"Render to Caesar what is Caesar's"

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by ibshambat, Jun 1, 2017.

  1. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

    Jul 2, 2015
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    One of the most famous sayings from Jesus is, “Render to Caesar what is Caeser's and to God what is God's.” The main issue here is, what is legitimately Caesar's?

    The coin was Caesar's; the salvation belonged to God. One was in charge of the body and the other was in charge of the soul. It is legitimate for Caesar to demand such things as that we contribute and follow the law.

    There are however other things that are not Caesar's. It is not up to Caesar to tell us how to think. It is not up to Caesar to tell us what personality we can have.

    With personality psychology, we see a vast overreach by Caesar into things that are not his business.

    According to personality psychology, some people are bad and can only be bad whatever they do. This contradicts most basic reason. If people are responsible for their actions then anyone can choose to act rightfully. If some people cannot act rightfully whatever they do, then people are not responsible for their actions. This is a worthless mentality, and one whose effects on the world have been horrible. People are being stigmatized for life, and nothing that they can do can improve that state of affairs.

    Into this situation then comes God. God says that any sinner can be redeemed. God says that anyone can choose to act rightfully. This includes them damn sociopaths and them damn narcissists. It says that regardless of how your mind has been formed, you can do the right thing.

    The reason is that anyone – including these people – have the capacity of choice. And anything with the capacity of choice can do the right thing.

    One claim frequently made is that people – especially these people – never change. In fact people change all the time in all sorts of ways and for all sorts of reasons. The Germans were complete jerks during the Second World War; they are not complete jerks now.

    If one is to keep rubbing another people's nose into manure, the person's nose will be brown. The nose will remain brown for as long as it is being rubbed into manure. A person consistently being treated based on the worst thing they've done will bring out the worst in the person. In that situation change will in fact be difficult. Whereas giving them breathing space will reduce that scenario.

    It is rightful for the society to enforce laws, but not to demonize people. If someone has committed a crime, prosecute it, but don't act as if the person cannot improve their behavior. Many can, and many do. Most sociopaths do not commit a serious crime. Whereas there are any number of perfectly normal people who do terrible things.

    It is certainly not up to either authorities or societies to tell people how they can think or what personality they can have. These things are not their authority; they are God's authority. There are things that are legitimately the province of secular authorities. These things are not one of them. Remember the saying of Jesus and act accordingly.
    DennisTate likes this.
  2. CourtJester

    CourtJester Well-Known Member

    Apr 1, 2013
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    Recidivism rates would tend to prove your arguement specious. Not to mention the irrelevance using the example of nations to demonstrate that individuals can change.
  3. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

    Feb 6, 2007
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    That was a pretty rebellious statement in the 1st century considering "what is God's" included the Holy Land.

    It was essentially saying the Romans should ****.
  4. Heretic

    Heretic Active Member

    Jul 11, 2011
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    This is correct.

    Christ was claiming that the Holy Lands belong to God and not the Roman Empire. It was a rebellious statement and sentiment.

    This also implies that Heaven belongs to God, a realm that is BEYOND the human realm. The Eternal Kingdom. Caesar, representing mankind, is mortal. Thus what a single man can rule, within one lifetime, is inferior to God since God represents immortality and multiple lifetimes.
  5. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Jul 7, 2012
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    My daughter has been greatly positively inspired by
    Mr. Todd White who wasted 22 years of his life as a
    drug addict........ but now that he has found Messiah Yeshua......
    he is on a mission to spread the love of G-d to everybody he meets.

    He is living proof of this principle......

    Luke 7:47

    Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little.
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2017

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