What % really voted Brexit?

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by James7, Jun 27, 2016.

  1. lunecat

    lunecat Active Member

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    All I can see from your post, is future proof that Remainers are prepared to expoit the death of an MP from a constituency that did not reflect the views of that MP.

    This is why I believe the constituency of Batley & Spen should be fought by several political parties & not just given on a plate to yet another pro-EU undemocractic shoe-in MP.

    Nothing shameful about democracy!


    Although I have now become to know that pro-EU Remainers are very anti-democratic that wish to overturn the BIGGEST mandate in the history of Britain.
     
  2. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Traitors, fifth-columnists, the enemy inside - I despise them all for their intent to destroy this country and its traditions and customs.
     
  3. diamond lil

    diamond lil Well-Known Member

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    He's not so called. he actually is an expert in the EU.

    Britain is a sovereign state. The EU is not a sovereign state.

    I pointed out how bald figures mean nothing.
     
  4. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    [​IMG] Do I detect a bit of backing down in that post DL? :mrgreen:
     
  5. diamond lil

    diamond lil Well-Known Member

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    Se won the vote. She was their MP.

    That will happen eventually

    There is something a lot shameful in using the death of an innocent woman as some sort of proof for your argument.

    No remainer forced that man to do it. No remainer forced that man to use that name.


    Nonsense. You'd refuse to allow it - even though many people who voted to leave have realised they were taken in by the leave campaign's lies.

    Lies told on an industrial scale. Lie, after lie, after lie.

    You're still trying to claim Britain isn't a sovereign state.

    That is undemocratic.
     
  6. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Get real, diamond lil.

    "Every lie, every distortion, every piece of scaremongering from the EU Remain camp is aimed at one thing: to overturn the result of a free and fair referendum of the British people on our membership of the European Union. These scoundrels will stop at nothing, as we saw during the campaign itself. And if, in order to smash the will of the people, they have to whip up such a frenzy that there is an outbreak of xenophobia and even racism, their attitude is this: so be it."

    http://www.thecommentator.com/article/6362/lying_remain_camp_responsible_for_eruption_of_racism
     
  7. diamond lil

    diamond lil Well-Known Member

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    No

    So let us start with a couple of myths. The first is the myth of sovereignty, there is no doubt whatsoever that the United Kingdom is a sovereign state under international law. There is no doubt whatsoever that the parliament in Westminster is the supreme law making authority in this country.


    Professor Dougan goes on :

    Conversely there is no doubt whatsoever that the EU is not a sovereign entity, far from being a sovereign state, it is not even a sovereign entity, it has only those powers which has been given under the EU treaties. If the UK courts sometimes give priority to EU law in the event of a conflict with domestic law, it is purely because our parliament has expressly instructed them to do so in our own legislation.


    And finally:

    So why do we keep hearing about sovereignty in this debate? The fact is that sovereignty is not really an issue in the debate, it is about power and influence and sovereignty is being used as a shorthand to talk about power and influence.

    The fact is that membership of any international organization, whether it is the UN, NATO, the EU, any international organization involves a trade off.

    You agree to certain obligations in return for the opportunity to exercise greater influence in practice.


    And there you are. So, if lunecat voted to leave because he thought Britain had lost sovereignty, he was wrong.

    Maybe he wouldn't, but plenty of other people would like another chance to vote
     
  8. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, loony lefties and anarchists, anyone who makes a living from the EU, and youngsters who couldn't be bothered to vote the first time around! :roll:
     
  9. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

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    38% of the electoral register voted not. Brits who lived longer than 15 years outside of Great Britain had no right to vote. Also children had not right to vote. Out of such data a German here calculated that only 25% of the population of all Brits (+Scots+Irish+Welsh+...) in total voted for the Brexit. And this was the older part of the british society. The younger part has to live much longer with this decision. The relation I read here somewhere is 16:69. This squares the problem.

    And as far as I can see you are an American. It's completly clear that the USA will not help Great Britain or Little England in case they get problems with their own decision. For example is this project now dead forever: The bourse of Frankfurt and London liked to build a common european center in London. But a european center outside of the European Union makes no sense. What will the USA do now to help the financial metropolis London to grow? ... Nothing? ... Less than nothing? ...

    https://youtu.be/kA3howSRjuw
     
  10. cerberus

    cerberus Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm English - see my flag at top right-hand corner of my posts.
     
  11. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

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    A problem in the perspective here. I don't see this point of the screen. Does England still pay money for the use of this flag to Genoa? As far as I read that's where your flag came from.

    https://youtu.be/az7eJSTB_PA
     
  12. Abandon

    Abandon Member

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    So you polled a non-representative sample of people and got non-representative results. This is strange how?
     
  13. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    It will do the same thing Frankfurt and all the other rival cities have been trying to do all along.
    Take out the competition.
    And though it will have much more success in this than all the EU cities combined, it will fail just like everyone else does. We have been the world leaders in this in spite of all your combined efforts to thwart us thus far. We will continue to be.

    How weak you must feel, in your own mind, that you cannot imagine going it alone and being fine. That you feel the need to have someone prop you up.

    You will be just fine without us.
     
  14. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

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    What will "you" continue to be? Who is "you"? As far as I know the decision was clear that London will become the center of the european bourses. But now London is not any longer a part of European Union so all plans are changing. Universities here for example need often 3-5 years lead time for international projects. No one will make now a new project with british universities. This means british universities will lose in some years about 10-15% of their earnings and they will win more isolation and less communication. The European Union is an organisation with lots of little steps.

