Poll shows Utah evenly split on gay marriage rights-

Anyway, to continue illustrating why we are unable to communicate...

No, it is not. Common terminology is anal sex, vaginal sex, and oral sex. Orientation has nothing to do with it.

Are you kidding? Homosexuals become parents all the time. This is common knowledge, you even admitted it. The reasons why have already been explained. Being stuck in the closet has very often meant breeding.

And yet they do, all the time. Every day.

You see, here is how your misuse of words is confusing you. VAGINAL sex leads to procreation. Homosexuals commonly engage in vaginal sex. They become parents all the time. You continue to confuse the orientation with the behavior. If you are talking about orientation, use terms describing it. If you are talking about behavior, use words describing that. Don't mix them.

That homosexuals stay in the closet is normal, everyday observation. Nothing theoretical about it.

The orientation is natural, but it is not genetic.

You even admitted a few posts back that homosexuals engage in vaginal sex and become parents. And that's correct, it happens all the time. So when a homosexual engages in vaginal sex, do you think his orientation changes?

Not so. Sexual acts come in a wide variety, and the entire variety is enjoyed by people of all orientations. They do NOT change their orientation from one sex act to the next. If someone is a lawyer, for example, does he engage in vaginal sex or is it "lawyer sex". You are making a category error, and you are insisting on making that error.

I am dumbfounded. Your dictionary fails to support your claim. People of all sexual orientations engage in sexual intercourse. Intercourse is not "homosexual" and it is not "heterosexual", those are ORIENTATIONS. All your dictionary has done is explained what intercourse is, NOT who engages in it.

Again the category error. Yes, heterosexuals engage in sexual intercourse. Homosexuals engage in sexual intercourse. Bisexuals engage in sexual intercourse. The action is not the orientation.

WOW! Post after post after post, I've been pointing out that labeling only one sort of sexual intercourse "heterosexual" is a misleading label. It is a category error. Homosexuals commonly engage in all kinds of sexual intercourse. Their orientation does not change as a result. So what you are saying is that homosexuals engage in "heterosexual sex". But of course they can't - they are not heterosexuals! They can certainly engage in vaginal sex. But anything a homosexual does, he's still homosexual. If he drives a nail with a hammer, this is "homosexual nail driving" if he's homosexual, and "heterosexual nail driving" if he's heterosexual. As you can see, labeling the action with the orientation is a misuse of labels. Driving a nail is driving a nail.

Where in your dictionary definition was orientation mentioned? Can you repeat the dictionary part where either the term "heterosexual" or "homosexual" is even used? The dictionary did not use these terms because they are NOT RELEVANT to the activity of sexual intercourse.

This is the wrong term. VAGINAL sex is the only way to naturally procreate. Homosexuals do it all the time. And they become parents. Their orientation does not change.

Yet they do so quite commonly. And in fact, heterosexuals engage in anal intercourse often enough as well. Humans also are a randy species, perfectly willing and able to enjoy sexual intercourse with the opposite sex, the same sex, even dogs and sheep! The action isn't the orientation.

Homosexuals become parents using the natural method, and this is very common. That's because the homosexuals are using VAGINAL SEX. What matters is the nature of the sex act, and NOT the orientation of the person engaging in it.

No, it is not "heterosexual sex", it is VAGINAL sex. And yes, even it's as unnatural for them as sex with a sheep, even that happens. The actual physical sensations (for males, anyway, I've never been a female) are supposed to be similar enough between anal sex and vaginal sex, so that one could close his eyes, imagine some ideal lover, and engage in sex with someone other than his natural orientation. Heterosexual couples commonly engage in anal sex. My wife and I do it often. It feels similar and (for me) quite good. It doesn't feel unnatural.

VAGINAL sex.

I have now explained 2 or 3 times why orientation is not genetic. It is not passed on. There is no combinaton of genes determining orientation. You seem to have no idea what it means for something to be genetic. Homosexuals are generally just as fertile as heterosexuals, just as capable of becoming parents.

I will assume you mean ANAL sex here. Even heterosexuals engage in anal sex, all the time.

What? Most mammals engage in anal sex. It's perfectly natural.

Gong! PLEASE use the proper terminology to describe what you mean. It shouldn't be necessary for your readers to GUESS what sex act you're talking about, considering that people of all orientations engage in all kinds of sex acts.

That's why your dictionary definition did not mention orientation. Because orientation is orthogonal to intercourse. All sorts of intercourse is enjoyed by heterosexuals, homosexuals, bisexuals, trans-sexuals, etc. The lexicographers who wrote your dictionary knew this. They defined intercourse in terms of the act itself, and NOT in terms of the person engaging in it.

