Should Israel crown Donald J. Trump as Moshiach ben Ephrayim?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by DennisTate, Apr 22, 2021.

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Should Israel crown Donald J. Trump as their constitutional monarch?

  1. Yes

    8 vote(s)
    40.0%
  2. No

    9 vote(s)
    45.0%
  3. Well...... he would probably do that too for one shekel per year and he will do a lot for them...

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Yes... recovering from the economic aspects of COVID 19 makes doing this worthwhile...

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. No.... Rabbi Alon Anava would be better.....

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. No... there is somebody else!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. other... please explain in a reply....

    3 vote(s)
    15.0%
  1. The Amazing Sam's Ego

    The Amazing Sam's Ego Banned at Members Request

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    The Old Testament doesn't mention the term second coming, just like it doesn't mention the Trinity, but the details regarding it are mentioned. The Old Testament says that the Messiah is God. https://www.gotquestions.org/Zechariah-14-4-second-coming.html

    https://www.gotquestions.org/Trinity-Bible.html

     
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  2. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The word translated God or god in parts of the Bible can be kind of confusing............
    and even offensive......

    John chapter ten....

    32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

    33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for ablasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself bGod.

    34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are agods?

    35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

    36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath asanctified, and bsent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the cSon of God?

    37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.

    38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, abelieve the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the bFather is in me, and I in him.


    https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/nt/john/10?lang=eng
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2021
  3. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    There are different people in the Old Testament who have the role of a Messiah but they are not the Messiah. Only God saves, nobody is a Savior.
     
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  4. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I agree......
    the final Elijah will likely be somehow anointed... whatever that means... to pull off his major league To Do List:


    http://www.drbo.org/chapter/26048.htm

     
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  5. The Amazing Sam's Ego

    The Amazing Sam's Ego Banned at Members Request

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    Rabbinic Judaism is based off of the teachings of the Pharisees who rejected Jesus out of pride. They didn't believe that the Messiah was God because they wanted to be their own god and wanted the Messiah to deliver them from political oppression, they didn't understand His mission.
     
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  6. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I totally agree with this statement but certain Rabbi's are taking another look at the history of how Rabbinic Judaism separated so dramatically from Messianic Judaism at the time of the Bar Kochba Revolt.





    Unbelievable! Orthodox religious speaks for Jesus! (Full Interview)
     
  7. The Amazing Sam's Ego

    The Amazing Sam's Ego Banned at Members Request

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    The mistakes of the church have nothing to do with God dying for his creation. People confuse the sinful nature of human beings with who God is.
     
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  8. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That is absolutely true.....
    but if even one Messianic Jew had been there at Masada......
    perhaps they would have felt free to at least shoot a few arrows at the Romans on Shabbat as they were building that ramp to attack the remaining soldiers at Masada.


    "And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace." (Mark 3:4)


    http://www.drbo.org/chapter/45002.htm

     
  9. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here is the website for Rabbi Ariel Cohen Alloro:


    https://www.facingeachother.com/

    The Jewish Orthodox Initiative for the
    Legal Return of Yeshua / Jesus to the Israel
    & his Public Retrial





    ‘I am the chosen one’: Trump again plays on messianic claims as he embraces ‘King of Israel’ title


     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2021
  10. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  11. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Jesus came before the destruction of the second temple and he will gather in the exiles. https://beginningandend.com/all-israel-shall-be-saved-the-end-times-salvation-of-israel/

     
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  12. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    But for a time that regathering will be done by Messiah Yeshua - Jesus significantly through a very flawed and real human with the mantle of Elijah for this time period as well as by the Cyrus type, (Moshiach ben Ephrayim / Messian son of Joseph / Yosef), who will fulfill aspects of Isaiah chapter forty five that even the final Elijah could not accomplish.


    https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/mat/17/11/s_946011

    "And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things."
     
  13. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Israel will be regathered when their Messiah returns. http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/End of the World/israel_regathered.htm


     
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  14. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The sending forth of Messiah Son of David to fulfill every word in Zechariah chapter fourteen......
    and then every word about the millennium....... (the Era of Moshiach) .....
    is one part of what must happen......
    but there is also the issue of raising up King David himself.......

    .... which could be a somewhat separate issue.


    Jeremiah 30:9
    "But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them."

    If Orthodox Jewish scholar Yair Davidiy is correct in many of his theories than November of 1996 was significant somehow in the process of raising up King David....... after whom the Throne of David is named.

    By 2185 or so Messiah Yeshua - Jesus wishes to make all of this clear and easy to understand.


    https://near-death.com/howard-storm-nde/

    ....
    That part of the near death experience of Howard Storm in my opinion.....
    fulfills this promise regarding making the predictions in Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel and the minor prophets easy to understand.


