My new Abortion Position

I also agree with all of your conclusions though I don't know your moral views on the situation Allow me to narrow it down to my personal thoughts. I don't see it as right or wrong. I see it as do it or don't. My views on everything, all, at some point, reached the basis that there is no right or wrong in humanity. Before having the ability to communicate or before our brains became so complex, we just lived, we survived and things were never labeled as right or wrong. Until we formed laws, religion, etc.

Killing is in our nature. Even if I don't see abortion as murder, I see it as stopping the process before the human is alive and suffers for whatever that reason may be. Of course there is adoption but I don't care for abortion either. I have a very cold heart on this subject in particular. For instance I don't care if my next door neighbor aborts her kid. It wasn't my kid and it wasn't my problem. It's her life and she can do what she wants. It's only a matter of others controlling you for their simple pleasure.

Say I was 15 and got a 13 year old girl pregnant. I would explain to my parents and suggest abortion. Because I would not want to put that girl through hell in school for being pregnant and would not want her body going through child birth. Of course it's our fault anyway. At that time I would consent to abortion. Not to mention how difficult it would be to care for the kid, again, knowing it's still our fault. Now say I'm 25 and get my wife of age 27 pregnant. Why would we ever abort this child? I would have no reason to. So with abortion, I either consent to it or I don't. That's all it is. I don't see it as right or wrong. I have no sympathy for a human being that isn't born yet. I see that fetus as an object. It wouldn't even comprehend what had happened. It just dies. Death. It's the fear most humans have of death. They don't like seeing others go through it and can't accept it. There's so many reasons why people try defining abortion as the wrong thing to do. The worst thing ever. And they still don't give a damn for the man that was just shot to death and came up on the news. If they say that fetus is already a human, then why would they care more for it just because it's younger? Then it just leads to personal views, "All life should be sacred." It goes on and on.

What I don't agree with are there being laws for it. Just let them do what they have to do. If they need abortion, who the hell are you to control their life and what they do? Unless you are the father or mother of the kid, back off. That's the 1 thing about this topic that I see as pure stupidity. It's a simple solution. Why should their always be someone controlling your life? Besides enforcing nonexistent laws to have order in a country. People act as if others just aborted THEIR own child. Just leave them alone. It literally affects them none.

Sorry but no, I don't care for the fetuses that die. I have to be cruel because it then disables every other argument that someone who is against abortion has. It leads down to "caring" for all life. If I don't know them, am not close with them, never met them, they aren't family or friends then I don't care for them. I shouldn't have to waste my time to worry about strangers. It's a simple code I live by. Why should the way I live be wrong too? Just because you don't agree and I'm not like you? That's a very weak excuse.

 

Given that you yourself are a stranger to a great many people, you should expect to die by it as well.

 

I wouldn't doubt it.

 

I don't know who the hell you think you're kidding. If you were in fact aware of that logical consequence of your stated belief, you would not be able to seriously contend what you have contended. This being the case, we may rest assured that your professed awareness is a sham which you have unconsciously employed some self-deceptive device to facilitate, most likely by relegating the consequence you profess to be aware of to a future so distant as to render it moot.

Of course all this assumes you're not a stealth pro-lifer trying to discredit the pro-death crowd by association - in which case, given that none of them have so far denounced a position which cannot be reasonably characterized as anything but despicable, I'd have to say you're doing pretty well.

 

My position on abortion is that Roe vs Wade needs to be overturned and then abortion needs to be completely illegal. Anyone who gets an abortion should be charged with murder and so should anyone who performs an abortion. It should be punishable by life in prison as I believe all murder should be.

 

After all, there is nothing like depriving children of their mother, because of religious dogma.

 

No offense but a meaningless post like this is only meant to inflame others. It is only meant to anger me and I am not going to fall for it.

I am not going to change my views on this issue regardless of how much you might dislike it. So, if you dislike my views and can't come up with a better reply then that then why even waste your energy on such a meaningless reply.

 

Which part did you have difficulty understanding. I will gladly explain it so the meaning is not lost on you.

No it is meant to show how what you advocate is an extreme position and you base it solely on religious dogma. If that angers you maybe you should not debate topics where you are not prepared to face reality.

No one is asking you to change anything, but I will fight any attempt by you or anyone at religious coercion.

It is not meaningless to anyone with the least open mind and with some intellectual integrity. You should try it sometimes.

