Waiting for Superbatteries They are still a long way from matching the energy density of liquid fue

Tell that to the people of Florida whose EV wound up under water in the recent hurricane.

 

Yes, there are a lot of battery technology groups working to reduce or end the use of lithium and cobalt, extract lithium from seawater, etc.

EVs are not for rich people. It's just that the investment in manufacturing is huge, thus requiring a high price for products.

As manufacturing and other technology investments get paid off, as companies figure out how to build products people want, there will be lots of EV models competitively priced with today's common ICE cars.

Capitalism is amazing at making products available to a wide market. A 70" TV used to cost many thousands. Today, you can pay less than $500.

 

https://www.byd.com/eu/car/atto3 is one of several models. Read their specs.

 

Insurance companies write off cars that have been drowned like that.

 

"Some state governments"??? Wow. You aren't from around here are you?

And my comments about work have to do with knowing what work actually is apparently unlike you.

My current favorite automaker is Ford (well, it's always been since I grew up in Dearborn and started my career with them years ago) when you actually look at the way they are handling EVs. They've released 2 pretty nice and competitive ones but they have also resisted the political temptation to declare a move away from IC vehicles. Last I heard they're still committed to the 5.0L Coyote platform in light trucks. When the CEO was asked why he said because it's still in 40% of the light trucks they sell. Interestingly the most recent mileage standards from the government (the Federal one) is basically leaving light trucks alone. Even the EPA seems to realize that trucks still need to do work.

In addition, the Federal government tasked DOT with creating a CAFE program for medium and heavy duty trucks in 2009. It still doesn't exist, largely because it's an impossible technical conundrum. It's all detailed on the NHTSA website so you and your other "cite" demanding rubes can check it out.

You know, so you can apply some more investigation and thought.

 

Right. After they've spontaneously burst into flames in the garage.

 

The fundamental reason for that is that they had to respond to pressure from foreign manufacturers such as Toyota whose workmanship was much better, where lifetime was better, where gas mileage was more than US manufacturers stated was even possible, etc.

Remember that when US auto manufacturers were on the brink of failing, even a CEO stated that the reason was that they weren't watching what their customers wanted.

Now, these same companies are playing catch up to respond to the pressure of new manufacturers providing EVs that are quiet, faster, nonpolluting, clean in the garage, cheaper to fuel, and loaded with cool features.

Isn't that the same problem all over again?

And, why are they creating an electric Hummer? That car already failed once. Why are they creating an electric Corvette? Why are they creating more models than they can buy batteries to power?

Some of their entries get good reviews - the Lightening and Mustang for example. But ...

 

You're just dodging on your claims that government is forcing the EV direction. There is no statement that Ford can't build ICE trucks or anything else it wants to build. Also, they can build their vehicles in Mexico if they want. This is America, and they can do what they want.

I think I know why you need to resort to ad hom about me and work.

The EV movement is coming from people wanting EVs.

Also, do you really listen to Ford?

Didn't Ford just divide it's company in half, so the EV half could be less constrained by legacy decision making?

Their investment in EVs is gigantic - to the point of making some worry about the financial stability of the company.

They know where the automobile market is going. Just listen to them.

 

If you build a Pinto, you will be punished.

 

Which means that the rate of fires in ICE cars is around 100 times the fire rate of EV cars

 

I disagree we should be doing research in all different areas. Funding you should be prioritized to fusion.

 

Are the fires in gas-powered cars most commonly caused by electrical issues from the battery?

 

Evs will never hit a wider market because they're used value after the novelty where it's off will be very low. That's kind of like the used cell phone market. I doubt you would even be able to sell them to junk yards older models would be less desirable and therefore nobody would want components from them and you also have the hazardous waste of the battery.

There's an entire market that EVS are going to do terrible in and that's the used car market and now I think that's the point of EVs to eliminate that. So that travel via automobile is only for the wealthy.

I paid $8,500 for my car it was 7 years old when I bought it I've driven it for 7 years it has been cheaper in totality than any electric vehicles I could have bought. And I doubt many of them would last that long and have even half the range that they did when they were new remember every time you cycle a battery it loses life.

 

Lots of fires in all cars are caused by electrical problems. But the point is that rate of fires in ICE cars is around 100 times that of EV cars using the figures provided by a poster in this thread

 

decent EVs are for rich people. If you're the kind of person that buys a used car is in most people you can buy worthless worn out broken down useless Evs. But why would you pay more money for a less useful vehicle.

what the hell kind of BS is this. Electric vehicle acolytes and preachers have been going on and on and on and on and on about how they're simpler fewer moving parts. They should be cheaper to manufacture.

they won't be competitively priced because I can buy a 14-year-old vehicle for a couple thousand dollars that is infinitely more useful and cheaper over the next 50 years to operate.
[QUOTE[
Capitalism is amazing at making products available to a wide market. A 70" TV used to cost many thousands. Today, you can pay less than $500.[/QUOTE] but we aren't using capitalism are we. We're using government dictates. So many years old cars have to be electric and that's the only reason people are wasting money on this nonsense.

 

Why? I have no interest in EVs and I don't know anyone who does.

 

All cars are just new cars when we consider there's cars on the road that are 50 years old really making much of an argument.

 

Yes I listen to Ford. Yes, they just split a division off. That's easy to do but it doesn't say anything about their expectations. Shutting it down is also easy to do if the next big thing fails to materialize.

And of course the Federal government is trying to force EVs. Look up the details of the recent increases in mileage standards. The only way to get there is with plenty of EVs.

At least until WV v. EPA collapses the whole scheme (you can also look up how upset the government was at that. They clearly know what it means).

The line Ford is walking will make much more sense.

 

Could you rephrase that to make it understandable as I cannot see how that relates to my post

 

Today, EV batteries have a life of 15 to 20 years.

I don't believe cell phones are a good comparison, as they aren't the kind of investment that a car is. Plus, there is a market for refurbished cell phones.

I have NO doubt that you can get more use per dollar in buying an older ICE car. That has been long true in the ICE market. Plus, the savings probably outweighs issues of gasoline price.

Right now the used EV market is HOT, because there is a wait time for new EVs. Tesla owners have been able to sell their one or two year old EVs for almost what they paid for them new.

We'll have to see what happens as capitalism causes EV prices to go down and when demand isn't so crazy high.

 

EV's affected by a hurricane. And don't forget most vehicles in the ICE number are older than all the vehicles in the EV number.

 

You said there's more fires with internal combustion engine cars is it all cars are just new cars?

 

They are responding to government pressure. The EV models lower their fleet MPG numbers.

 

Don't forget most vehicles in the ICE number are older than all the vehicles in the EV number. And they're used in a much broadfer variety of roles.

 

Large flat screen TVs were hugely expensive when they first came out, too. People laughed at rich people buying big flat screen TVs.

I think you are grossly underestimating capitalism.
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The "fewer moving parts" argument probably has more to do with lower maintenance costs. There are all those moving parts in an ICE that just don't exist in an EV. Transmissions, pistons, camshafts, water pumps, differentials, etc., etc., etc. - none of that exists.

That is a limiting factor in the life of an average ICE, too. Those parts aren't cheap to replace like they once were.