Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates <<MOD WARNING>>

Discussion in 'Coronavirus (COVID-19) News' started by Bluesguy, Nov 19, 2020.

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  1. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    The efficacy of masks exists only in hypothetical situations. In reality, they don't work, and the way they are most commonly used, they are like dirty air filters, often making the wearer sick.

    If they worked so damn well, why do so many mask wearers become sick?
     
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  2. Statistikhengst

    Statistikhengst Well-Known Member

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    The very fact that one year into the most deadly pandemic since 1918, people are still arguing over the effectiveness of masks is exactly why the USA is heading straight toward 600,000 dead from Covid-19.

    I mean, seriously. Get a grip, folks.
     
  3. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    Those needing to get a grip are the ones who constantly and without question buy into narratives told by known liars with ulterior motives.
     
  4. Statistikhengst

    Statistikhengst Well-Known Member

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    Those needing to get a grip first need to actually read and study actual scientific experiments conducted with masks. This requres the ability to discern, which for some people may prove to be an almost insurmountable challenge.

    But courage, bigly courage! With G-d, all things are possible.
     
  5. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    So sayeth the priest of the Church of The Poisoned Mind....
     
  6. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Just remember, you are all anti maskers (I’d be happy to be proven wrong in your case). You just haven’t read the studies or used discernment enough to realize it. You all oppose mask usage in situations where their use would be most beneficial. It would be funny if it wasn’t so tragic.
     
  7. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    Every nation? Not China they just lie and say they have no deaths. Libs believe it.

    How does Cuomo killing the elderly make Trump look good? Trump did not make the decision to allow the elderly to die. Cuomo did. His liar brother also pretended to have the illness when he never did.
     
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  8. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    Don't be ridiculous, I wasn't including China and Libs don't believe it. Stupid sweeping statements.
     
  9. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    I already commented that you indeed quoted word for word,... but you ALSO left out words.

    The advice was based on a MASSIVE shortage of masks. He made it HIS POINT.
    You left out his point, and so cooked up a fallacy.

    You can't quote me on conceding when I'm telling you to go ask Fauci.

    Nope. You aint a scientific expert and are unable to claim what is relevant and what is not, when the experts conclude that more research is needed.


    The advice was based on a MASSIVE shortage of masks. He made it HIS POINT.
    You left out his point, and so cooked up a fallacy.

    Because it N95 stands for not letting through 95% of particles as big as a virus and not 100%.

    You say that, yet I need to explain to you why N95 are not 100% safe.

    I sourced that what you say is wat Rubio is saying, and it's debunked by PolitiFact.
    I sourced that too.

    You ask me to provide evidence, and in return you're just spouting this personal opinionated trash as if it's matters. lol

    you provided no evidence that PolitiFact is wrong somewhere in this case.

    Deny science? You demanded to demonstrate I’m parroting Rubio by providing quotes dated before October.
    That's you not denying what Rubio says is what you are saying, and it got debunked.
     
  10. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    Fauci: If you think masks, you should think about healthcare workers needing them and the people who are ill. When you look at the films of foreign countries and see 85% of the people wearing masks that's fine. I'm not against it. If you want to do it, that's fine. I'm not against it.
    Interviewer: but it can lead to a shortage of masks?
    Fauci: Exactly! That's the point. It can lead to a shortage of masks for the people who really need it


    I sourced Political fact said:
    The country faced a shortage of high-quality masks,
    and Fauci also said in his interviews that masks should be preserved
    for sick people and health care workers.



    Game set and match.
     
  11. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    I’ve left out nothing. It was a lie to tell people there was no reason to wear masks in February and March.
    Your argument is akin to telling a starving person they don’t need food.
    If you can’t answer the question, you have conceded. I accept your concession.
    The problem is you can’t present any evidence I’m not an expert because everything I’ve presented is backed by empirical evidence. Everything I’ve presented is factual. All you have offered is opinions without any basis in epidemiology or virology. Your PolitiFact link you parrot has no basis in virology or epidemiology either. We judge information by whether it has a basis in science or not. We don’t judge it based on who says it. That’s appeal to authority and a fallacy. You have resorted to that fallacy because you can not refute my posts on their merit. And you never will be able to because they are based on science, not a journalist’s ignorant opinion.
    Again, if you want to tell starving people they don’t need food that’s your prerogative. If Fauci wants to tell people who should be wearing masks there isn’t a need to, that’s his prerogative. But you are both incorrect.
    That’s relatively accurate. So what does this mean?


    Are you claiming the “average” mask (whatever that is) is as good as or better than an N95?

