So When Do REPUBS IMPEACH BIDEN?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by DEFinning, Nov 9, 2022.

  1. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Really? None of that was in the timeline. Or was this one of those things that Trump says he did, just by thinking it, so that, like with the document declassifications, there would be no records of it?

    Please supply a source for each of your claims, above.



    * Which is, specifically, the Capitol Police Board, on which, Speaker Pelosi does not sit-- as no one but you & the Peanut gallery, would expect her to be a security expert. Yet you continually imply that Pelosi and her staff were involved in meetings dealing with Capitol security concerns. I see zero evidence of this, in the timeline I supplied. And you have offered exactly zero supporting evidence, that this was at all expected to be the Speaker's responsibility. I guess that means that there isn't any evidence of truth, to your personal theory?
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
  2. Condor060

    Condor060 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Still falsifying claims for your fake theories.
    Heres your chance
    Show us where I posted anything about Pelosi being empowered to call to NG troops.
    If you're going to just fake claims, its best they aren't posted on a board you can't change.
     
  3. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why don't you make a "big boy" argument? Or maybe even an adult one, which would rise above your "Nuh- uh!/Uh- huh!" level nonsense, above. This was the claim, to which my quote had been responding:

    popscott said: ↑
    @DEFinning..... nice try.... the guards were authorized on Jan 4..


    Did I somehow miss that part? Please cite the specific entry in the timeline, which "supports US not YOU," with regard to the "pre-authorization" claim.

    The only thing that Trump authorized, were 340 Guardsman, to help DC police with traffic & crowd control, as at "subway stations." This
    had nothing to do with protecting the Capitol: it was in direct response to a request from D.C. Mayor Bowser. There is an additional contingent of 40 Guards, as a dedicated quick reaction force, authorized by Acting Defense Secretary, Christopher Miller-- not by Trump. Unfortunately, though (as I had already quoted from this timeline), the Pentagon later prevented the commander of these Guard forces, Maj. General Walker, from being able to use them, without first getting approval from people higher up on the pole-- so much for "quick" reaction force; and so much for "pre-approval."


    <Snip>
    Jan. 3: The Department of Defense confirms with Capitol Police that there is no request for DoD support, according to the Pentagon.

    Acting Defense Secretary Christopher Miller meets with “select Cabinet Members to discuss DoD support to law enforcement agencies and potential requirements for DoD support,” the Pentagon says.

    Miller and Gen. Mark Milley, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, meet with Trump, according to the Department of Defense.
    Trump agrees to activate the D.C. National Guard to support D.C. police (not Capitol Police) with crowd and traffic control. The Pentagon later tells Pro Publica, “The President had no role in tactical matters as the capabilities deployed and location were dictated solely by the request from D.C. government.”

    D.C. Police Chief Robert Contee says 340 guardsmen will assist with crowd management and traffic control to free up the city police officers to respond to potential acts of violence and other security issues, according to CNN.

    Jan. 4: Capitol Police again confirms there is no need for DoD support in a phone call with Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy, according to the Pentagon. Miller, in consultation with Milley, McCarthy and DoD general counsel, “reviews the Department’s plan to be prepared to provide support to civil authorities, if asked, and approves activation of 340 members of the DCNG to support Mayor Bowser’s request.” The support is mostly for traffic control, crowd control at subway stations and logistics support. Miller also authorizes McCarthy to deploy a “Quick Reaction Force” of 40 National Guard members staged at Joint Base Andrews in Maryland “if additional support is requested by civil authorities.”
    <End>


    So, for those who have trouble reading, or who don't bother to do so, this shows that it is a false claim, that then President Trump had "authorized" any Guardsmen, specifically for the Capitol's possible security needs.

     
  4. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your citing of Pelosi getting involved, to look over the shoulders of the Capitol Police Board, after the Capitol assault (in September of 2022?, or 2021) is not evidence that she had been involved in earlier deliberations, in January of 2021. The J6 Committee has gotten testimony from all those willing to testify, about security arrangements, and Pelosi's name hasn't come up. One would think anyone would find that incredible, if she had taken any part in the security planning. The reasonable conclusion, since you obviously need someone to tell you, is that because of what happened on January 6th, Pelosi NO LONGER has full faith in the judgement of the Board, which she'd had no reason not to trust, to do its job, until after January sixth.
     
  5. DEFinning

    DEFinning Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Learn how to read. I pegged exactly one claim to you: that Pelosi had turned down NG troops, offered by the Trump Admin. So, I proved that you were wrong about Trump offering troops; and I proved that you were wrong about Pelosi turning them down. And you're going to object to something, that I never claimed, you'd said?

