Would you support torture in certain situations in prison

anyone who kills 12 innocents for no reason clearly isnt a human

 

Can't let emotion dictate law.

 

Not saying they don't. It's absurd to put a person in prison for ten years for parking fines. It's absurd to give a person who's been convicted of murder ten years. What's the criteria for choosing sentences? It's not because of some vague ambitions of vengeance, or because we don't want to deter parking fines. If we wanted to perfectly deter parking fines we could make the penalty life in prison and I guarantee you we would see next to no parking infringements. Why not? Because the purpose of law is to directly protect society from criminals, not to have a big societal circle jerk over torture and revenge. That's why the US has things like the 8th Amendment, I suggest you give it a read sometime.

I don't care if it would deter people from doing it in the future, you can't violate the rights of one man (and the constitution) just for vague, unproven benefits to society. Your rights don't disappear the second you're alleged to have committed a crime. People are willing to go to prison for the rest of their lives. I would take a bullet to the head a million times over prison, let alone torture in prison. All your obviously totalitarian (and profoundly evil) plan would do is make these people off themselves after the shooting.

If you go on a mass shooting you are accepting that your life is over, either through the quick revenge of a bullet to the head, or the slow death sentence that is prison. I don't see how forcing people to shoot themselves would deter anything. I guess it would save on some prison costs, but that's about it.

Rights and freedoms evidently quite difficult concepts to grasp.

My response to this is the 8th amendment, nothing more:

In fact, this can serve as the response to pretty much your entire thread, without any elaboration necessary. That's a sad fact.

Also, "high profile" prisoners aren't necessarily separated. Prisoners in danger are separated. Prison shouldn't be a place where you go to be raped and stabbed with sharpened toothbrushes while the guards stand by. Trust me, solitary is significantly worse than being in the general population.



I'm not going to say that you're not a "real" American or patriot or whatever, because that's a silly standard. I will however say that if I had to pick the person who has misunderstood freedom, rights, liberty, and the constitution of the United States the most... I would probably pick you. Sorry.

 

Sort of sad when your blood lust has gotten to such a point that we can throw back pro-life cartoons at you :/

 

wrong. extensive testing has found no genetic link that correlates to criminal activity. Therefore there is nothing to support a mass murderer being a distinct species other than Human.

 

Best you start at the top, and work your way down.

Who has murdered more innocents than anyone, since the end of WW2, as policy?

The US Gov.

The US Gov are not human.

Actually, know what...I think you are on to something.

 

Aim high then, and go after those that call themselves 'representive gov'.

 

what? how long should they get according to you, 2 years? 1 year? 30 days? are their freedoms being infringed on? wtf is this man.

well then your not part of the solution are you?

well. i believe you have it all wrong. you defend criminals and evil people in every thread.... WBC, terrorists, criminals even mass murderers. i cant call you a real patriot. more like someone who clings on to the constitution like a baby monkey clings on to their mother.

at some point in time you have to realize that the world has COMPLETELY changed. advances in medicine, the role of mass media in someone's life, how advanced our weapons have become, even how people act and live. its completely changed. at some point in time you will have to realize that the constitution is just a 200+ year old piece of paper. and while it was and still is amazing and we all owe our freedom to it.... doesnt mean we have to follow every little sentence thats in there.

 

Part of patriotism is defending the constitution.

 

of course defend the constitution. but that doesnt mean we cant modify/update the constitution to be better for the times.

 

Since when does torture become a sign of modern times? Last I checked it was a barbarism of the middle ages.

 

Along with the minds of the sick who are 'tempted' by it...

 

Merry Christmas! May you all be tortured by your extended families.

 

is it legitimate torture if you pay for it?

 

Ask a dominatrix.

 

i'll tell you this. if i shoot up a school full of 7 year olds or shoot at an innocent movie theature crowd and kill 12 innocent lives i 100% give you the right to torture me for the rest of my life

 

everytime i try, they stick a ball gag in mah mouth.

 

That's not up to me. I wouldn't have a clue. The law doesn't just conjure up sentences based on how severe crimes are, that's why we have the parole system: to allow a way out for people who have been rehabilitated, regardless of whether people such as yourself have gotten sufficient revenge.

If by "solution" you mean getting a mob together and inflicting as much pain on people as is possible until our blood lust is satisfied then no, I guess I'm not. I'm for the protection of individuals from other individuals. How do you do this? Well if someone goes on a killing spree you go through this incredibly complicated and difficult process: separating them from society, likely permanently. Society no longer in danger.

This person isn't responsible for the will of others. The entire nationwide shooting rate isn't his fault, he is responsible for his crimes. Group punishment is wrong, and that's basically what using deterrence as a goal of law does: it punishes individuals for group actions. For statistics.

I'm so sorry for wanting government to follow the constitution and only use powers authorized under.. you know, higher law. That's sort of the entire purpose of a higher law system: to set rules of conduct for states. Throw away the constitution and you literally have tyranny.

Additionally, I defend criminals where such a defense is justified. Having such a black and white view of criminality hurts you as a person. I'm pretty sure it's obvious to everyone else in this thread that your intense hatred of criminals has made you completely insane on this issue, and drives you to profoundly evil positions.

I defend criminals where people try to take their freedoms away unjustly. Freedom of speech in the case of the WBC, and the freedom from cruel and unusual punishment guaranteed in the 8th Amendment in the case of mass murderers.

That's almost worth putting in my sig. No, it is worth putting in my sig.

Of course we have to follow every sentence in there. That's the one and only point of higher law. If you think the constitution is wrong then fine, get together a public action group and lobby Congress to amend it as you see fit. If you can't do this then the public does not agree with you. Sorry.

Also... We've advanced far in the past 200 years and your inference from this is that we need to torture people. Such a statement would be hilarious if you weren't serious. But I guess this is what happens when you get your morality from a clearly flawed ancient book.

Cool, but the United States as a country didn't. In fact, they explicitly said that they didn't in the 8th amendment.

 

By all means do so.. The constitution already has a system for amending it build right in!

 

What does purpose does torture serve, if not satisfy the sadistic fantasies of the OP?

 

The purpose of debasing society, destroying the credibility of the justice system, all dignity, humanity, all semblance of decency, respect for basic human rights, any expectation of being treated like a human being should anyone fall into captivity elsewhere....how many reasons are required for the OP to realise it's completely unacceptable for society to support torture. Because the reasons are virtually endless.

If we produce serial killers and horrible criminals when society is trying to publicly do the right thing...what kind of killer will appear when society publicly participates in torture...

 

All of this. Very well said.

Careful though, what they like to do is give torture another name, a more benign sounding one. They literally create a new name for it. Then they pretend that certain things do not qualify as 'torture', but they are.

It reminds me of those people that beat the crap out of their partner, then invent a new frame of reference so that they convince themselves that they are not really just someone that is beating the crap out of their partner.

 

Check out his posts. He is a ultra-nationalist fascist. He just doesn't realize it yet.

 

He may be, he may not be.

He is not really the dangerous one.

The really dangerous one's are those who pass themselves off as your politicians etc. Because they (and their shadows behind them), are those that began to adopt this filth as policy.

Now, if the OP is a ultra-nationalist fascist for asking the question, what does it make those that do not ask the question to anyone, they just do it...in the name of...what..?

 

The embodiment of evil.