The mentality of socialism versus capitalism

None of which are socialism. They are ALL products of capitalism, democracy, and free enterprise. Rich Govts who can fund the niceties.

 

It should be your issue, since you appear to hold a wholly delusional idea of what State socialism is.

And yes indeed, it most certainly IS a destroyer of freedoms. It's also horribly inequitable, unfair, unjust .. and medieval in its separation of the people into an underclass and an elite class.

 

I would suggest capitalism is the "work to eat" credo. Socialism is "we all work so we can all eat".
As I said, becoming the property owner and simultaneously by your definition, the overlord, you have become that which you sought to overturn.
Think about it .

 

Because socialism is defined as centralising of the profits (means of production) of various forms of profit making including stock markets, loans and interest paid and borrowing, and even wills and proprietaire ownership, the facile idea that each person toils individually in his owned means of production and then his excess is "socialised", seems dubious at best.

 

Indeed not.
Your love of owning property and seeking tenants does this...by your own admission.
My understanding of what marx wrote and what socialism has become is textbook, crank. Instead it is you who have a tortured misunderstanding of property ownership...deny it all you want, you own this property because you are a capitalist who sees doing so as having power. Directly contrary to Marxism. You have become part of the bourgeoisie.

 

I'm so pleased we have such an authority on socialism in our midst. Whatever would the rest of us do without such expert guidance?

 

Proof that you have no idea what you are talking about.
I have already addressed this in mentioning education, health, infrastructure, and most clearly, transport. France, Germany, Belgium and the Netherlands all provide STATE run transport.
Very good it is too. Paris to Lyon in just over 2 hours by TGV (train grand vitesse). We also have a basic state health service, schools, roads and most importantly, membership of the EU which unlocks some seriously good "stuff".

 

What makes you assume I am not an authority?

 

What makes you assume I was talking about you?

Feel free to list whatever credentials you may possess.

 

But once again you have declared yourself a socialist!
Socialism is about equality and rejects class as defined by property ownership...indeed your defence of private property is what creates inequalities. It is this which divides society into class and creates the open field of control and possibly oppression.
I would hate to think you are unjust and unfair even though you are a socialist.

 

Any good socialists should just give away everything they own and just trust in the common good of their fellow man to provide whatever they need in the moment they need it.

Put your money where your mouth is talk the talk and walk the walk

 

I suggest a good look through a text called Socialism for Dummies by Michael Engman. It is one of a huge range of books "for Dummies" which explain just about any subject you want to know about including pumping gas, I expect.

 

I'm sure you've been well educated by the entire series. Probably taught you almost every single thing you know

 

One or two have been a good start when I was in junior high school.

 

I think it's pretty funny how a handful of you around here think that I should somehow be ashamed that I work in a gas station.

During the height of the pandemic you liberals we're all about calling people like me heroes.

Because I take my ass to work and make my own living and I'm not hiding from a germ. I'm the guy people like you ask people like me to put air in their tire because they've never figured out how to do it for themselves. And I bet you wouldn't even tip a dollar. Does that guy make a book about how to check your tire pressure and put air in it for dummies?

It's people like me that enable people like you to stay home on your computer and lob little petty insults

You were in junior high when those books came out you must be pretty young

 

Lift your game, Pixie.

All collectivism is "work to eat". Each and every member must earn their keep .. so that there is no separation into workers and aristocrats (those who don't work). There is no such thing as 'we all work so we can all eat' other than at the point of a gun.

Meantime, our collective members are all 'common men', owning and inhabiting considerably less housing per head, than the average middle class Progressive (the isolationists you seem to be aligned to).

I don't think you're even aware that you demonise lower caste property owners like us, while carrying water for the corporatists buying out entire neighbourhoods ... rendering the lower castes powerless rent-slaves for life.

 

I am sure you have done a sterling job helping people through the pandemic.
Well done!
Now if you wish to continue the conversation can we get back to the subject?

 

None of what we in the West do is State socialism. If it was, you would know about it.

 

Oh FFS .. just own your errors, Dude. You've got it all horribly wrong, and you're only just finding out now. That's cool ... we're not going to condemn you for that. We all have to wake up some time (assuming we care enough to ask the hard questions).

Meantime, when did I EVER say I was opposed to a capitalist state?

 

It's hilarious to me, that grown adults in the 21stC still think socialism is free stuff and utopia. Not one of them has the slightest idea of what's actually involved in that level of 'equality'. They'd drop dead from shock if they had to live it for even 24hrs.

 

Then can you keep your snide little quips to yourself do you think you can manage that?

Don't ask me the question when you took the diversion.

But yes let's stick to the subject you think private property owners are somehow bad or greedy so why don't you put your money where your mouth is take whatever device you're communicating with here and give it to someone who does not have one and show us how much you abhor private property ownership

 

You now calling socialism (which you have previously called a type of collectivism) a work to eat system. But you have also said it supports those who don't work to eat.
You have also said that under capitalism one must work to eat because one operates as an individual. Which is it?
I remind you of jobs that only teamwork can achieve...working together do all can eat.
I don't demonise anyone. I have no value judgement in describing economic systems.
I am merely helping you to understand them too. You seem a tad confused.

 

The Govt is merely BUYING services they can AFFORD to buy. It's entirely a product of capitalism.

Please try and grasp what collectivism means, for all our sakes. It does NOT mean buying and selling labour, nor buying goods and services. It means producing what you need, and if you can't produce it you go without - because there is no SURPLUS (ie, profits) with which to buy the full range of things that capitalism can buy.

 

It's pretty freaking obvious, my friend.

 

I think private property owners are bad or greedy??
Where did I say that?
I merely gave them their correct name of capitalists and described what marx would have called them.