Map shows Church Attendance in U.S.

Some people believe "the Church" has been hollowed out from the inside, like a block of wood with termites. Nothing is really obvious, except at some point the block of wood begins collapsing in on itself.

This has been the plan of atheist progressives all along. They keep planting little seeds, and many of them have germinated.

Until finally you get people like Josh77.

Josh, you do realize everything you think would have been seen as wacky doodle 70 years ago? Hey, but it only takes one generation, right?

Like Reagan said, "The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."

 

nobody is "planting" anything as with all things and freedom of speech, it is more and more familiarity of the rights church hiearchy themselves who expose themselves as the charlatans they are

 

You're sure it's not just selective reporting by the media?

Sure there are some bad apples out there.

Now which hierarchy are you talking about, exactly?

 

i was born a catholic, so theirs for sure, i am now a spiritualist, but i recognize many christian beliefs were ingrained within me at an early age, personally i look at the evangelical crowd as the last remnants of the confederacy...their are 2000 plus denominations some less corrupt then others, anytime a group of humans get involved in things corruption follows....i believe technology has advanced our world so fast that people are just unable to keep up and much division stems from that, not some grand scheme, myself i quite watching or listening to anything with "commercials" long ago they just upset my train of thought

 

1) keep telling yourself that.
2) Sure, there is lots of good stuff in there. Also lots corrupted by the church and translations. The key is to go in and glean the good stuff from the garbage.
3) take my word, or not. Spirituality is a journey. We all find our answers when we are ready for them. If we are not ready for certain spiritual truths, they will make no sense to us. That doesn’t make one or the other right or wrong. It is right or wrong for us at that time, depending on what we are here to learn in this lifetime.
4) nice verses. What of them? Is this about hell? It would be nice if different translations were consistent. As an example, in Matthew 5:30 the king James and many other bibles say hell, but really it is talking about the Valley of Hinnom, outside of Jerusalem. Quite a bit different from a lake of eternal fire and a horny guy dancing around with a pitchfork. Just a word of advice, be careful of taking the Bible too literally. You might end up thinking the earth is only 6000 years old, and all of creation was made in 7 days.
There is a hell, but it is here on earth. It is what we experience when we don’t live our lives with love and service to others. A selfish, wicked life will leave you feeling like you are in the mythical hell.

 

The Catholic church uses the Book of Thomas.

I think you're forgetting that the bible is a concoction of writings assembled by a body that had clear political objectives - those interested in leadership of the country and those interested in being the religious leaders.

 

Your experience sounds similar to mine. I too was raised catholic, and am now spiritual rather than religious. I totally agree, humans wasted no time corrupting organized religion. That’s why it is always better to find the truth on spiritual matters within you, in a direct link to god/universe or whatever you want to call it. That cannot be corrupted.

 

a started school when i was 4 and my first memories were of wondering how they couldnt read yet, i stared out the window in grade school and got straight As
i was never punished for anything in school, by the time i was 18 i discovered drug abuse and 25 yrs later spirituality as a means to inner peace and sobriety

 

You seem to be misinformed. You claim they are using a text that was only rediscovered in 1945 ?

 

Where do you get these ideas?

What you say is sort of not untrue, but that is not the only explanation.

Any more than Trump supporters are right in saying "The election was stolen." It's a plausible possibility that could be possible, and you can argue there may have been certain motivations in place, but it is also possible that is not true.

Constantine did not really dictate what would be in the Bible; he simply gathered a large number of the Christian leaders at the time and asked that they define what would be definitive scripture. Most all of the pieces they chose not to include were obvious that they should not be included, or did not have anywhere near the same reliability as the other texts. The decisions were not really political, though you can argue Constantine might have wanted consistency.

Sorry, this argument is over. Start a new thread and leave the link here if you want to further discuss it.

 

Gospel of Thomas: A Catholic Perspective

"Pope Benedict XVI used saying 82 in his 2012 Easter vigil Mass."

 

Well that is surprising, if it is actually true.
Still, even if true, that is hardly an official endorsement.

You can do a search "Why does the Catholic Church consider the Gospel of Saint Thomas a heresy?", "Why is the Gospel of Thomas heretical?"

https://coldcasechristianity.com/wr...n-canonical-gospels-attributed-to-thomas/amp/

 

Constantine selected who would attend.

Do you think he had no idea what they were thinking or which groups of Christians he was allowing representation?

Constantine did want religious unity. That was the reason for the council of Nicaea.

 

Somebody had to. That is still not evidence of bias.

Fringe groups would not have been invited.

You've still presented no evidence for your claims.

 

No, that is your issue to deal with.

The problem with religion/spirituality is that there is no methodology for determining what is real and what is not. This is exemplified by the plethora of such views and the total inability of religion throughout the world to work out that problem.

If you want to call other Christians "heretical", that's on you.

 

You are obviously wrong.

It is a bit more complicated than that.

Plus, couldn't the same be claimed about political views?

 

What claims are you worried about?

 

Hopefully, you notice that there are versions of god, spirituality, afterlife, etc., etc. all over this world.

And, there is no method of resolving those differences in religion.

In fact, there is no way to resolve the differences within Christianity. There isn't even a way to resolve the differences within Protestantism.

 

Sounds a lot like different political beliefs.

That does not automatically mean they are all wrong.

 

Of course.

However, it supports the intelligence of our founders in drawing a line between religion and government.

Of course, they were English in heritage and well educated. So, they were well aware of the history of religion and government.

 

Politics is the public exercise of your religion, you vote for who ever matches your 'value' system and 'moral' compass, which is your religion.

Abortion (the general management of your body) is....[well used to be] ....grounded in your religion, the state took that over for you.

Including your values and moral compass, are now dictated by the state.

Right to privacy, long gone dead
Right to due process mostly dead
Right to free speech long gone dead
Right to exercise your religion never existed
Right to redress never existed

https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/215559195.pdf

 

I don't believe it is nearly so stark as that.

There are plenty of serious questions for which no (or very few) religions give any kind of advice that is finding its way to the ballot box.

As for abortion, yes we now have SC direction that women DON'T have control of their own healthcare. And, that comes even though our majority family of religions is based in the Bible, which has no direction concerning abortion.

 

sadly it is just that stark if you want to examine this at a macro level.

Not eating pork for instance is part of a religion and that is just a-ok ducky, (proof you have the right to control what you ingest) however eating peyote a part of another cultures religion has chosen to ingest is punishable by fines and imprisonment.

...and now you are restricted from travel (declared and allegedly in force from the articles of confederation) but if you did not get the guvmint ordered injection of an untested (alleged) vaccination that the original inventors screamed danger danger wil robinson and were ignored, and now we see worldwide excess deaths that cannot be account for.

But not to worry, people will remain willfully ignorant so they can continue to wave their pacifier flag of freedom, well until they are hunted down for their beliefs, coming to a theater near you soon, in the land of free!

 

I think that's somewhat of an overstatement.

We still have free speech. We still have due process, other than when race is involved.

People certainly can exercise their religion. In fact, our laws give deference to religion even when such practices conflict with law.

I don't know what you think is missing wrt redress.

 

I linked to yale, apparently you didnt bother to read 'any' of it.

what you are saying is paramount to someone claiming hey wait a minute!

we still have fresh water! what do you mean we dont have those things, we have at least 3 drops.

sure we have those things on a three drop level.

the fact is your life is not completely controlled including your body, at least if you are a female.