Republicans Warn Iran -- and Obama -- That Deal Won't Last

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by theferret, Mar 9, 2015.

  1. Cautiously Conservative

    Cautiously Conservative New Member Past Donor

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    What Treaty do you believe Israel has violated? This should be good.
     
  2. theferret

    theferret Well-Known Member

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    The Soviet Union did the same.....we did business with them (i.e., wheat trade) for decades. China is now seriously eating our lunch in trade/labor. So it stands to reason to make peace instead of war.

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    Republicans have been wailing since 2008 that damned near everything Obama does is either unconstitutional or nearing monarchy. So TFB if they get caught being sleazy.

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    you shouldn't talk when you haven't a clue. Here, for your education: http://www.law.asu.edu/library/RossBlakleyLawLibrary/ResearchNow/ResearchGuides/TreatiesandInternationalAgreements.aspx
     
  3. theferret

    theferret Well-Known Member

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    No, you don't think, spud.....nor do you read carefully and comprehensively. I said that the actions APPROACH treason as the GOP is trying to derail negotiations THAT THE PRESIDENT HAS CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT AND RULING to do so. http://www.law.asu.edu/library/Ross...Guides/TreatiesandInternationalAgreements.asp

    Throwing out 200 years of President i.e., Netanyahu and now this letter is essentially a lame version of the "October surprise". Here, for your education:

    http://www.israelshamir.net/shamirReaders/english/Parry--Iran-Divided-and-the-October-Surprise.php
     
  4. theferret

    theferret Well-Known Member

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    Beyond what Limbaugh tells you, what fact based proof is there of "tyranny" from a TWICE legally elected President?

    And I said "nearing treason", not actual treason. Pay attention.
     
  5. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    CONGRESS; LETTER TO NICARAGUA: 'DEAR COMANDANTE'
    By STEVEN V. ROBERTS
    Published: April 20, 1984

    WASHINGTON, April 19— Members of Congress are always writing ''Dear Colleague'' letters to other members, promoting a bill or noting an event. Now 10 Democratic lawmakers have written a ''Dear Comandante'' letter that is kicking up a fuss on Capitol Hill.

    http://www.nytimes.com/1984/04/20/us/congress-letter-to-nicaragua-dear-comandante.html

    Dear-Comandante.jpg

    Cheers
    Labour
     
  6. theferret

    theferret Well-Known Member

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    Only in your fevered mind.
     
  7. theferret

    theferret Well-Known Member

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    Ahhh, but had you actually read the link's contents, you would have noted the linked documentation to "respectable" journals and papers.

    Willful ignorance does not serve you well.

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    Hmmm, the actual law disagrees with you. but then again, facts never matter to fanatical beliefs and delusions.
     
  8. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The answer is NOT YET but soon.
     
  9. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Logan act.

    Firstly the Logan Act has never been used in prosecution, it is untested. Many doubt its Constitutionality.

    Secondly within the Logan Act it predicates that first the citizen must act "without authority of the United States." Congress and members of congress are authorities, and certainly so as it relates to the Constitutionally enumerated powers granted to Congress in respect to regulating foreign relations.

    Ferret, the Constitution gives both branches power in the Foreign Relations realm, this isn't a question then of law but of politics. This is a political argument not a Constitutional one.

    History is replete with instances of Congressional members traveling to, speaking to, writing to foreign actors, some legitimate heads of state, some self appointed leaders of armed insurgencies / rebellions.

    Here are a few:

    Senators John Sparkman (D-AL) and George McGovern (D-SD). The two Senators visited Cuba and met with government actors there in 1975. They said that they did not act on behalf of the United States, so the State Department ignored their activity.

    House Speaker Jim Wright (D-TX). In 1984, 10 Democrats sent a letter to Daniel Ortega Saavedra, the head of the military dictatorship in Nicaragua, praising Saavedra for “taking steps to open up the political process in your country.” House Speaker Jim Wright signed the letter.

    In 1987, Wright worked out a deal to bring Ortega to the United States to visit with lawmakers.
    Ortega then sat next to Wright as he presented a “detailed cease-fire proposal.” The New York Times said, “Mr. Ortega seemed delighted to turn to Mr. Wright.”


    Representatives Jim McDermott (D-WA), David Bonior (D-MI), and Mike Thompson (D-CA).
    In 2002, the three Congressmen visited Baghdad to play defense for Saddam Hussein’s regime. There, McDermott laid the groundwork for the Democratic Party’s later rip on President George W. Bush, stating, “the president of the United States will lie to the American people in order to get us into this war.” McDermott, along with his colleagues, suggested that the American administration give the Iraqi regime “due process” and “take the Iraqis on their face value.” Bonior said openly he was acting on behalf of the government:

    The purpose of our trip was to make it very clear, as I said in my opening statement, to the officials in Iraq how serious we–the United States is about going to war and that they will have war unless these inspections are allowed to go unconditionally and unfettered and open. And that was our point. And that was in the best interest of not only Iraq, but the American citizens and our troops. And that’s what we were emphasizing. That was our primary concern–that and looking at the humanitarian situation.

