My Problems with New Atheism

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by YourBrainIsGod, Oct 30, 2017.

  1. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What is odd, is that I live in the Bible Belt South, and no one has tried to impose their religious beliefs on me since in the late 80s when a team of Jehovah Witnesses showed up at my door. Of course, I invited them in, since they were toting a bible, and many southern people will do so, as we are generally friendly dogs, and yet they did not try to impose their religious beliefs on, me, but just told me about them. When I objected to a couple of their beliefs, and told them I did not share them, one of the black ladies quote a verse from the NT about what they were supposed to do if I rejected their message. Something about turning their backs on me and wiping off their feet as they left the house. I can't recall the exact scripture but had read it a few times in my life. So what do you mean by imposing their beliefs on you?

    To me what comes to mind would be a radical muslim who gave me the choice of converting to their way of thinking or losing my head. That would be an imposition. So perhaps you are indulging in just a bit of hyperbole? Or has some christian in your own life actually tried to impose his beliefs upon you? And how did they do that, what words did they use?

    OTOH, I have seen atheists, and even some here, who seem to want to impose their own beliefs upon others, by calling them names, as if that would ever work on changing someone's mind.

    I find both the militant atheists, and the true believing fundamentalist christians very close in nature, as both have at least one basic commonality. Both express absolute certainty, with no evidence to support such certainty. Which means to me that their absolute certainty comes not from any hard evidence, but from faith. They must have great faith that their impossible certainty is true. So we are looking at the two sides of the faithful here. And no I am not saying atheism is a religion like some have offered up on this forum. But it is an ideological belief system. And relies upon faith in order for acceptance within their own minds. And yet I have no problem with this,for it is their life and they can believe in anything that suits their type of personality. I have come to think that whether one is a theist or atheists if highly dependent upon the personality and little else. Unless of course the theist is a theist because of an overwhelming spiritual experience that moved them in that direction. And we have people like that here, I think. They think there is some kind of God, because of some overwhelming, undeniable experience in consciousness which convinces them. And yet many people on both sides argue and believe from an ideological point of view and have never had any such kind of consciousness changing experience. I once, long ago, after ingesting 400 micro grams of LSD, had what I thought was a religious experience of oneness with our universe, but once I crashed from this trip, that experience had no life transforming effects. And so, it was just a mighty fine trip at the end of the day. And one I have no regrets in taking that long trip. In fact, I think that such an experience from perhaps ayahuasca should be a rites of passage for all human beings, when conducted by something like a shaman. I think trump should have taken one at some point, or even now would not be too late. I suspect it would clean his act up. Especially if it revealed to him his own ego, and how it disrupts things.
     
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  2. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, I have read it completely twice. And what I got from it is not what I was taught growing up in church. But I discovered early on that it must never be taken literally. For if it teaches anything it is on a level which can only be sourced by analogy, and other literate instruments of understanding, much like poetry, good poetry moves beyond the mere words. It doesn't make a whole lot of sense if taken literally, and appears to be a rather bratty egocentric God. Who throws tantrums when he does not get his way.

    The literal interpretation does no justice to who is supposed to be the creator of our vast and mysterious universe and looks more like a mockery. But when you look closely at some of the people he created one thing becomes clear. This God has a helluva sense of humor.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2017
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  3. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I dont believe in the tooth fairy. But im sure someone does. Would I be justified in denegrating them for it?
     
  4. Arjay51

    Arjay51 Well-Known Member

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    Or if one is truly honest about this, the statement "I don't care" is the only truth there is.
     
  5. Arjay51

    Arjay51 Well-Known Member

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    The "facts" of your statement belie what you say. If you continually are searching, as you imply, you are looking for a, what you consider, a truth. Which is in direct opposition to what you profess.
     
  6. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    if people were passing laws requiring you to do something based on their beliefs, then it becomes a political issue, religions that do not do this are not talked about much by non-believers in them
     
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  7. Guno

    Guno Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    the conmen hawking jesus is big business, jut look at all of those televangelists selling pray cloths magic water to the low IQ christers



     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2017
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  8. Diablo

    Diablo Well-Known Member

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    Everyone knows it's a business, like big tobacco or big pharma.
     