    As far as I can see the people who propagated the Brexit in England - with very emotional "not"-arguments ala "The past was always good, so why do we need future?" - are people who are not able to take responsibility. They made the mess and feel now happy not to take care for the future of Great Britain any longer. So it seems to me everyone has to be "fine without you" - specially the people who live on this big Island in the Northwest of Europe.
     
  15. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This the sort of thing you are after?

    https://www.theguardian.com/educati...projects-because-of-post-brexit-funding-fears
     
  16. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    I was referring to the rival countries/cities of the world trying to take London's banking business from it.
    It's an old old story I've been hearing about daily for the last 45 years.

    Lots of pretenders for this crown.


    I teach at Cambridge.
    Nothing to fear from Brexit here.
    Quite the opposite. Our courses and investments all just got 10% cheaper. We are raking it in now.
     
  17. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    I am Baff. Pleased to meet you.
    I will continue to be me, I guess.
    I was refering to London being one of (if not, the) biggest financial capital of the world.
    This will continue.
    The European market is sideshow to this act. Only a small part of it... and ultimately it has never been covered by the EU agreement. London (the financial centre) wasn't in the EU single market to start with. The EU is quite simply irrelevant to it's success.


    I'm sorry to hear you won't be partnering with any of our universities for your research project.
    That is a pity for you. Not necessarily for us however since we have a long long queue of applicants.
    The numbers of students applying for my course at Cambridge this summer unexpectedly doubled within 3 days of Brexit. (Woot!)


    Certainly Brexit was a highly emotional issue.
    A lot of really smart people were really mad about being forced into the EU against their will and interests.
    I appreciate you are not willing to look at things from their perspective.
    But I am, since I am one of them.
    They had good reason to be emotional. It sucked very deeply and was being forced on them to their disadvantage and to their dislike. If you wish to dismiss their anger or reasons, that is your affair. Our politicians tried to for 30 years. And then we started killing them.


    British people are perfectly at liberty to co-operate with the European Union or indeed any persons from the European Union. They may even choose to abide by EU laws if they so wish. It's a free country.
    What they are unable to do is to force everyone else to abide by EU laws. Not they they didn't try as hard as they could to make this happen.
    But this is Britain, not Germany. It doesn't work like that here.

    We have an entirely different social mechanic.
     
  18. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

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    NSA? Ideological think-tank?

     
  19. Anobsitar

    Anobsitar Banned

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    Strange.

    You guess you will continue to be you? Whatelse should you be?

    Good.

    Indeed.

    Fine.

    Not here. As far as I can see the most people here are not unhappy about that Great Britain left the European Union - but they are also not happy about.

    No one ever was forced to become a member of the EU against the own will.

    I don't have any idea why you seem to think you know only a little what I think.

    You killed whom?

    Isn't it not a little simple minded to bring the very complex problems of the European Union with so many different nations to the formula EU=Germany=evil? Whatever. If this was the reason for "your" decision then it was the reason. But this has absolutelly nothing to do with Germany or Germans. It has to do with your way to think about problems.

    https://youtu.be/Wbjz3BUu8NY
     
  20. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Really, I am trying to imagine what. How to clean phones perhaps? As you have boasted you teach at Cambridge how about telling us what you teach and where you teach.

    I too am interested in who it is you talk about having killed in a later post and who the we is you identify with in doing this killing.
     
  21. BillRM

    BillRM Well-Known Member

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    My personal bet is that in less then five years, as the results of leaving the EU hit home, that no one will admitted to voting for Brexit.

    Interesting to watch the old mother country walk off the fiscal cliff for no sane reason.
     
  22. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here is an interesting study on the people who voted Brexit. You cannot know who voted Brexit from their wealth or job but you can tell who is likely to have voted Brexit by whether they are in favour of the Death Penalty and Corporal Punishment for criminals.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b07lq12w/panorama-trumps-angry-america

    Brexit voters are our authoritarians it appears

    same link.

    I know when looking at what made people move towards Trump that also was people who were authoritarian but as well as those who are always authoritarian there was another group who if all was going well would be able to take a bit of freedom and liberal values. However they found with the US that a set of things had come together to make the white working class very afraid - that was because they were soon not to be the majority and have the advantages that brings, along with fear about even being able to get a job never mind no longer being able to count on an increasing standard of living coupled by fear of terrorism. That study found that authoritarian personality's tended to feel fear much more than their more liberal counter parts. They really felt the fear and as such were looking for a strong leader and prepared to give up on normal liberal values - for instance to punish those who did not agree with them even with death - for this reason they saw Putin as someone really to admire - including how he dealt with his opposition.

    I
     
  23. Cheddar

    Cheddar Member

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    And your point is?
     
  24. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The point was made. Sorry you cannot understand it. Possibly if you read again you will. Perhaps it is above your understanding. Given that you are new I would not know.
     
  25. Cheddar

    Cheddar Member

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    I didn't ask what THE point was; I asked what YOUR point was - meaning your point in posting what you did. Sorry you couldn't understand the difference. Perhaps it is above your understanding. Given that I am 'new' (whatever that means) I wouldn't know.
    However, to help you out, I am guessing that you wanted to illustrate some mental or intellectual failings that you perceive to be the domain of 'Brexiteers' and you saw the 'study' as some sort of evidence to support your bigotry. Of course, I could be totally wrong. No doubt you also went looking for (as someone 'old' - as against my 'new') a similar 'study' on people who voted 'remain'. Or perhaps your mentality didn't allow you to?
     

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