    A real piece of work.
    This is what you'd quoted me saying, to Bluesguy:

    DEFinning said: ↑
    Pelosi and her staff, were out of the loop, regarding security decisions, at the Capitol. There is no mention, in all of the detail, of anyone ever filling in the Speaker, on security developments; nor indication that she is empowered to requisition additional law enforcement or National Guard troops. Nor is there evidence of these troops being offered to, but turned down by, Speaker Pelosi (which at least @Condor060 , incessantly claimed).



    I guess you just assume everything is about you? Once again-- learn how to read! The only thing that I attribute to you, is in that last sentence, which I've bolded, for your clearly-needed assistance.


    So, no comment, on your being
    totally wrong, on that count?

    (Why am I not surprised?)
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
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  6. dixon76710

    dixon76710 Well-Known Member

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    You mean like him telling the crowd to "peacefully march" to the Capitol so "your voices can be heard"
     
  7. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    Noooooooo , you must have it wrong.
    The left have twisted his speech to "march to the Capitol" "And we fight. We fight like hell And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore."
    What am I missing?
     
  8. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    He had intelligence a problem was coming.
    He had a number of options, including using the Metro Police. He didn't want to break the faith with the Capitol rioter types the same way liberal pols don't want to upset protesting leftwingers.
    I don't think the moderates everyone is fighting over (you can't win elections without moderate support) would be upset if the troops were there and something happened, or the troops were their and everything was peaceful.
     
  9. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    You keep citing rightwingers propagandizing about the law. I'm the one citing the law
    He had the authority and didn't send them. We saw the results of inaction, by Trump and other pols who could have done something.
     
  10. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Trump could have stationed a large Guard force at the Capitol end of the Mall. I think that alone would might have prevented the violence. If it didn't, the troops would have been in an excellent position to end the violence quickly.
    The part where you're wrong about him not having been able to call up the Guard before the bad guys started causing problems.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
  11. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Remember, the law begins...

    "Whenever the President considers that unlawful obstructions, combinations, or assemblages, or rebellion against the authority of the United States, make it impracticable to enforce the laws of the United States..."​

    If you want to suggest the law doesn't put enough checks on the President, you won't get blowback from me.
    I don't know if fifty would have been enough, but maybe they could have got the job done with 250--or 500. There is plenty a lot of people could have done.
    The failure to protect the Capitol is not just about Trump. If we climb down from our partisan horses, we might be able to figure out how to stop this from happening again. A comprehensive look would be asking questions about the actions of the Capitol Police, Metro Police, DC mayor, Congressional leadership and the President.

    Someone dropped the ball.
     
  12. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    Trump was not responsible for the Capitol security....

    But..... The CP and overseers Pelosi and ilk could have stationed a large Guard force at the Capitol end of the Mall.... but they didn't.
     
  13. dixon76710

    dixon76710 Well-Known Member

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    But of course, he doesnt have the authority to station troops before the breach occurred.
     
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  14. dixon76710

    dixon76710 Well-Known Member

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    Im not suggesting any such thing. Got anything relevant to my post you quoted?

    They could of handled it easily with another 50, riot equipped local police.
     
  15. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes the righ cites the Constitution and the law not specious left wing spin as evidenced in your post.

    AGAIN exactly when are you claiming he had the authority to send the US military onto the streets of DC.
     
  16. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    When exactly did that occur?
     
  17. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    So, Trump supporters storming the capital, disrupting the proceedings of the joint session of congress to count the electoral college votes, the members calling for Pence, Pelosi and others to be hanged is not insurrection? Then what is it? A tea party?

    Yes it was Trump's job. He is literally the CNC of the armed forces and knew that violence may occur. But he didn't care, did he just like you don't care. But that is to be expected.
     
  18. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    YES she is the top dog at the Capital and involved. Just as she ordered the fencing to remain after the riot. So when are we going to see her emails, he meeting notes and hear her testimony as to what she was told before Jan 6 and what were her instructions? No one with a rational thought would find it credible that with the FBI the DOJ the HSA and even the President urging additional security be deployed to the Capital she was kept in the dark and had no voice in the matter.

    What are you so scared of having a compete investigation as to the lack of preparation at the Capital?
     
  19. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    You guys have not cited one law or the Constitution. You have practically ignored it when you say, "what could he have done" or "it was not his responsibility."
     