    I’m quite aware of the efficacy of N95 masks. I’m also aware you can’t tell the protective properties of a mask by showing a picture of it on the Internet. I had to point that out to you in relation to ASTM ratings. I was also aware that the most common mask worn in South Korea in February was N95 quality, a fact you were unaware of. Basically everything you believe is false—not supported by evidence.
    I have no control of and no interest in what any politician says. My posts are factual, backed up by empirical evidence, and pre date Rubio’s comments. I have completely invalidated PolitiFact’s unsupported opinion by presenting accepted facts of epidemiology and virology.
    None of what I’ve posted is my opinion. It’s verifiable facts to the best of our current knowledge of virology and epidemiology. You can not provide ANY evidence from biological sciences to counter what I’ve posted. Neither can PolitiFact because evidence to counter what I’ve presented does not exist.
    I presented multiple paragraphs of information they are either ignorant of or are willfully lying about.
    Yes. Any epidemiologist who claims Americans shouldn’t have been wearing masks in February/March is a denier of science. Anyone who makes excuses for such a person (as you do) is a denier of science as well. You can not debunk any of my posts because they are based on empirical evidence.
     
  12. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    I posted what you still deliberately are leaving out in post 1435.
    You denying this, is just utterly dishonest, cheating far right wing fake news at it's finest.


    Your argument is on par with the fake claim that nobody needs a vaccination, when the priority is now given to the elderly and healthcare workers because not everybody can get one now.

    Fake news. You can't quote me on it.

    Nope. It remains a personal opinion if you can't back it up.
    And I've debunked your opinion.


    You don't need to be a scientist to spot you deliberately are leaving ouw what I claimed for so long, and now posted in post 1435.
    It's exactly on par with what PolitiFact even says.


    You never responded to what you deliberately left out.




    You never responded to what you left out. You're just trolling around this with irrelevant phony examples.


    Look it up yourself


    Why ask me?

    You're not, since you're asking me questions about it.

    You never watched the vid of what Fauci said, and so are not aware that this probably is not what Fauci said.

    Totally irrelevant who predates who. You're trolling around that your claim is what Rubio claims... AND IT GOT DEBUNKED!

    You're fake facts got debunked.
    You also never watched the vid where Fauci before you accused him of lying in that interview. INSANITY! lol

    I posted what you still deliberately are leaving out in post 1435.
    You have NEVER posted ALL he said word for word in order to cook up a far right wing conspiracy.

    I can debunk it perfectly well.... since you NEVER posted ALL he said word for word in order to cook up a far right wing conspiracy.
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2021
  13. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    So you have no facts to support the opinions of others you repeat. I’ve presented facts you can not refute and have accepted your concession.

    You have now claimed “average” masks are superior to N95 masks. You have demonstrated you do not understand ASTM ratings. You have provided inaccurate information about the type of mask most used in South Korea. You are on record as an anti masker at the point in pandemics where mitigations are most effective. You are on record approving of mitigations like hand washing without formal research on C19 hygiene but at the same time oppose mask usage mitigation without C19 specific formal research. You have made claims you refuse to support at all with any evidence, telling me to “ask Fauci” when I ask you a question. You’ve now even “parroted” an analogy I made with vaccines, proving you are incapable of thinking for yourself.

    You claim I leave out pertinent content of Fauci’s comments, but I’ve addressed that content repeatedly. I’ve provided evidence that his “point” about mask shortages doesn’t excuse a lie responsible for deaths of untold thousands of Americans. I’ve provided evidence he could have followed the example set by Asian countries instead of lying.

    My posts are not conspiratorial in the slightest. They are just presentation of facts and empirical evidence. You confirm my posts are factual by your repeated use of fallacious arguments instead of producing solid evidence. The “evidence” you do provide has been shown to be false (mask types worn in February in South Korea, etc., etc.)

    You will notice you have never posted everything Fauci said word for word either. Part of the interview in question (the Overtime segment) has been posted numerous times in this thread. I’ve not only quoted from it, but the aired interview from the actual 60 Minutes broadcast as well which you weren’t even aware of.

    Now, obviously my content isn’t fake. If it were, you would be able to provide studies where epidemiologists conclude the best time to implement mitigations for respiratory pandemics is after infection rates are exponentially increasing and thousands have already died. If my content was fake news, you would be able to provide studies showing known respiratory viruses aren’t transmitted asymptomatically and presymptomatically. If my content was fake news, you would cite empirical evidence showing cotton fabric masks are as efficacious as N95 and ASTM 3 masks. If my content was fake news, you would be able to cite studies or even journalistic content criticizing South Korea for early mask usage.

    Of course you can’t supply any such evidence because my posts are correct and based on science while your posts are parroted opinions of science deniers. All you have now is the fallacious argument of attacking the source as opposed to debating the content.

    I make a point of thanking people who so eloquently show the complete denial of science that exists in the “progressive” movement. So again, thank you. You have presented the perfect demonstration of choosing partisan politics over science, logic, and reason.
     
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  14. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    I posted what Fauci said in 1435.
    If he said those words is not an opinion.