    And of course Nancy Pelosi's trip to Syria to visit Bashar Assad in 2007. There, according to The New York Times, the two “discussed a variety of Middle Eastern issues, including the situations in Iraq and Lebanon and the prospect of peace talks between Syria and Israel.” Pelosi was accompanied by Reps. Henry Waxman (D-CA), Tom Lantos (D-CA), Louise M. Slaughter (D-NY), Nick J. Rahall II (D-WV), and Keith Ellison (D-MN). Zaid Haider, Damascus bureau chief for Al Safir, reportedly said, ‘There is a feeling now that change is going on in American policy – even if it’s being led by the opposition.”

    Cheers
    Labour
     
  10. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So should Pelosi be prosecuted? You realize that Congress is United States authority don't you?
     
  11. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ferret, if it was foreign commerce in Article 1 that has you suggesting exclusivity to the Executive on foreign relations, read the rest of the Article where Congress declares war, if that isn't the penultimate power in foreign policy I'm not sure what would be. Congress and the Executive negotiate agreements with foreign powers, the hammer to those agreement is the punctuation mark the Constitution places in the hands of Congress, it is the final period in any Treaty with the united states. Congress can punctuate the treaty with a pen, or a bullet.

    Cheers
    Labour
     
  12. WSUwarrior

    WSUwarrior Banned

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    Heres one for you:

    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


    Your side doesnt mind undermining that law.
     
  13. Paperview

    Paperview Well-Known Member

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    You mean when Issa and other GOP leaders were there too?


    [​IMG]
    The AP reports that Rep. Darrell Issa (R-CA) met with Syrian President Bashar Assad today in Damascus. And according to the article, Issa criticized the administration while on the visit:


    Republican Congressman Darrell Issa Currently In Syria For Talks



    Hmmm...

    Republican "Hobson defended Pelosi, saying she “did not engage in any bashing of Bush in any meeting I was in and she did not in any meeting I was in bash the policies as it relates to Syria.”
     
  14. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    100++ Exactly.

    Cheers
    Labour
     
  15. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    I am going from memory here, but I don't think so, Vietnam was never declared or made a war. It was a police action.
     
  16. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    I noticed it was completely ignored.
    Guess when they have fact presented they don't know how to react.
    This is not a US negotiation, it is several nations who have the power to enforce sanctions negotiating.
     
  17. HB Surfer

    HB Surfer Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    http://www.csmonitor.com/1985/0718/aker.html

    You're welcome.
     
  18. Labouroflove

    Labouroflove Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes. It's not treason, it's not a crime, it's not action contrary to the Constitution. Visiting a foreign power, gathering information on the personalities and issues involved, expressing concerns on the issues directly to foreign powers, offering solutions and suggestions to foreign powers, offering insight to the foreign powers on process within our system... ... it is all legal and at times necessary to reach a meeting of the minds which is the basis for any agreement.

    Prior to ratifying an agreement between the United States and a foreign power both the executive and the legislative branches of our government have serious responsibilities and legitimate active roles in the process, some legal some political.

    Cheers
    Labour
     
  19. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Seeing there are a million ways to commit treason that don't involve treaty negotiations, I can only conclude you're under the impression those are synonyms for stupidity.

    Actually the record shows it made sense to at least one other person; but regardless of that, even such a creature as yourself might be able to figure out that I would hardly expect it to make any sense to your ilk.

    Have they indeed? Surely, then, you can name the treaty to which Israel is a signatory which prohibits it from possessing nuclear armaments.

    Prove it.
     
  20. Yosh Shmenge

    Yosh Shmenge New Member

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    I don't even know who you are and have never addressed you so I don't know
    where you get the idea you can correct me. By the way, using all caps is considered the same as rudely yelling at others so file that away and use the advice wisely. You're welcome.

    There is nothing improper about an open letter to the Iranian Mullahs. Don't plotz over it.
     
  21. Bluespade

    Bluespade Banned

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    You shouldn't even talk when you can't even properly link a source.
     
  22. AlphaOmega

    AlphaOmega Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If I do, will it really matter to you? So you've never heard of Obama releasing 5 terrorists in trade for a traitor? You've never paid attention to what Obama is doing in Iran right now which is paving the way for them to get nuclear weapons?
     
  23. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Of course that is a lie. When has it been said obama wants Iran to get nuclear weapons? Other than RW nutter shows, which are also telling lies.
     
  24. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]




    rush to war - but I bet they wouldn't be so intent on it if all war profits were taxed at a 100% rate
     
  25. theunbubba

    theunbubba Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You're the one who needs to pay attention and stop the ad hominem attacks.
    You libs always try to denigrate people who don't agree with you. Guess what, it just makes you look like a third grader.

    He wasn't twice legally elected. He was installed by a compliant media and the intimidation of voters.
     

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