 

Which is a laughably false statement and I gave you the definition from the dictionary. Your refusal to acknowledge the dictionary doesn't help you.

I asked you where you got your information from "Homosexuals very commonly engage in what you are calling "heterosexual sex"

You provided nothing as usual to back up your laughable assertions. I never denied homosexuals adopt but your ludicrous claim that homosexuals commonly engage in heterosexual sex for children has zero factual basis whatsoever.

Going against their very nature and you provide zero evidence to support your claims whatsoever.

Vaginal sex us heterosexual sex. Stop pretending it isn't.

Where is your evidence? Back up this BS claim of yours.

Through adoption.

This isn't mixing anything. You want to confuse the terms and ignore the dictionary. I won't allow you to throw out the dictionary for your own personal views that have no bearing in reality.

Then support it with factual evidence not personal claims.

Back it up then with factual evidence not personal claims.

No I said it was possible. I certainly didn't say it was common or happens all the time. You said that without a shred of evidence to support you in any way shape or form.

Either back up these laughable claims of yours with factual evidence or stop making them.

You cannot be serious. READ THE DEFINITION.

Sexual Intercourse
The act in which the external male reproductive organ—penis—enters the external/accessible female reproductive tract—vagina


How in God's name do you continue to miss this over and over again? Explain yourself.

Sexual Intercourse
The act in which the external male reproductive organ—penis—enters the external/accessible female reproductive tract—vagina

Which is proven laughably false by the dictionary once again.

You cannot be serious. READ THE DEFINITION.

Sexual Intercourse
The act in which the external male reproductive organ—penis—enters the external/accessible female reproductive tract—vagina


How in God's name do you continue to miss this over and over again? Explain yourself.

Sexual Intercourse
The act in which the external male reproductive organ—penis—enters the external/accessible female reproductive tract—vagina

Cite in the dictionary your BS claim of vaginal sex and how its any different than the definition of heterosexual sex I provided. I grow tired of you looking into a blue sky and screaming its green with nothing to back you up.

Back up this BS claim that homosexuals regularly engage in heterosexual sex for procreation or stop making this laughable claim.

And the dictionary have already disproven this false claim over and over again.

Your personal experience means nothing to this debate.

Sexual Intercourse
The act in which the external male reproductive organ—penis—enters the external/accessible female reproductive tract—vagina

Cite in the dictionary your BS claim of vaginal sex and how its any different than the definition of heterosexual sex I provided. I grow tired of you looking into a blue sky and screaming its green with nothing to back you up.

I have provided the sexual reprodcuation that requires heterosexual sex to prove heterosexuality is genetic.

You have provided NOTHING to back up your claims. Again. Either back them up with factual evidence or stop making them.

You assume incorrectly as lesbians are also homosexual.

It occurs in nature that doesn't mean its natural unless you are going to claim incest, rape, prostitution are all natural as well.

I have continued to cite the dictionary for all my claims. YOU HAVE CITED NOTHING TO BACK UP ANYTHING YOU HAVE CLAIMED. EVER.

Either back up your claims or stop making them but this war on the dictionary will end.

 

You did no such thing. You gave the definition of sexual intercourse. PLEASE back up your claim by finding the term "heterosexual" ANYWHERE in your dictionary definition. For extra credit, try explaining why it's nowhere to be found.

 

do you understand same sex marriages have no effect on this?

 

And where is any mention of "heterosexual" in your dictionary definition. Do you know why it is NOT there? You gave a definition of sexual intercourse. This does not help you. You can't provide a definition of one term, and keep insisting that it defines a completely differfent term. Since nobody could be that stupid, we can only assume you KNOW you're lying. But go ahead, find the word "heterosexual" in your definition. Go ahead.

So are you now claiming that no homosexual has ever become a parent? Ever? Are you feeling OK?

This is like claiming the sun doesn't rise in the morning. You are denying something that happens thousands of times a day across the US alone.

Wow. Just wow. Do you know how many people in traditional marriages, who have borne and raised several children, have come out and admitted they are homosexuals? Just in the last year? But just to give you a very highly publicized example, Ted Haggard was obliged (after having been caught red-handed) to admit he's been a lifelong homosexual. But he was so determined to convince himself otherwise that he married, and he and his wife had FIVE children. Yet he was a homosexual all his life. Cases like that are sad, and people like you are the cause of cases like that.

Consult your dictionary. Consult an encyclopedia. Consult a marriage counselor. Consult any knowledgeable person. You are making a category error. Ted Haggard had five children, yet was a homosexual all his life.