    And you refuse to comment what he said. And he said:
    Fauci: If you think masks, you should think about healthcare workers needing them and the people who are ill. When you look at the films of foreign countries and see 85% of the people wearing masks that's fine. I'm not against it. If you want to do it, that's fine. I'm not against it.
    Interviewer: but it can lead to a shortage of masks?
    Fauci: Exactly! That's the point. It can lead to a shortage of masks for the people who really need it



    That's... WORD FOR WORD!
    And that's why his advice was that people in general shouldn't wear masks.


    Says it all, you refuse to react to this.
    You lost the argument with your fake news opinion.
     
  15. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    That’s not the whole interview. And I’ve addressed that content multiple times. We knew the majority of the “people who are ill” he says need masks in your quote are the exact same people he said had no reason to be walking around with masks in the portion of the interview I’ve quoted. When you make two diametrically opposed statements in the same interview, one is a lie. Clearly, the part I’ve quoted is the lie, as I shown clear evidence Fauci knew there were infected individuals in the group he said had no reason to wear masks.

    We knew there were “ill” people walking around the US in late February and early March. And Fauci clearly stated there was no reason for them to wear a mask. They absolutely should have been wearing masks and Fauci advised against it by lying about the efficacy of masks and where the “ill” people were.

    I think it’s sad I have to point these things out to you.
     
  16. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    It's the part you deliberately left out to cook up a right wing fake news hoax.

    I quoted him saying specifically those ill people (and health care workers) should be wearing masks.
    Oh look.. here it is again:
    If you think masks, you should think about healthcare workers needing them and the people who are ill.

    Also: your entire argument of that Fauci only said that the population should not be wearing masks.... is suddenly out the window.
    So much for your utterly far right wing claim that Fauci lied.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
  17. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    I’ve left out nothing. The infected people who needed masks were asymptomatic and presymptomatic infected people in the general population walking around America. The ones he said had no reason to be wearing masks in the same interview.

    Facts aren’t right wing or left wing. I’ve presented facts. I’m sorry you can’t accept empirical evidence over partisan hackery.
     
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  18. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    Even if that was ALL Fauci said it would still be very poor. Phrases like "I'm not against it. If you want to do it, that's fine" . Imply its a life style choice not an important method of stopping viral spread.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  19. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    This works...

    upload_2021-2-2_7-56-20.jpeg

    You can buy it today on Amazon.
     
  20. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Try this...

    upload_2021-2-2_7-58-3.jpeg
     
  21. VanCleef

    VanCleef Well-Known Member

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    Incredibly misleading and dangerous thread. Most studies say otherwise. Even the author of this study says otherwise, the study didn't even say what the TC said.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  22. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    You're right. Yet there's some in this thread that are trying to shift the blame onto Fauci for something he said in middle of February when there was less than 20 positive cases and zero deaths and little known about the virus rather than criticizing this dangerous thread which was posted when there were around 4,000,000 positive cases and 250,000 deaths
     
  23. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    Yet somehow the justification was medical folk were running out of masks.
    Sigh.
     
  24. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    Because the non wearers spread the disease.
     
  25. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Fauci is responsible for his lack of honesty just like Trump or anyone else. Remember our current state of affairs is partly a result of waiting months to recommend mask mitigation. Not only that, but current demographics that are unwilling to mask in public base that decision in part on Fauci’s original lie. It had great consequence in February and March and continues to have negative consequences today. In reality, Fauci was the original anti-masker. He made his recommendation in direct denial of science as a public health
    epidemiologist.

    He even predicted the result of his lack of candor in the 60 Minutes interview that’s become central to this thread.

    Ironically, at about the 13:30 mark of the full March 8 interview, Fauci says “the danger of minimization on/in any arena of infectious disease and outbreak is that you might get people to be complacent, number one, number two, when bad things happen your credibility is lost because you’ve downplayed something”. Yet, in the oft posted 60 Minutes Overtime segment from March 8 we’ve been discussing in this thread, Fauci downplays mask usage repeatedly. And because he waited till April 3rd to recommend masks, bad things did happen. Bad things like 3500 new daily confirmed cases and 1300 deaths on April 3rd. And then you guys wonder why Fauci’s credibility is shot. His words were prophetic. He downplayed, bad things happened, and his credibility is lost.

    If you give Fauci a pass (and yourselves for being demonstrably anti-mask as well) you really shouldn’t criticize anti maskers with different political views than yourselves. You all are anti-mask with minor differences and motivations. You all deny science

    That is really the danger of threads like this. One side claiming falsely to be supportive of mask wearing while criticizing others for not being supportive of mask usage. Denying empirical evidence is dangerous and that’s what we see from Fauci’s February and March comments right on down to far right wing, progressive and “liberal” stances today on mask usage.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021

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