Texas vs The Blue Basket Cases

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by starbow, Aug 17, 2011.

  1. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    The critics have come out of the woodwork attempting to "explain" the Texas economic record over the past few years. Texas has created just less than 37% of the jobs created during the Obama recession, and Texas has only 10% of the US population. why? The Obamabots try to explain it away as the result of a growing oil and gas industry, military contracts, and the Obama stimulus. :lol: the arguments made by the Left are so assinine that they really do make those of us living here in Texas laugh. The reason for the fact that Texas freeways are clogged with California, Michigan, and Florida license plates is because Texas is a business friendly state which is attracting businesses from all over and creating significant numbers homegrown. People immigrate to employment, they emigrate from poor prospects. In the article below, Hemingway puts a different slant on the attacks on Perry and the Texas record. - Starbow

    _________________________________________


    http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/dont-mess-texas-economic-record_588300.html

    Don't Mess With Texas's Economic Record

    Rick Perry's entrance into the presidential race scares liberal critics
    Aug 15, 2011 • By MARK HEMINGWAY


    One surefire way to tell that Rick Perry's entry into the presidential race is having a big impact is the sheer number of hit pieces that have been written against him in a 48-hour period. (See here, here, here, here...I could go on.)

    I'm sure some of that is due to an oppo dump from other GOP candidates hoping to step on Perry's momentum. However, there's one theme from liberals that I suspect you'll hear a lot of, a la the latest Krugman column, which is the furious accusation that Texas' low taxes and business-friendly regulation haven't really created a lot of jobs:

    'What Texas shows is that a state offering cheap labor and, less important, weak regulation can attract jobs from other states.'

    I believe that the appropriate response to this insight is “Well, duh.” The point is that arguing from this experience that depressing wages and dismantling regulation in America as a whole would create more jobs — which is, whatever Mr. Perry may say, what Perrynomics amounts to in practice — involves a fallacy of composition: every state can’t lure jobs away from every other state.

    Krugman's paragraph here explains a lot about why "Keynesian" should probably be a bigger slur than "former Enron adviser." For one thing, job creation is not a zero-sum game. Texas hasn't created over 40 percent of the country's new jobs just by taking them away from other states. A lot of those jobs wouldn't exist, period, if Texas didn't create a tax a regulatory climate to encourage them -- Texas added 732,000 jobs in the last decade, and no other state created more than 100,000. If Krugman's unimpressed, that's because he's the one that's trading in fallacies here.

    Further, it's revealing that Krugman offers up only the most facile comparisons between Texas and blue states. In a single sentence, he brags about Massachusetts unemployment rate and high rate of health insurance relative to Texas, when both states are significantly below the national average in unemployment. Further, Krugman doesn't note how significant differences in demographics or immigration might affect employment in these states. And Krugman sure as heck isn't going to mention this:

    State officials have successfully increased health insurance coverage in the state: With only 2.6 percent of the population now lacking health insurance, its insurance rate is the highest in the nation. But high coverage levels have been achieved at a substantial price, and one that is expected to increase over time.

    For the state’s policymakers, rapidly rising health-care costs are the central problem with the plan. Since 2006, the cost of the state’s insurance program has increased by 42 percent, or almost $600 million. According to an analysis by the Rand Corporation, “in the absence of policy change, health care spending in Massachusetts is projected to nearly double to $123 billion in 2020, increasing 8 percent faster than the state’s gross domestic product (GDP).”

    This isn't exactly a surprise, but Krugman's being spectacularly dishonest here. He also fails to mention that Texas has twice closed massive budget deficits under Perry's tenure as governor -- without raising taxes. The fact that Texas has its fiscal house in order, unlike just about every other blue state, surely has something to do with Texas' economic growth. The reality is that just about every other blue state is a governing basket case when compared to Texas, and the comparison is revealing and instructive.

    "Government isn't difficult in theory," Texas Republican Gov. Rick Perry told National Review in 2009. "Don't spend all the money, keep taxes low, have a fair and predictable regulatory climate, keep frivolous lawsuits to a minimum, and fund an accountable education system so that you have a skilled work force available. Then get the hell out of the way and let the private sector do what the private sector does best."

    Perry doesn't have a Nobel Prize in economics, but despite Krugman's sophistry, I suspect that American voters know common sense when they hear it.
     
  2. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nothing like a little partisan spin on Perry's economic record.

    Of course, nothing is said of the 550,000 jobs at or below minimum wage (tied with miss. for last place).

    Or the fact that his policies still have left the state with higher unemployment rate than when he came into office and higher than New York or Mass.