See "Ted Haggard". See "Elton John". Visit the gay community and ASK. My claim does not become BS because YOU are ignorant.

AND through sexual intercourse. AND through artificial insemination. Widen your horizons. Take off your blinders.

Until you can find the word "heterosexual" anywhere in your definition of something else entirely, I'm going to ignore this claim. It is false on the face of it.

It wasn't me who invented the term "closet".

I gave you the evidence. But until you have any idea what genes are, no presentation is going to be meaningful to you.

It only has to happen once to show that you're wrong.



Either back up these laughable claims of yours with factual evidence or stop making them.

Yes, let us read it together. All together now...

Oops, it does NOT say "heterosexual intercourse". You made up that part.

Yes, an act engaged in by those of all orientations. Your dictionary NEVER uses the terms "heterosexual" or "homosexual" because these terms do not apply.

We just went through it together. Sure enough, not a single mention of the word "heterosexual" anywhere. How can you continue to see a term which is not found in your definition?

Oops, STILL no mention of "heterosexual". Why do you suppose they omitted the one word on which your entire delusion rests. Do you think they forgot to use it?

Where? WHERE is the term "heterosexual" in your definition?

We just looked at it. You provided the definition of "sexual intercourse". You did NOT.

Maybe we need to step back for a moment here. You are (I think, anyway) claiming that "sexual intercourse" and "heterosexual sex" are the same thing. I'm saying that they are NOT the same thing, and that there is in fact no such thing as "heterosexual sex". And what that means is, you can provide the definition of "sexual intercourse" over and over, and that gets you no closer to demonstrating that it's the SAME THING as "heterosexual sex." As far as I can see, you are claiming that A=B, and then providing the definition of B over and over. And each time, you are becoming increasingy violent that the definition of B somehow proves that A=B. But of course it does not. It would be like me claiming that "paint" means the same thing as "blue" and then providing the definition of "paint" over and over, all the while expressing astonishment that you could be so stupid is NOT to see that the definition of "paint PROVES that "paint"and "blue" are synonyms.

In other words, "paint"

Excellent definition of "paint". But where is any mention of "blue"?

Sigh. You are not providing a definition of "heterosexual sex". You are providing a definition of sexual intercourse. No "heterosexual" anywhere in there. "Heterosexual sex" and "sexual intercourse" are NOT the same terms AT ALL. Defining one of them does NOT define the other.


[Sexual Intercourse[/quote]Oops, STILL no "heterosexual". No "homosexual" either. Define YOUR terms, not some different term

Nowhere have you EVER provided a definition of "heterosexual sex". Indeed, the very word "heterosexual" appears NOWHERE in your definitions. Can't you see that?

And you think I don't grow tired of watching you define B over and over and over, when the issue here is whether or not A=B. If A does not equal B, defining B is a waste of your time and of mine.

Homosexuals regularly engage in vaginal sex. See Ted Haggard. See Elton John.

I've run out of ways to explain to you that if the question is whether A=B, defining B over and over does not address that question. I have no dispute at all with the definition of sexual intercourse. I merely point out that people of all orientations engage in sexual intercourse.

Except of course it is a slam dunk refutation of your error.

Cite the word "heterosexual" in your definition. You would think that, heterosexual being the KEY WORD, that the definition might, you know, mention it somewhere. Right?

Sheesh, where to start. For the most part, sexual reproduction requires vaginal sex. But reproduction isn't a magic synonym for "genetic". Genetic requires genes, and apparently genes play no role in determining sexual orientation. Once again (you keep ignoring this, and I suppose you will again), there is no correlation between the orientation of the parents and the orientation of the offspring. Genetic characteristics REQUIRE that correlation. But I'm not going to C&P a textbook on genetics.

 

Read the link Flint. Its to heterosexual sex when queried.

I can't believe you are still trying to deny basic science.

het·er·o·sex·u·al (ht-r-sksh-l)
adj.
1. Sexually oriented to persons of the opposite sex.


You want more of the obvious?

sexual intercourse
or coitus or copulation

Act in which the male reproductive organ enters the female reproductive tract (see reproductive system). Various sexual activities (foreplay) lead to physiological changes that progress to orgasm (climax) and resolution (see sexual response). If it is completed, semen passes from the male into the female's body. If conditions favour fertilization, a sperm joins with an egg, and pregnancy begins (see fertility; reproduction); contraception can prevent this. Intercourse with an unwilling female is rape. See also reproductive behaviour; sexuality, human; sexually transmitted disease

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse



- - - Updated - - -

Don't strap on the tights and cape if you aren't going to answer the question rahl.