  20. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump did not authorize them the President doesn't authorize the SECARMY does how many times to you have to be told that. Those 340 Guardsmen were the ONLY addtional the mayor requested and she SPECIFICALLY and UNEQUIVICALLY told the SecArmy and DoD to NOT send ANY additional troops.


    Proving my post. There were no request from the Capital in spite of the urgings of federal law enforcement.

    Again refuting your own claims.
     
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump admin was ready to deploy National Guard on Jan 6, Capitol Police timeline shows


    What we also know is that President Trump wanted to make sure that the people that came, that there was a safe environment for that kind of assembly,” former President Donald Trump’s Chief of Staff Mark Meadows told Fox News’s Sean Hannity.And I’ve said that publicly before — the 10,000 National Guard troops that he wanted to make sure that everything was safe and secure," Meadows said. "Obviously having those National Guards available, actually the reason they were able to respond when they did, was because President Trump had actually put them on alert.
    https://mynbc15.com/news/nation-wor...-capitol-police-timeline-shows-january-donald

    "In
    testimony before the House Oversight Committee in an answer to a direct question from Rep. Byron Donalds (R-FL), Miller said that the President told him to “do whatever was necessary to protect the demonstrators that were executing their constitutionally protected rights.” That statement is consistent with an email Meadows sent to an individual on Jan. 5, which “said that the National Guard would be present to ‘protect pro Trump people’ and that many more would be available on standby,” according to records Meadows provided the House select committee.

    On the late afternoon or evening of Jan. 5, the President spoke with Miller (who was reportedly with Patel) and said that the acting secretary of defense should have as many as 10,000 troops on hand for the following day – which Miller did not follow through on. That’s according to Miller’s written testimony before the House oversight committee, his interview with the Defense Department inspector general, and his statements to the press. It’s also consistent with Trump’s own account. A discrepancy is that Meadows referred to it as a “direct order” from the President (in a Feb. 7, 2021 interview with Fox host Maria Bartiromo), Trump said it was a “recommend[ation]” and “suggestion,” given “not as an order” (in a Dec. 11, 2021 public event). Miller described his reaction, “And we’re like, ‘Maybe. But you know, someone’s going to have to ask for it.’” What’s more, “Miller and other senior Pentagon officials did not relay the 10,000 figure to anyone outside the Defense Department, according to a former U.S. official who was familiar with the matter,” reported the Washington Post fact checker Glenn Kessler.
    https://www.justsecurity.org/79623/crisis-of-command-the-pentagon-the-president-and-january-6/




    And to whom do they report? They are not some totally independent government agency who reports to no one. LET"S FIND OUT? What was Pelosi told about the threats that the FBI the DOJ the HSA was urging telling telling them? What did she ask of security in preparation? Seeing ZERO involvement is as bad as she turned why wasn't she being consulted according to you SHE IS IN CHARGE. If we are going to have a FULL Investigation that should be top of the list.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2022
  22. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What are you talking about the Supreme Court. We know what he was doing, he was speaking when the Capital was breeched and the riot inside the Capital began. When he finished he went back to the WH and by the time he got back there and was informed of what was happening the troops were already being authorized to go to the Capital. What is it you are claim he could have, should have done at that point? The deployment was not waiting of nor did it require his approval or signature or order to proceed. And TWICE in the first hours he called for peace and the people there to respect the police and follow their orders.
     
  23. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    WHY was she out of the loop then? She is in charge at the Capital they all report to her. Prove she was out of the loop lets see the communications, lets hear the testimony and find out WHY she was totally ignorant of the lack or preparations as you claim. And Trump is not a "security professional" yet you claim HE was the one who should have ordered in extra security.

    So to whom does Capital Security report? Who is their BOSS. Who has ultimate responsibility for the Capital? I have already showed you where she has a role in Capital security with other orders she has given as far as security at the Capital.
     
  24. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We've been all over you guys had not provided one law or the Constitution that states the President is in charge of domestic law enforcement.

    You guys keep ignoring that both the Capital and the DC mayor were explicit and unequivocal they did NOT want additional NG guard troops on the street or at the Capital and THEY are in charge of security in their respective jurisdictions not the PRESIDENT.
     
  25. Joe knows

    Joe knows Well-Known Member

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    I think they will investigate joes boy and find out what was all done during his time as VP and how he used his office for financial gain for him and his family. If that yields information of the sort then it stands to reason to impeach him.

    also under a Republican controlled purse I guarantee the deficit will be lowered. So yes I think it’s good they are in the house.
     

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