Trump indictment count, indictment charges & indictment points watch 2023

This thread is going to record the indictments chronologically, as they come in. Right now, former Pres. Trump has been indicted on criminal charges twice, one on the state level and now, as of this week, on the federal level.

Here is the first indictment, from NY, in 2 documents:

1.) Statement of facts:
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/23741892/donald-j-trump-sof.pdf

Indictment:
_indictment 4 4 2022 (thehill.com)

1 charge: FALSIFYING BUSINESS RECORDS IN THE FIRST DEGREE

34 counts on the same charge

April 2023

Brought forth by Alvin Bragg, District Attorney, New York County

I recommend that all download the documents and read them for yourselves.

 

Here is the second indictment:

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23839652-indictment

7 charges:
Willful retention of national defense information (counts 1-31)
Conspiracy to obstruct justice (count 32)
Withholding a document or record (count 33)
Corruptly concealing a document or record (count 34)
Concealing a document in a federal investigation (count 35)
Scheme to conceal (count 36)
False statements and representations (count 37)
False statements and representations (count 38 )

Although there are 7 charges, 8 specific laws are quoted at the beginning of the indictment and they are all part of 18 U.S.C.:



It should be noted that count 37 applies specifically to criminal defendant Trump, while count 38 applies specifically to criminal defendant Nauta. That is in and of itself a fascinating data point that literally no one in the media is talking about yet. I will be fascinated to see as to why Jack Smith broke up this rubrik and only this rubrik this way.

I should also be noted that count 33 (withholding a document of record) could quite literally have been over 10,000 separate counts. Jack Smith could have, should he wanted to do so, made a count for each and every document that Trump stole, lied about and withheld, The indictment also makes no big distinction between classified and unclassified documents. I suspect that he did not go this purely to save time in the process.

Just for the purpose of recording history, just less than 48 hours before the indictment was made known, Jack Smith let it leak that a secret grand jury had been empaneled in Florida. This should be instructive to all of us, for he may very well have one or two other secret grand juries empaneled in other states (New Jersey comes to mind immediately...)

I read the entire indictment twice. It is 49 pages long. Pages 46-47 enumerate the possible penalties for Trump if found guilty, pages 48-49 do likewise for Nauta.



Were he to be found guilty on all of the counts, criminal defendant Donald Trump could receive a maximum prison sentence of 100 years.

Special Counsel Jack Smith's signature to the indictment is on page 44 and Jay Bratt (Asst. Special Counsel) signed the certificate of trial attorney on page 45. It should be noted that they are estimating 21 days for each party at the trial from start to finish, with a general range of 21-60 days for a trial, all under the category of felony. This is important, because at a felony trial, if there is a finding of guilt, a minimum jail sentence must be in the works. Felony trials no not, I repeat, they do not result in probation sentences.

I strongly recommend that everyone read the indictment. There is no more fairy-tale land, no more "this and that and the other is just a hoax". This is real and this is happening.

Finally, President Joe Biden, our nation's duly elected 46th President, did not indict Trump, regardless what the pooflingers in Trumpworld are screaming. Rather, a grand jury of Trump's peers in his own state indicted him. Furthermore, the judicial is a branch of goverment SEPARATE from the executive and the legislative, a detail that Marjorie Taylor Green is just too stupid to know.

 

So, as of June 10th, 2023

Criminal indictment count: 2
Charges count: 8
Indictment count count: 34 + 38 = 72 indictment counts thus far.

The higher the number of indictment counts, the higher to statistical probability of being found guilty on at least one, probably many, of them.

 

That ex-navy aide did not give up the ghost or dissemination of the docs to the highest foreign bidder might also be on the list.

 

The day is yet young!

 

On a quick side-note, I see that Trump is once again lashing out against Jack Smith and his wife. What a truly pathetic, stupid little man. What a ****ing idiot.
Jack Smith can and will use all of this against Trump, and he should.

Threatening a federal prosecutor is in and of itself a crime and could be used to request that Trump go to jail to wait for his trial.

That will, unfortunately for a traumatized nation, probably not happen, but it could.

Just sayin'

 

Trump; “I’m the most innocent man in American history”

In other words; “I’m a living Angel”

 

I have a very strong feeling that I will be posting an update to this thread far earlier than I imagined possible.

Remember that Florida secret grand jury we heard about just 48 hours before the indictment dropped?

Take a look a map of the USA and tell me where Trump's Bedminster golf course is located and that is the state where we will very soon be hearing about yet another secret grand jury that has long been at work.....

I would not at all be surprised if another indictment very specific to Bedminster comes out in New Jersey within the next 6 weeks.

I don't know this for sure, but I have a very, very strong feeling about this in my gut.

And then there is Georgia (not federal, but rather, state).

And then there is also the secret grand jury empaneled in DC.

The summer of indictments is now upon us.