 

OK, now we're getting somewhere. Heterosexuality is an ORIENTATION, not a behavior. Sexual intercourse is a BEHAVIOR, not an orientation.

Once you grasp the basics, we can get more complex.

Yes, now you have defined the behavior, but not the orientation.

Can't you understand that homosexuals engage in vaginal sex? They really, really do. All the time. If you wish to call vaginal sex "heterosexual sex", you are still describing an activity, and not an orientation. Activites are not orientations. Orientations are not activities.

What's really funny is that when a homosexual male mates with a straight or lesbian woman, or when a lesbian woman mates with a straight or homosexual male, the clinical process you describe is exactly the same. You know, insertion, sperm, egg, the whole nine yards. Orientation has nothing to do with it.

 

Do you know what a non sequitur is?

Do you understand that same sex marriages do not effect anything you wrote about to which I responded?

 

Sigh. Not only is it in the hyperlink as the query with the result:


het·er·o·sex·u·al (ht-r-sksh-l)
adj.
1. Sexually oriented to persons of the opposite sex.


You want more of the obvious?

sexual intercourse
or coitus or copulation

Act in which the male reproductive organ enters the female reproductive tract (see reproductive system). Various sexual activities (foreplay) lead to physiological changes that progress to orgasm (climax) and resolution (see sexual response). If it is completed, semen passes from the male into the female's body. If conditions favour fertilization, a sperm joins with an egg, and pregnancy begins (see fertility; reproduction); contraception can prevent this. Intercourse with an unwilling female is rape. See also reproductive behaviour; sexuality, human; sexually transmitted disease

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse


Give it up flint. Your war on the dictionary is over.

Not what I said. I demanded you back up your claim that "its common" for homosexuals to have heterosexual sex and as predicted you couldn't back up your worthless claims. I accept your defeat.

So you can't back up your claim. I accept your defeat.

No. Give us this fantasy data where you are pulling this from.

No he wasn't a homosexual all his life since the act of procreation is a heterosexual act as the dictionary proves. And one example of someone coming out of the closet isn't proving your claim that is "common" for homosexuals. Where is your evidence?

Back up your BS. Cite the dictionary. Cite the encyclopedia. Cite any evidence whatsoever of your laughably false claims. Just once Flint, back up your outlandish claims with some documented FACTS

Two people do not make it "common". Try again.

And you have zero evidence that Teddy was gay all his life and just magically happened to have heterosexual sex producting 5 children.

Here's one for you Flint, how did the New York Mayor's wife go straight? Explain that. Was she "straight" all her life when she was having gay sex too? LOL

You want to widen your horizons here's a hint. Artificial insemination isn't heterosexual sex or vaginal sex or whatever else you want to call it.

I'm still waiting for the FACTS around your BS claim that its "common" for homosexuals to have heterosexual sex for procreation then go right back to gay sex.

het·er·o·sex·u·al (ht-r-sksh-l)
adj.
1. Sexually oriented to persons of the opposite sex.


You want more of the obvious?

sexual intercourse
or coitus or copulation

Act in which the male reproductive organ enters the female reproductive tract (see reproductive system). Various sexual activities (foreplay) lead to physiological changes that progress to orgasm (climax) and resolution (see sexual response). If it is completed, semen passes from the male into the female's body. If conditions favour fertilization, a sperm joins with an egg, and pregnancy begins (see fertility; reproduction); contraception can prevent this. Intercourse with an unwilling female is rape. See also reproductive behaviour; sexuality, human; sexually transmitted disease

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

You loose.

No evidence given to support your claim. I accept your defeat.

No evidence given to support your claim "The orientation is natural, but it is not genetic." . I accept your defeat.

LOL No it doesn't. Now you need the defintion of "common" as well?

Definition of common (adj)
Bing Dictionary

com·mon
[ kómmən ]

shared: belonging to or shared by two or more people or groups
of or for all: relating or belonging to the community as a whole
everyday: often occurring or frequently seen

Hint: 2 people out of millions doesn't make it common. Try reading the definition of words.

Its so sad you have to keep denying such basic facts.

In the words from the very definition (redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over Flint.

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

Maybe we need to step back for a moment here. You are (I think, anyway) claiming that "sexual intercourse" and "heterosexual sex" are the same thing.[/quote]

I am as well as the dictionary.

You can keep making these unsupported claims all you like, the facts speak for themselves.

