the US, Stela Jatras, wrote a book entitled as Srebrenica Code World to Silence Critics of US Policy in the Balkans, where she wrote that the US broke up Yugoslavia in violation with the international law, USs constitution and NATO-agreements. In her books she explains the role of the US in the collapse of Yugoslavia as well as the untruths by the American media, which characterize the Serbs as a genocidal nation. She wrote as follows: How come that after the five year long attempt to portray the victims of a civil war (which was less bloody than many others in the world) as an accusation of genocide and holocaust, the Srebrenica case is again reopened? This is because it is an attempt to intimidate the so called revisionists who would raise the USs ineffective policy towards the Balkans, a policy which relies on lies and war crimes in Bosnia and Herzegovina and Kosovo, which is in violation with the international law, NATO-agreement and USs constitution. The Government of the RS Krajina convinces that the EU, US and NATO will have to admit their dishonorable role in the collapse of Yugoslavia which resulted into civil wars and war crimes. In 1995, the West helped Croatia to occupy the Republic of Serbian Krajina, an UN protected area, and expel 80% of the Krajina Serb population from that region. Their private property has been seized by Croatia and their civil rights have been violated. The government of the Republic of Serbian Krajina is taking advantage of this opportunity to show its high respect towards the diplomatic consular representations of the Republic of Serbia. Diplomatic consular representatives Belgrade *** (The Government and the Parliament of the Republic of Serbian Krajina send, along with this announcement, also a rebuke to Serbias media, because since 2005 in Serbia the articles of the government of the Republic of Serbian Krajina have been censored. That is a serious violation of the national and states interests and the journalistic codex)
you still forgot about milan martic that launched missiles from krajina into zagreb civilian zones????? does that ring a bell? And krajina never existed during the yugoslav regime only after the war when croatia declared independence....under martic... there never was a serb krajina leadership... only made up over exaggerated serbian viewpoints of history. If you go this far, there are croatian descented village south of beograd that speak the zagreb dialect.. we can go that far to make little croatia south of beograd.
1. Self declared RS Krajina belonged to the territory of the Republic of Croatia partially, therefore there was nothing to be seized by Republic of Croatia from self declared, accepted by 0 countries "country" or republic. 2. Expel or exodus of Serb population from that area in 1995, is something else that is supposed to be regarded in terms of human rights by existing countries, having Krajina as a part of their territory. 3. what is the exactly considered under a 'national and states interests' of Serbia related to the articles mentioned above?
1. Self declared RS Krajina belonged to the territory of the Republic of Croatia partially, therefore there was nothing to be seized by Republic of Croatia from self declared, accepted by 0 countries "country" or republic. 2. Expel or exodus of Serb population from that area in 1995, is something else that is supposed to be regarded in terms of human rights by existing countries, having Krajina as a part of their territory. 3. what is the exactly considered under a 'national and states interests' of Serbia related to the articles mentioned above?
I don't recall any war before 92' which recorded a longest siege of a capital during the aggression on UN recognized Independent state in a history of modern warfare, by - not including slaughtering civilians in their homes whereas one of the most famous neighborhoods was Grbavica. Prosecution Opening Statement, ICTY vs Stanislav Galić, 2003 Anyways, referring to Srebrenica massacre, it is referred to as worst mass murder after the WW2 on European soil not the world literally. Again, even if it is being misused in terms of accreditation of crime commonly known as generalization i.e accrediting it to entire ethnic group, the people who committed those crimes are being even today openly supported by the vast majority of that group despite the existing video and recording material against them-which gave a space to others to misuse it and use the name of the entire group in that particular context.
Hey why do you need to particiapte in a serb-croatian debate? Its not your business to put your bosnian flag in this debate.