 

The 2nd indictment has been replaced with a superseding indictment that adds 3 more indictment points to the 38 (actually, for Trump only, it's 37), bringing the grand total to 75 indictment counts thus far 74 only for Trump.

Read Donald Trump’s new superseding indictment in classified documents case in full | The Independent

Read: Full text of superseding indictment in Trump classified documents case (msnbc.com)

It's about the Iran war plan that he boasted about and then lied and said that it was just "papers", but the DOJ has now proven that it was indeed the war plan.
Plus, he instructed underlings to delete the surveillance video data.

This brings us to an interesting situation. Because the superseding indictment adds 3 more points and is party about secret information, Trump's lawyers can demand that the trail be delayed and they may get their wish.

However, when the January 6th indictments come out very soon, there will be no secret/classified documents in the mix, which means that this case can actually go to trial earlier than the 1st federal indictment.

At the beginning of this thread, I have predicted 172 indictment points when all is said and done. With another federal indictment in DC and probably one out of New Jersey and then the Georgia indictment, it looks very much as if we are going to land right around 172 indictment points.

This is, in and of itselt, historic in a truly horrifying way.

 

They are allegations by Smith, not convictions.... they are a one sided presentation to a jury with no representation or cross examination...evidence that are exculpatory may be left out as no one would ever know the difference, such as Trump declassified the documents before he left office as the memo sits in the federal register and the fact it was decided in court in 2012 Trump decided what was personal and presidential records...

and yes.... fairy-tale land is exactly what it is...

 

Yeah, keep banking on that. The only fairy tale in this story is in your mind.

 

Prove me wrong... I have documents and you don't...

 

Is this a serious post? You actually have convinced yourself that if this trial ever gets on the way that Smith will not bring the goods? If so, keep the faith and pockets open...

 

I don't have to prove you wrong, you do it to yourself with every other post.

 

And where did these "documents" come from?

 

They are INDICTMENTS, do you know what that is?

 

Oh, this is just plain old sad.

 

Trump was just indicted vis-a-vis the 2020 election and January 6th.



The four counts:



This brings us to 79 indictment points.

 

http://www.politicalforum.com/index...st-trump-and-many-others-is-published.612793/

Separate thread for the Georgia indictment.

Trump is charged with 13 out of 41 indictment points.

This brings us to 92 indictment points total.

 

Here the court-listener link to the stolen docs case in southern Florida:

United States v. Trump, 9:23-cr-80101 – CourtListener.com

 

The J6 trial is set to begin on March 3rd, 2024, in circa 6 months.

 

A lot of things have happened on all fronts.

In Georgia, a number of defendants have placed motions to have their cases either separated from the rest of the rat-pack, or for a speedy trial, or to have the case moved from state court to federal court. Some are trying all three at once.

Since the rocket docket in GA is among the fastest in the nation, for those who have placed a motion for a speedy trial, it MUST start before the beginning of November. I think these people were hoping that Fani Willis would not be ready to try those cases this fast, but she is and has already proposed October 23rd, 2023 as the start date, which means jury selection will start in the next 7 weeks. The rub now is: will these cases be separated from each other or will either the state judge or possibly the federal judge rule that all 19 will be tried at once?

If Trump was hoping to get some respite by a venue change, his hopes are in vain.

1.) A president cannot pardon for crimes committed at the state level. He can only pardon for federal crimes, but if the case moves to federal court in N. Georgia, it will still be a state case, simply being tried in a federal court, and still with Fani Willis as the lead prosecutor. And in federal court, the judge can pick the jury himself, which means that jury selection generally goes faster than slower.

2.) And seriously, the judge in Fulton County is not even 40 years old, new on the bench and a member of the Federalist Society. He is a real conservative. However, he is no incompetent Eileen Cannon (Florida, Southern District). The federal judge for N. Georgia, however, is an Obama appointee and a seasoned judge.

I surmise that many of the 19 indicted individuals are testing out the good old "fling as much poo on the walls and see what sticks" method. And by doing so, they are making mistakes. Mark Meadows really stepped in major poo by VOLUNTARILY testifiying at his hearing to have his case moved to Federal Court, because Fani Willis grilled him for 2 hours and it is now apparent that he committed perjury and she caught him in the act. BTW, such frivolous actions can actually add up to a crime in and of themselves.

