Patriot Act - good or bad? Keep or repeal?

Discussion in 'Civil Rights' started by CCC, Apr 19, 2012.

  1. CCC

    CCC New Member

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    When the Patriot Act was originally passed, I was all for it because I strongly believed it was necessary to protect the USA from terrorists, and I had faith in our police, FBI< Homeland Security, CIA, etc to use it in good faith only as necessary when there was reasonable cause to suspect a threat to national security.

    Wow was I naive.

    I still believe the intent behind the Patriot Act is good, reasonable, and honourable. That intend being to protect this country against threats using necessary tactics, but applied in good faith with regard to necessity of each situation/case.

    Unfortunately, the application of the Patriot Act has been a nightmare for US Citizens and even worse for foreigners. It has turned us into a police state in which the authorities can invade privacy at will and seemingly without regard to good faith. It has also allowed unlawful intimidation, detention, and abuse of many thousands of innocents. Sometimes police use it to bully and intimidate ordinary citizens who have done nothing wrong and are obviously not terrorists. It is used by authorities as a blank check to bully, intimidate, detain, and/or abuse. Often times to people who haven't even done anything to arouse even a reasonable suspicion in a reasonable person.

    The Patriot Act has done as much damage to the freedoms of this nation, and to our national soul, than any terrorist ever has. If it were consistently applied in good faith, I think it'd be OK. But the sad fact is that many police authorities are not operating in good faith. Many times individual police (or FBI or others) are bullies and sadists who get off on intimidating or abusing people, and the Patriot Act provides police/FBI/Homeland Security with a blank check to do almost anything, and get away with it with impunity.

    I strongly believe that many members of the authorities are using the Patriotic Act in good faith, and I have no problem with that, but I also know that many are using it in bad faith, as bullies, and getting off on it.

    My sister and I are white of Northern European decent. I can tell you that going through an airport is a nightmare for anyone, including white people. However, it is far worse for non-whites. Especially Hispanics. Due to getting married, my sister now has a Hispanic last name and now she gets much more security treatment, including one time very abusive treatment of having her pants pulled down by a federal security person at an airport in El Paso TX. Her pants were roughly and forcibly pulled down in public, in front of hundreds of people, while standing in line.

    The Patriot Act has turned this nation into a police state, reminiscent of other police states we used to decry for similar practices.

    The Patriot Act is good in theory, but terrible in practice. I am now very against it.
     
  2. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Judge rules secret nat'l. security letters violate the First Amendment...
    :confusion:
    Judge rules secret FBI letters unconstitutional
    Mar 15,`13 -- A federal judge has ruled that the FBI's practice of issuing so-called national security letters to banks, phone companies and other businesses is unconstitutional, saying the secretive demands for customer data violate the First Amendment.
     
  3. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Patriot Act - Repeal
     
  4. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    DOJ drops support for email snooping...
    :cool:
    Justice: Email snooping law no longer makes sense
    Mar 19,`13 WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Justice Department on Tuesday dropped its support for a controversial provision in a federal law that allows police to review some private emails without a warrant, but it asked Congress to expand its surveillance powers in other ways.
    See also:

    Judges asked to rule on warrantless GPS tracking
    Mar 19,`13 -- A federal appeals court was asked Tuesday to decide whether the government must obtain a warrant before placing a GPS tracker on a suspect's car.
     
  5. jakem617

    jakem617 Member

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    Throughout history, government has commonly taken a mile when given an inch. This is the biggest reason I changed my mind about guns. I can see what is happening to our country. I see the fear that people have in guns, terrorism, having poor healthcare and not getting a bad education, and they always turn to government instead of taking responsibility for their own life. This has given an immense amount of power to a small group of government officials who can wield this power at their will. This group of politicians in our best interests, but that doesn't mean the next generation of politicians also will.
     
  6. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes it feels like, somebody's watchin' me...
    :confusion:
    Microsoft, Too, Says FBI Secretly Surveilling Its Customers
    3.21.13 - Microsoft said the Federal Bureau of Investigation is secretly spying on its customers with so-called National Security Letters that don’t require a judge’s approval, a revelation Thursday that mirrors one Google announced two weeks ago.
     
  7. samiam5211

    samiam5211 New Member Past Donor

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    Repeal it. All of it. Let's go back to the way it was before that day the terrorists won and we gave up our liberty.
     
  8. Charles Nicholson

    Charles Nicholson New Member

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    I am glad to hear that you experienced the same change of heart I did.
    At first, the "for your safety" argument convinced me it was necessary.
    Not until a couple years later did it hit me that nobody has a right to spy on me - particularly without probable cause. I am now a libertarian in all respects.
     
  9. waltky

    waltky Well-Known Member

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    EFF wants Patriot Act revised...
    :confusion:
    Patriot Act erodes privacy rights, advocates charge
    June 10, 2013 > The Electronic Frontier Foundation is calling on Congress to establish a 21st-century version of the Church Committee to curtail the government's collection of ordinary Americans' credit card, telephone and Internet records.
    See also:

    US spy programs raise ire both home and abroad
    Jun 10,`13 WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Obama administration faced fresh anger Monday at home and abroad over U.S. spy programs that track phone and Internet messages around the world in the hope of thwarting terrorist threats. But a senior intelligence official said there are no plans to end the secretive surveillance systems.
     
  10. Daggdag

    Daggdag Well-Known Member

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    The patriot act stops terrorism as well as the 500 mile fence that the cons want to build along as 1000 mile border stops illegal immigrants.
     

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