    Or the fact that Texas ranks 44th in expenditures per public school student.

    Or the fact that Texas ranks 50th in number of adults and children with health care coverage.

    Or the fact that the $15billion in cuts he has instituted over the next two years are projected to cut at least 100,000 jobs.

    Or the fact that the 2010 budget gap was 97% filled with Stimulus Money from Obama. That was $6.4 billion - this after telling Obama et.al. to butt out of state affairs.

    Or the fact that he had nothing to do with the boom in oil jobs and ranks only 26th in unemployment rate.

    Or the fact that he created a slush fund to lure companies to Texas and so far has spend $450 million. Hmmmmm government involvement in the private sector? geez what will he think of next.

    There's lots of ways of spinning information. However, when you strip it down, the end result is that Perry just ain't what the republicans desperately hope he is.
     
  3. Mac-7

    Mac-7 Banned

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    Oh my gosh.

    Texas is infested with refugees from New York and Mass.
     
  4. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    yes, there are lotsa of ways to spin information and half truths, and the above post accomplishes that.

    but you can't spin the migration into Texas from the Blue states - the jobs seem to be here, not there. And if it was nothing but min wage jobs, no one would migrate, and if it were nothing but oil and gas jobs, we don't need the migration we have plenty of people experienced in the oil and gas business here in TX or in our neighboring red states. and if it was Obama's stimulus creating jobs here, the stimulus would create the jobs in the Blue states where the bulk of the stimulus went anyway.

    Texas is growing because the private sector is thriving, unlike in the Blue states.
     
  5. DonGlock26

    DonGlock26 New Member Past Donor

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    Welcome to PF, new guy.


    _
     
  6. darckriver

    darckriver New Member Past Donor

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    I wonder what percentage of my own personal budget ends up in a Texas based oil company. I'm all for Texas and every other state prospering but when you're the home of OIL, the statistics can get a bit skewed.
     
  7. Kabuki Joe

    Kabuki Joe New Member

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    ...only 33 posts on this account, who's your alt account?...



    Kabuki Joe
     
  8. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    yep, welcome to PF newbie! :)
     
  9. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    glad to be here, thanks
     
  10. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    darckriver, I would worry less about paying for Texas oil and gas than paying for the oil and gas produced in the Persian Gulf.

    depending on where you live and drive, you gasoline budget is probably going into the hands of the Saudis or Chavez in Venezuela - if you have a natural gas heated home, you are probably purchasing some Texas, OK, and LA natural gas along with some Canadian.
     
  11. Buzz62

    Buzz62 New Member

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    You mean Ricky's NOT the second coming?
    Gee...we had better get his BF on the horn before he gets too excited about tonight's "double-dip" dinner party in the bathroom...lol

    We might wanna tell his wife to expect him home late tonight too...again...;)
     
  12. Trinnity

    Trinnity Banned

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    I like Texas and Texans have a unique Liberty loving spirit.
     
  13. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Wow, its all about blue and red is it? Interesting.

    so how do you explain that there texas only ranks 26th in employment? And 50th in per capita expenditures.

    Yes, he had nothing to do with the 16.8% increase in oil and gas jobs in the last YEAR alone.

    The fact remains that 97% of the budget shortfall in texas for 2009 and 2010 was "plugged" by federal stimulus funds.

    the fact also remains that some 45,000 jobs were created or maintained in the second quarter alone with stimulus funds as reported by Texas itself. (oh yeah the stimulus didn't work).

    Yep, there's perry railing against the federal government, condemning the stimulus program, and then as quitely as possible scooping $17.5 Billion and bailing his state out of a serious deficit.

    Of course he is looking at a estimated $15 to 27 Billion deficit in 2012-2013.

    http://sunshinereview.org/index.php/Texas_state_budget

    Looks like he's got the state exactly where he wants it.
     
  14. Buffalo Soldier

    Buffalo Soldier New Member

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    What's wrong with jobs below minimum wage? The cost of living is so much less than other states. An $8 an hour job for a college bound student is well worth it in Texas.

    The unemployment rate in Texas is 8.2% and the unemployment rate in New york and Massachussettes is 8% and 7.6% respectively. However, the unemployment rate in liberal states like California, Michigan and New Jersey are all above 10%. In addition, New York has alot more oppurtunity for jobs because it is the economic, cultural, consumer and political capital of the United States.

    Your point?

    Again, your point?


    Is this counting illegal immigrants? Because the top 4 states with high uninsurance rates are all populated with great numbers of illegal immigrants: California, Florida, New York, and Texas.

