Is Bernie right on most counts?

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by yangforward, May 6, 2024.

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Which issues is Bernie right about?

  1. War

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  2. Student loans

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  3. Immigration

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  4. Israel

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  5. China

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  6. Russia

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  7. Ukraine

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  8. Wrong on everything

    5 vote(s)
    50.0%
  9. Other response

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Bernie opposed the Iraq War which cost a few trillion dollars.

    More in fact than the entire student debt, just to put it into
    perspective, not to make any recommendations.

    Bernie condemned Hamas for killing Israelis but Israel more
    strongly for killing huge numbers of Palestinians most of which
    are women and children and do not match the descriptions of
    the Hamas forces.

    Using a traditional definition of the 'Left' as favoring improved
    conditions for the poor, this country is now under Biden moving
    to the right in that sense, of rising rents and house prices,
    and declining prospects for being able to earn enough money
    to survive.

    Using the new definitions of the Left as favoring defunding the
    police and flooding the country with immigrants, I would be
    interested to hear his stance and reasoning.
     
  2. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here he is explaining a few points:

     
  3. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Defunding the police is not a position held by a significant number of people, even on the left. There was a year or two when it was more popular, but I would never have called it mainstream left. Flooding the country with immigrants? Also a mischaracterization of the left. It's more a lack of (or at least reduced compared to the right) concern about numbers of immigrants, and rather concern about the welfare of them as people.

    But yes, Bernie is more of a true leftist than Biden. I think I agree with most of his ideas, but they're not all presented here, even the ones on the poll.
     
  4. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    Bernie is old Marxist. Marxists can think only in terms of their ideology. Therefore they are wrong about 90% of the time because for them every evil in the world is caused by capitalism. This is true of Bernie except when he is acquiring more houses and personal wealth. Then he is a capitalist.
     
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  5. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Leave it to conservatives to exaggerate how far left any leftist is. But he's definitely to the left of other mainstream American politicians and is more like a European politician - most of which are to the left of America, but not fully socialist. He wants to reform capitalism, and regulate it, not discard it.
     
  6. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    His “reforms” will gut capitalism. You end up in the same place.
     
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  7. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

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    Funny how such 'reform' will always move left.
     
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  8. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Traditionally, the right wants minimal regulation and therefore reforms. Corporations self-police. There has been some anti-globalism injected in lately, though.
     
  9. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    I have not had any contacts with true Marxist believers lately, but their usual analysis starts with, “The problem is capitalism … “ From then on it’s all boilerplate.
     
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  10. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I have never heard Bernie say something that made any sense to me. So none.
     
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  11. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Bernie is the only one who puts the US population on a higher priority
    than starting wars.

    Every time the neocons are in charge we end up with more wars than
    we can fight.

    With G W Bush it was, since we were near wining in Afghanistan, more
    the forces to Iraq and then start a war there.

    The Biden Administration, and their contacts in the CIA and State Department
    thought Russia wouldn't dare interfere in our shells we supplied to Kyiv for
    bombarding Donetsk, and if they did we'd get them out within 45 days. It's been
    over 700 days now.

    I don't think we're ever going to get Donetsk flattened at this rate, and we want
    to go get China and Iran as well.
     
  12. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm not fond of the left but I was even less happy many years ago to
    receive a draft card.
     
  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Bernie was right, or partially right about many national foreign policy issues.

    There were also other issues he was kind of off about.

    Libertarian Ron Paul also opposed the Iraq war, so this wasn't only just coming from the far Left.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2024
  14. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Many stories have been written about the future, some Utopian, some dystopian, some
    very scary but I can't remember any as stupid as the situation we are in right now.

    Joe Biden gives a speech, most of it is lies, something he is well known for, yet, somehow
    the majority of the public heard it and believed it.

    So the US and the Western World are suffering from believing total crap.
     
  15. yangforward

    yangforward Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There was no war in Ukraine, and Ukraine and Russia were negotiating their
    differences by financial means.

    Until the US sent in lots of weapons and told Ukraine they would win.

    We need a candidate whose main aim is something other than to increase
    weapons sales at any cost.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2024
  16. Josh77

    Josh77 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If Bernie were younger and was running for president, I'd vote for him over either Biden or Trump.

    I could care less about marxism or capitalism. the reality of jobs vanishing to AI, and what it means to be human will make both obsolete.
    The brainwashing of humanity that began with the industrial revolution will end, and what it even means to be human is going to completely change soon, and will likely resemble something closer to ancient Greece than what life has been like since the industrial revolution, though obviously there will be many, many differences from ancient Greece.
     
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  17. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    How many years have you been out of college? Not many I'll wager if you think that Bernie Sanders is the answer.

    As for ancient Greece, here's something for you to enjoy. From what I've read, upper class Athenians used these. This was struck in the 400s BC.

    Greek Owl All.jpg
     

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