    "These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father." (John 16:25)
     
  15. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Do you think amillenialism is replacement theology? https://www.gotquestions.org/amillennialism.html

     
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  16. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes.... to at least some degree we Christians tend to NOT have the belief in every word in Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, the minor prophets and in the Psalms and in the Law that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus Himself obviously had.

    Technically I believe firmly in the following statements.....
    but I am sure that my comprehension of all of this is miniscule in comparison to what will really happen in the not too distant future.....


    https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/zec/14/1/s_925001


    And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

    And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

    And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.

    This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.

    In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD'S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.


    Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts. (vs 16 - 21)
     
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  17. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Replacement theology is anti semetic. https://www.gotquestions.org/replacement-theology.html

    https://jewsforjesus.org/blog/why-many-jewish-people-think-christianity-is-anti-semitic

     
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  18. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I totally agree that Replacement Theology is anti-Semitic and I feel that Jewish scholars may well have an advantages over Christians like myself when it comes to understanding the interesting similarities between Isaiah chapter forty five that seem to parallel many aspects of what has been done through President Donald J. Trump.


    https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/ot/isa/45?lang=eng

    Verses four and five imply a political leader who does not really know the G-d of Abraham... much like ancient King Cyrus who was Zoroastrian..... not Jewish.

    Verse 13... President Donald J. Trump has already been used by G-d to free many captives..... did it for free....... donated his own money to many causes on top of all of that...... and I believe that G-d is just getting started with him.


    One of the reasons why I began this discussion is that I have been wondering for decades if we Christians are supposed to support the Jewish people somehow to build at least one temple...... (maybe two temples)....... before Zechariah chapter fourteen can fully come to pass. (And for all I know the full meaning there in Zechariah chapter fourteen may be far more of a metaphor for 2021 than I would tend to imagine because in a way..... the nation of Israel in 2021 are divided between vaccinated vs non-vaccinated.......... which is forcing all of us to reconsider our relationship with our Creator).
     
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  19. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Isaiah 45 is not a messianic prophecy.
     
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  20. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In one sense it is relevant to my beliefs regarding Messiah Yeshua - Jesus in that I personally believe that Jesus is the main figure in the Life Review of near death experience accounts.


    "For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:" (John 5:22)

    "And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man." (John 5:27)


    If Messiah Yeshua - Jesus did not have an approach to doing judgment that was somewhat like Ancient King Cyrus of Persia who gave freedom of religion not only to Jews..... but to one hundred and twenty seven different kingdoms...... then the near death experience accounts of Atheists and Hindus and Buddhists and Muslims would not have been so positive in so many cases.


    https://near-death.com/an-analysis-of-the-ndes-of-atheists/
    An Analysis of the Near-Death Experiences of Atheists
    BY KEVIN WILLIAMSPOSTED ON SEPTEMBER 24, 2019

     
  21. The Amazing Sam's Ego

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    Do you think Jesus mentioned the Millennium Kingdom and amillenialism spiritualizes God's promise to the Jewish people? https://int.icej.org/media/replacement-theology

     
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    The devil is a deceiver who lies to people about who Christ is. There is so much evidence for Christ that you can't deny it, so people will say that he was a good man or a prophet. https://www.compellingtruth.org/near-death-experiences.html

     
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  23. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That is a good quotation.... to my thinking Romans chapters nine, ten and eleven make it clear that the time would come in the future when all the promises in the Law and the Prophets would come to pass.
     
  24. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The near death experience of former Atheist Howard Storm sure seems to fit with 2 Corinthians 12:2-4 and the fruits borne in his life afterwards proves that he was totally convinced of the truth of what he saw during his experience.


    https://near-death.com/howard-storm-nde/






    Howard Storm NEAR DEATH EXPERIENCE! | What Happened to Him in Hell!! | Saved by Jesus from Hell!
     
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  25. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In your opinion am I somewhat deceived to take a passage in Isaiah chapter forty six to mean that somebody in the latter days....... years or even perhaps decades before Zechariah chapter fourteen can be fully fulfilled.......
    must receive the Holy Spirit in the form of a bird of prey......
    which is quite different from how Messiah Yeshua - Jesus received the Holy Spirit in the form of a dove........


    https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/isa/46/1/s_725001

    "Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it." (Isaiah 46:11)


    Prophet Kim Clement predicted that President Donald J. Trump would have a radical conversion experience ..... after serving as President for some time..... that sure seemed to fit with the idea of him receiving a massive anointing of the Holy Spirit.

    The USA is certainly a "far country" when viewed from the point of view of Jerusalem.

    This prediction of betrayal in the White House sure reminds me of recent events.



    Kim Clement's AMAZING Fulfilled Prophecy: BETRAYALS IN THE WHITE HOUSE
     

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