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2005-11-10-uninsured_x.htm

    Why should the American people have to pay for people that are stealing American jobs?

    Only revealing the stupidity of Obama's stimulus plan. Texas has since made major cuts to balance their deficit. I suggest other states do the same, unless they want to go bankrupt. New York, New Jersey and California are all on the verge.

    Please try to remember that Texas is the 2nd largest state in the U.S., and they receive much of their tax income from the oil industry. They have many more metalic and energy resources in that state that cannot be drilled due to State and Federal environmental policies. Many of the jobs came from government, manufacturing industries, retail jobs, etc. Healthcare jobs have increased by 12.6% under Perry as opposed to the United States avg of 6.2%. In addition, ratial jobs have increased by 1.7%, despite being down by 7.2% around the nation.

    Even with the major cuts to government, Texas still has many resources to create jobs if they are not impeded by environmentalist groups.


    He's not, but he's better than Obama. According to a Democrat poll, PPP, he is only losing to Obama by 4 points, with 14% of voters undecided. I think were all about to see some serious Republican contenders jump into the race over the next few weeks. Democrats should be worried by these numbers as the entire GOP field is splintered right now. What happens when the Republican Party selects their canidate? These disapproval numbers are worse than Bush and they have been consistent for two months.
     
  15. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    :) New fellow:

    you are trotting out statistics without sourcings, or context (current or historical).

    you see, when you just take talking points from the Obama support groups (all linked thru Daily Kos etc), you are just repeating what some twenty something nerd in the Obama campaign will think appeals to their leftist base.

    but these types of talking points fall on stoney ground when you are talking to the general population, esp to those who actually know Texas and its economy and government.

    I am happy to speak with you about the Texas record, but you have to get past the polemics, and look at the real Texas record, in order to get my serious attention.

    definitional point - I agree that blue and red are oversimplifications. but this has become accepted usable shorthand in discussing national politics over the past two decades. I am not going to try to reinvent the wheel - I will continue to refer to blue and red and sometimes purple states.
     
  16. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I realize I'm a new fellow, but I have grasped the concept of critical thinking and am not in the habit of blindly accepting what some 20 year old might think I want to hear.

    Excuse me for not providing more links. In future I shall endeavour to always provide links to my facts.


    http://www.npr.org/2011/08/17/139688463/texas-economy-growing-long-before-gov-rick-perry?ps=cprs

    http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/12/news/economy/perry_texas_jobs/

    http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/rick-newman/2011/08/16/rick-perrys-4-economic-vulnerabilities

    http://www.tnr.com/article/politics/magazine/90524/rick-perry-economy-gop-texas

    http://www.ontheissues.org/rick_perry.htm
     
  17. Buzz62

    Buzz62 New Member

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    Errr, are you trying to say that 550,000 jobs are only students? Gee I hope not 'cause that would make you...silly...

    NY is the political capital of the USA? Hey did we burn down the wrong White House?

    The point is...Texas cares more for oil companies than it does for its kids and their education. Perty simple thinkin' Tex...

    The point is...Texas cares more for oil companies than it does for the health and well being of its people. Perty simple thinkin' Tex.

    They shouldn't...and thank you for volunteering to go work as a hired hand for $3.00 an hour. Have fun...

    Oh boy...so because fruit is out in the open at a neighborhood market, means its OK to steal it, even if your principals say its not? Because Obama offered the money...its OK to take it even if your principals say its not?

    Principals? OOPS sorry...I forgot...

    So they SPENT government money to CREATE JOBS???

    Gee what a novel idea...hey maybe the federal government should try that...LOL

    Its all over for you guys and that pretty-boy Ricky.
    The more you guys talk...the worse it gets for ya.
     
  18. Piscivorous

    Piscivorous New Member

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    I'm sure you forgot to provide links.
     
  19. Roadvirus

    Roadvirus Well-Known Member

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    At least those people have a paying job, which is more then Obama has done for the rest of the country.


    Luring companies (with jobs) to Texas...BLASPHEMY! He should be scaring them off like California! Raise taxes and business fees, Perry!! How dare you try and create jobs for your state!
     
  20. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nothing like a huge underclass making minimum wage.




    I agree socialism is blasphemy to the right. Subsidizing industry with state money. can't get much more socialistic than that. But I guess its okay when it creates jobs.

    :razz:
     
  21. CarlB

    CarlB New Member

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    Actually it hasn't created nearly as many as it was supposed to, there was some controversy about that a few years ago.
     

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