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  9. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Fair enough.

    Is 'people who believe in God are dumb' a political statement? Does it, iyo, further the cause of seperating religion from govt?
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2017
  10. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    OMG! :eek:

    No wonder they didn't work for you!

    That Norwegian source was all afflicted with MUD! (Mad Unicorn Disease.)

    The rainbow unicorn farts are all sourced from the south island of New Zealand where they are a protected species carefully managed on the Hobbit Preserve at Umwallawallabangabanga.
     
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  11. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Chinese Propaganda debunked by the UNICOM report. Plus, everyone knows Hobbits stopped being Unicorn breeders after Sauron.
     
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  12. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Who said anything about Hobbits breeding unicorns? The Umwallawallabangabanga unicorns are all free range. The Hobbits are just harvesting the wild rainbow farts as a means of preserving their ancient cultural rituals of worship.
     
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  13. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh please....The "One Horn" cult was myth long before it was even created as a childrens poem.

    " Wander amongst the grass
    Single horn and ass
    with the gas they pass
    Many colored Sass."

    I cannot believe you accept this as truth.
     
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  14. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    The Book of The Holy Tine does not contain any such verses. Instead it says this about the origin myth.

    Cornucopians 8:16 "Lo, and it came to pass whilest She was without a mate She brought into being a creature that would satiate Her longings. It were thus 7 trivits turned and 15 trivits long in order to spur Oneness with the Universe."

    The use of the gas is said to have originated in this verse;

    Flatulations 1:27 "Whilest beset with a curse of boils and sores the Holy One did come to rest in a grove. Thereupon did a herd of unicorns pass wind upon His sleeping form and when the Holy One awoke His skin was without blemish."
     
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  15. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Dayum...had I only known my life would have meant something.

    "All praise the Holy Horn"!
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017
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  16. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So, now you resort to mind reading?

    Yes as any curious mind does, one keeps looking at this age old question, while also having the mental ability to recognize the truth..that one does not know, nor does anyone else knows with certainty. A mind can admit the truth of certainty being impossible, at this point in human existence, and yet still keep an open mind. Perhaps some great discovery will occur tomorrow which allows one to say with certainty, either one way or the other. I cannot fathom what that might be, but to close one's mind to such a possibility is not something beneficial to the continuation of adding to knowledge.

    But your refusal to admit something so self evident and basic, that man does not know with certainty the answer to this unsolved age old question is simply the fruit of delusional thinking. At the core of this IMO, is delusion driven by the ego, who in its normal state demands to KNOW, to be RIGHT and to think that all things are knowable. It rejects the limitation of knowledge. So, it is the power of the ego, which refuses to admit what should be obvious to a mind which is rational, and logical, while understanding the question itself lies within the realm of philosophy, at least for now. Could this change? Hell, as with the age old question, I simply do..not..know. Ask me my age, for that I do know, and can provide the evidence for that. But if I can ever remove myself from this universe, stand outside it, and take a good look, I will get back with you on what was observed. And then I might actually be able to say that I know with certainty.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017
  17. William Rea

    William Rea Well-Known Member

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    Sad that you two have created a being far more convincing than the theists on here have.
     
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  18. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Because.....Unicorns are REAL!
     
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  19. William Rea

    William Rea Well-Known Member

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    I know, I'm just saying :)
     
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  20. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    more like the courts did as a result of the demands of atheists, the irony!
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017
  21. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    got any hard evidence they are not?
     
  22. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The only evidence I can provide would be the complete lack of evidence they are real.....well, that and the obvious fact humans made them up.

    Sound Familiar?
     
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  23. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    yeh you have no proof to back up your claim, very familiar
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017
  24. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Okay....PLEASE provide proof of yours, I just admitted I cannot prove mine.
     
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  25. Tuatara

    Tuatara Well-Known Member

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    Then you would have no problem disputing any of their arguments.
     

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