In S. Florida, judge Aileen Cannon, after watching Jim Trustee (a former Trump atty) speculate on FOX News that the continued existence of the DC secret grand jury was somehow illegal (is is not, she should have known better in the first place), she then placed a court order the very next day trying to help the one Trump co-defendant in nudging him to want to ask in writing if that with the DC jury was legal at all, also demanding a reponse from Jack Smith, also clearly stated she wanted nothing under seal. That was a gargantuan mistake. In doing so, she walked right into Smith's trap, for he already had a potential THIRD, possbly also a FOURTH co-defendant in the works, the third co-defendant first lied ot the DC Grand Jury back in March while said co-defendant was still being represented by a Trump atty but as soon as the dude got a target letter from Smith, he promptly ditched that atty, got a new one, went back to the DC grand jury, admitted to lying and then told the truth. This only supported Smith's claim that a Garcia hearing was necessary over at least one of Trump's attorneys but better yet, Smith was able to put all of that info out in public specifcally because Cannon was so stupid as to insist that there be no secret filings. AND from this, in response, the one Trump attorney who was in question also had to reply and has said that a Garcia hearing is no longer necessary as other clients have now dumped him (at least 3), which means that Smith has likely flipped another 3 potential witnesses in the Mar-a-Lago documents case. All of this would have been, in a normal world, within a sealed filing, but Cannon made this mistake all on her own and opened the door for Smith to sucker-punch Trump's defense team.

Funny thing: if you look at the docket now, since then she herself has allowed 3 secret filings, which means that she has taken her lumps and perhaps learned her lesson.

At also means that should more malfeasance come from Cannon, Smith has excellent cards in his hands to go to the appellate court and have her removed from the case.

But that is all probaby moot since in Washington DC, Judge Chutkin's Trial start-date of March 4th, 2024 stands firm, which means that in just less than one half year, Trump will be on trial all alone, with only 4 very, very heavy felony counts looking straight at him and no secret documents to have to sift through.

And in NY, where Trump's first indictment occured, that prosecutor is more than willing to take a back seat on the docket ot the federal cases, also to Georgia, but like Georgia, this is a STATE case. And this case alone can bring Trump (easily) 20 years in Sing-Sing.

It is entirely possible that Trump will be in jail for about a year before the Mar-a-Lago case starts... or it may get rocket-docketed.

Also a thought: the amount of money that is going to be necessary to maintain 4 defense teams just for the 4 criminal trials, not to speak of 3 or 4 civil proceedings against Trump, must be enormous. No wonder that he threw his own son Eric Trump under the bus in his NY deposition with Laetitia James in that civil case. And no wonder that he is unwilling to foot the bills for any of his 18 co-defendents in Georgia. Then again, the dude claimed to be a multi-billionaire, funding his own defense should be an easy task for him. Right?

So, forget the media circus, keep your eyes focused on the paper-flow in the court system. Keep your eyes on info deep within the filings that many in Team Trump are filing, because often they are burying the lede within the filing, for instance the practically hidden admission from Team Trump that at least 3 clients have jumped ship and now have independent representation. That is juristic-speak for: "we are sooo ****ed".

The first rule of criminal law is: if you are indicted, keep your mouth shut, for everything you say as of the point in time when you are indicted can and will be used against you in a court of law, it is all open and admissable. Also, everything your attorneys write on your behalf, should it be untrue, can and will be used against you. This is why an attorney is called a "mandate" for his client. He becomes the client's "voice" and everything that is submitted in writing from a legal team is - in the eyes of the court - as if it came directly from the defendant's mouth. That's how our legal system works, both on the federal and state level.

Trump's legal teams can try to sabotage the legal proceedings, but in doing so, that would be in and of itself a crime, not only for the defendant, but also for his attorneys.

The good guys are winning here, all over the chess board. And keep your eyes out for Arizona and Michigan, they may also indict a number of people vis-a-vis the 2020 elections, including one Donald J. Trump.

-Stat

 

Again, the court listener link to the D.C. trial:

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/67656604/united-states-v-trump/

 

From government sights... are you actually claiming the government is falsifying documents? Is that really where yo want to go with this?

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/DCPD-202100044/pdf/DCPD-202100044.pdf
https://www.federalregister.gov/doc...to-the-fbis-crossfire-hurricane-investigation
https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.go...lated-fbis-crossfire-hurricane-investigation/

 

And here are the government sites that show Trump declassified the documents...

https://www.federalregister.gov/doc...to-the-fbis-crossfire-hurricane-investigation

And here is the court decision by Judge Amy Jackson that sets the precedence that Trump is the one who determines what he deems his own records...
Judge Amy Jackson set the stage for Trump being able to decide what records are personal and presidential... yes her judgement stands... in black and white.. ya can't have it both ways..

The reason they doesn't prosecute presidents for mere possession of documents is....
This was decided already in 2012 ...
the judge ruled Clinton could keep any records he wants... so can Trump... Biden was only a VP
Jackson ruled in 2012 that a president's discretion to declare records "personal" is far-reaching and mostly unchallengeable.

https://justthenews.com/politics-po...-tapes-bill-clintons-sock-drawer-could-impact
https://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-co.../JW-v-NARA-Clinton-Tapes-transcript-01834.pdf
https://twitter.com/Rasmussen_Poll/status/1560234754292813827
https://case-law.vlex.com/vid/judicial-watch-inc-v-890793772
https://www.docketbird.com/court-do...-on-3-1-2012-lcabj2/dcd-1:2010-cv-01834-00013