 

I understood your post perfectly well. You meant it as an attack on my beliefs.

And yes, I realize that my beliefs are largely because of my religion and what Catholicism teaches. I also realize my beliefs are extreme but to be quite frank, I do not care. I am not changing my beliefs. This conversation is not going to get me to change my beliefs in this matter. I have stated my opinion on the matter and that's that. I am ending this conversation now.

 

I think it was meant to show you how your beliefs are an attack on women AND their families.

 

Well, Cady, you can believe that all you want but the fact is that my beliefs are not an attack on women and their families. Rather, I am trying to defend the defenseless. I am not going to debate you on whether or not it is an attack on women and their families. Clearly you disagree with me and that's fine. You are free to disagree. However, I am not going to be bullied into changing my beliefs just because some random person online thinks my beliefs are an attack on women and their families.

 

Clearly you did not.

Not at all. I respect your beliefs, but we are talking about your wish that those be imposed on society and that is a different matter entirely.

Then perhaps true to the faith and the teachings of Christ you should try to inspire people to follow His teachings instead of forcing them to abide by them.

As i said no one is asking you to do so. That would be no different than what you are advocating.

 

I understand that you object to the fact that I think my beliefs should be imposed on society and you are free to object. However, I am not going to change my beliefs on that. This is a very serious issue to me and I will not change my beliefs on this issue.

That said, this conversation is over. I have said my piece and I have no more to say.

 

Yes, they are. You would have women jailed on the basis of your BELIEF, a belief that you can't prove, but you hold only by faith.

We have freedom of religion, so you are free to believe what you want and act on your own beliefs. However, don't try to push your beliefs on others by the force of law to make abortion illegal. That doesn't save any lives, in fact it causes more maternal deaths.

 

As I said, no one is asking you to change your beliefs, nor should anyone do so, but running away from dialogue serves nothing. Do you only like to talk with people that agree with you? What do you learn from that?
Challenge yourself, challenge your beliefs for yourself. If you are on solid ground you beliefs will stand and become stronger, if not you owe it to yourself to make corrections.

 

I will live my life the way I want and act to get the legislation passed that I want passed and you can do the same.

This conversation is over. I am not changing my beliefs on abortion legislation or on abortion. Have a nice day Cady.

- - - Updated - - -

Prometeus, the conversation is over. Goodbye.

 

Wonderful. The US can be just like Catholic dominated Latin American countries with restrictive abortion laws, HIGHER abortion rates than the US, AND very high maternal death rates.

 

Adios...

For the world of me I can not understand why people like you come here a place of debate or at least dialogue. It seems that all you were interested in is spouting your beliefs.

 

You must have read in between every one of those lines to pull that conclusion out. It's a strong guess, but no. I didn't mean any more than what I wrote.

I'm not either. By whom am I obligated to receive and openly accept a title to stand by any of my reasons?

 

Good luck with trying to enforce a total ban on abortion, it has been tried for centuries, it didn't work then and it wouldn't work now.

So in the states that have the death penalty you are content to put to death a woman who may already have 4 or 5 kids .. after all it would be a premeditated murder.

I'd be interested in you expanding exactly how you would enforce a total abortion ban?

 

Then why are you here if not to debate the very issue.

I get it you are one of these hit and run people who have nothing to support their opinion except their own illusions.

 

I wanted to state my opinion and that was all. I figured that people might want to know what kind of opinion I hold on this issue.

 

An opinion that your are well within your rights to hold . .however this is a debating forum, if you put forward your opinion then most people will expect you to defend it.

 

Yeah I understand that. Perhaps I should not have posted my opinion in here.

I can't really defend my position at this time except for with my religious beliefs. I really do believe there is a good secular case for the pro-life cause as well but I am not prepared to defend that.

 

There is nothing wrong with a person believing and having conviction in their belief of any issue.

The PROBLEMS START when some of these same people cannot separate another's right to act under protective laws and what their own opinion or belief is.

For instance....I am both Pro-Life and Pro-Choice.

For some reason a few here have adamantly tried to tell me I cannot be both...yet I truly am.

It is in this rigidity and this lack of having an open mind....and especially this lack of understanding thus we get people twisting ideology in their minds into thinking that THEY are some kind of HAND OF GOD to dole out JUDGEMENT.....as well as others thinking that any kind of reasonable and rationally developed controls are akin to taking away their choice.

AboveAlpha