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

In other words, "paint"

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.[/i]

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

Oops, STILL no "heterosexual". No "homosexual" either. Define YOUR terms, not some different term[/quote]

Top of the link.

sexual intercourse
(redirected from Heterosexual sex)

Sexual contact is then described in terms of the physical changes in a male and a female resulting in heterosexual intercourse.

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Heterosexual+intercourse

Game over.

 

Come back when you can answer the question you quoted.

 

I don't respond to non sequiturs. I pointed out how idiotic your statement was by showing you that same sex marriage doesn't effect that. it's been answered.

 

You quoted a question you did not answer. Come back when you can answer the question you quoted.

 

I don't respond to non sequiturs. I pointed out how idiotic your statement was by showing you that same sex marriage doesn't effect that. it's been answered.

 

I tire of this. Orientations and activities are different things. People of all orientations engage in all varieties of sex. There is no one-to-one correspondence or anything close.

But I am heartened to see the sheer depth of ignorance required to believe otherwise. Every time I see the profoundly ignorant depiction of genetics, or orientation, I can only nod. NO WONDER these people are so blind. They work very very hard at it.

So we're down to the basic question: What is it called, when a homosexual engages in vaginal sex? For ordinarly people, this is called sex.

I have given up trying to figure out if texmaster sincerely believes that when this happens, the homosexual is "really" heterosexual, or whether the sex is "really" homosexual, or indeed whether texmaster understands what an orientation is. I'm coming to the conclusion that he does not know because he WILL not know.

So, to make far better use of my time, I'm off to enjoy some heterosexual beer drinking. And to PROVE it's heterosexual, I provide the following:

So there! Can't get much more heterosexual than that!

 

Oops, my mistake. I CAN make it more heterosexual. Let's try again:

beer
[beer]
NOUN
1.an alcoholic beverage made by brewing and fermentation from cereals, usually malted barley, and flavored with hops and the like for a slightly bitter taste.
2. any of various beverages, whether alcoholic or not, made from roots, molasses or sugar, yeast, etc.: root beer; ginger beer.
3.an individual serving of beer; a glass, can, or bottle of beer: [sixe=6]We'll have three beers.[/size]

THERE! Now it is really really really heterosexual.

 

You quoted a question you did not answer. Come back when you can answer the question you quoted.

 

Your avatar is PERFECT. For you, and those who think like you, are dinosaurs, destined for extinction. Same sex marriage being legal in all 50 states is not a question of if, only when.

Sorry.

Though I would love to be in your physical presence when you learn that it has happened. That would amuse me to no end.

 

You tried to claim heterosexual sex doesn't exist. The dictionary proved it does.

You claimed sexual orientation and behavior are separate. The dictionary proved otherwise.

You tried to claim vaginal sex was different than heterosexual sex but backed up nothing.

You claimed it was "common" for homosexuals to have heterosexual sex and your definition of "common" was 2 examples, one without any evidence they were not heterosexual before "coming out" despite having 5 kids no less.

You couldn't explain how you can claim someone who comes out was gay all their life no matter how long they lived straight but couldn't respond to the question of how a gay person could come out straight.

You aren't responding because I've got you dead to rights with the dictionary itself. You have proved nothing of what you claim and you cannot respond to the challenges to your own false claims.

I accept your capitulation.

 

You fail to understand that the dictionary changes every year, to better fit mans current understanding of what words meaning are.

Pretty laughable. Not to mention there are several dictionaries out there with slight variations in meaning depending on which one you use.

Keep trying though.

 

BTW, of course OP threatds "drift" over 25 pages, but.....


anyone notice how quickly those antipathetic to gay rights wanted it to "drift" from a poll showing them TIED in the one state where they probably have a shot at "holding the line" as state by state begin allowing same-sex marriage???

 

I don't respond to non sequiturs. I pointed out how idiotic your statement was by showing you that same sex marriage doesn't effect that. it's been answered.

 

Which of course you provide zero evidence for that laughable claim.

If you are going to put on the tights and cape to save the day then show us. Back up your BS claims.

- - - Updated - - -

You quoted a question you did not answer. Come back when you can answer the question you quoted.

You responded to me Rahl. If you are going to quote a question then answer it.

 

I don't respond to non sequiturs. I pointed out how idiotic your statement was by showing you that same sex marriage doesn't effect that. it's been answered.

 

You quoted a question you did not answer. Come back when you can answer the question you quoted.

You responded to me Rahl. If you are going to quote a question then answer it.

You want to keep making false statements? Then show us where you answered it Rahl. Back up your false claim.

 

I don't respond to non sequiturs. I pointed out how idiotic your statement was by showing you that same sex marriage doesn't effect that. it's been answered.